Offshore Ginger
New member
:beatdeadhorse5: I guess with everything said you just might be fighting a loosing battle . :bump:
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V vs Cat question.....
- Thread starter Seafordguy
- Start date
MikeyFIN
Competitor
Sean
And with all do respect to everyone.. I don't need to "watch" the races. I did them in both type of boats. And no.. I can't run with a cat in the same size as my Avanti,, at least not at the same speed. Like I said.. the cats are faster. However.. most races you won't see 5 -6's. In fact.. most boaters don't even know what a 5' wave is anyway. (They can look at a wave diagram, if they ar realy curious, crest to trough.)
That being said... the cat is really a "V" split and spread. The half "V" won't hit the water the same time, therfore you actually get more bumps. But again.. most cats are sit downs and "V" are stand up bolster, so even the "feel" is different. IN a "V you "higher" up and thus THERE is more motion, even if the ride may be actually smoother.
But Sean.. I bet a years salary, that your cat will and a similar size Nortech "V", that the "V" will have less up and down motion at the same speed. We can get an indipendant observer see the gyroscope read outs, at same speeds and same seas. (or I can get Terry Sobo from NT send you the older results)
No need to argue. I think it boils down to prference,
Cats are faster,, "V" will hande seas better.
In the Balde runner run in Europe.. I have not seen any cats. (Could be wrong, but all I seen are "V") Those seas are not 5-6's.. more like 15-16's.
Well at the poker runs I wouldn´t be surprised...
MikeyFinn>>>> Get my point.
No need to argue but why are the raceboats Always faster as cats in any conditions and have been the last 25 yrs almost constantly.
Just ask any racer that has had to race against cats.
Like I said Mick.. most races are not in some serious seas.
I have nothing against cats. In a 32- 40 or so.. I want more comfort and room. I want a bed that I can have some fun.
Unless you get to the bigger cats.. the cuddy is virtually nonexistent. So again... it's preference.
The problem with this old debate is that whom ever asking the question won't get an honest objective answer. They get the the owners bias preferences.
IE. KW. AquaMan fliped in calm seas. OL fliped during the race in relatively light seas. It's preference. If I want speed, I get a cat. If I want room to have some "extra curricular activity" I'll get a "V" with a cuddy.
My sex needs is stronger (so far) then the "need for speed", so let's leave it at that.:leaving:
Bikes vs cars Vee´s vs Cats.... whatever.
I still say a CAT wins but that´s my opinion.
I still like a big V but if I would be after speed only a CAT... no matter what the seas are and it´s mostly up to the driver not the equipment how hard you can run.
And I happen to Race REAL offshore over here not these sprint races called offshore over there.
Ok so the last race I had was in Clearwater with a nice Vee but the aftermath is I still prefer the one in my avatar or something close when it comes to racing and U.I.M. thank you.
And about the Aqua-Mania flip..Daredevil saw it, I was just next to him and we were the first ones to see the footage showed to us by Loren Morrisey.
It happened at about 80mph and had nothing to do with what we are talking about.
Team Tsunami
New member
There's was no Outerlimits that flipped in key west this year! Not sure where you got your info from?? An Outerlimits with the power can run with a cat in big and calm water but the cat is the way to go! I have a 34 Sutphen and a 35 Motion cat. The Motion runs better in any type of water period! Stainless knows what im talkin about!! The cat will out turn the Vee as well as ride. We boat in rough water too, no river or lake stuff for us!!
Team Tsunami
New member
GENERAL LEE
Founding Member - E Dock
Exactly. My 368 will walk any Top Gun or similar in the rough, as well as bigger vee's than that.
The oooooold original cat designs, couldn't run with the Vee's in the rough as well back in the day. Those days have long sense been improved on, and cats of equal size & power are better performers than Vee's of the same size & setup, as well as bigger ones.
Before anyone thinks I'm disrespecting their beloved Top Gun or similar sized/powered Vee, I'm not. I've had both a straight bottom Gun, and a Top Gun TS in the past. The TS was a 100% better performing boat than the straight bottom, and the cat is a 100% better performing boat than my TS was.
It simply is what it is, and not a knock on anything at all in the process. Today's cats are just the ultimate offshore machine all the way around. Vee's definitely have their place, and I do love a tricked out Cigarette of ANY size VERY much. :cheers2:
GENERAL LEE
Founding Member - E Dock
Please understands this it TOTALLY non personal whatsoever, please? :cheers2:
I will take that bet:
My pleasure 368 Skater vs. a pleasure 36 Nortech Vee with #6 drives & around 900-1000hp, at an event that's reasonable for me to attend? I ran a similar "bet" in Chicago 2007, and other than a BIG 46 Skater, we lead considerably throughout the entire run, in 4-6ft wave on average, with a field containing a few 46, 51, and MANY 40+ OL's, Cigarettes, Hustlers, & Nortechs.
The days of Team Apache keeping up with Seahawk, or the other "prototype" high performance cats, have just long since been eclipsed. It absolutely does NOT make a big, burly Vee ANY less bad ass, fun to own, and especially fun to drive! :iagree:
stainless
New member
I think you just won a years salary there B Lee! :cheers2:
2112
Founding Member / Contributor
stainless
New member
When the 40 skater came out! :sifone:
GENERAL LEE
Founding Member - E Dock
Well, before I say anything, anyone reading should know that I do not consider myself a construction expert at all, when discussing different build techniques/materials/etc. Any of my words are based on what I've paid attention to over the years, from different builders that have really earned their respect by winning championships, & the majority.
That said, many cats in that era WERE simply vees cut down the middle to make a cat. They weren't very efficient as a result, and had inconsistent lift, balance, & stability, without many more of the advancements of todays cat. Advancements such as step placement, angle of attack, sponson & tunnel depth/width, even tweaks to the splash guards within the sponson design, can make a difference that's noticeable by comparison.
Those older cats were also made from some really archaic materials, on top of some being built on "educated guesses" regarding layup schedules, center of gravity balancing, & engine placement. As the "rumors or facts" have gone, many of the classic famous Apaches were vastly different in weight & balance from one another, while being the same "size & setup" as one that "looks" identical.
Today's cats are just incredible. I never ruled out being a cat guy, but I didn't really see it being a serious consideration down the road. I was TOTALLY, "that guy" who honestly believed cats were for smooth conditions, while vees ruled the rough. I can't BELIEVE how changed I was, after a great/lucky seasons' worth of rides in every major brand of cat, in all sizes I'd be interested in.
I personally chose Skater as the boat I'd like to own, and I couldn't be happier with my decision on not only the brand, but the size & power I ended up with. My 368 keeps the race car feel, while easily tackling ANY water I can throw at it, or that I'd see myself boating in. Anything the boat can't handle, are days that I wouldn't be boating anyway, no matter WHAT kind of boat I'm in!
A "real" offshore cat, built by one of the few quality builders, is tough to beat in all conditions. When it comes to efficient, comfortable, fast, and most importantly FUN, it's tough to beat a nice cat! :cheers2:
MikeyFIN
Competitor
Well you told you saw it, remember or where you referencing to the pics ?
Anyway, not an issue we´re discussing here as it´s just offtopic.
MikeyFIN
Competitor
Exactly.
MikeyFIN
Competitor
Even back in the day...which one would´ve you taken as a 41 footer... A alu Cougar cat or an Apache ?
After all the Apaches had their days like 5 yrs before the Cougar Cats sweeped the prizeboards allover the world
I´m not beating A´s in any respect but like always time goldens the memories...
Even Benny himself in the end chose Cats and Don Aronow.
.38Special
New member
I would have to agree that a Cat would walk a V no matter what the size comparison (38cat-38V 40cat-40V etc). A poker run we do in the big water of lake michigan proves this to me over and over. We had big power 47 Apaches, 51OL 43 Nortechs etc...which are all supposed to be "wave crushers" yet a 368 skater that started behind them went blazing by everyone in 5-7's. Then we do other runs in the playground we call Lake St. Clair where you would be lucky to see a 3' wave and the Cats flat out kill everybody, so as stated earlier the Cats really are the ultimate offshore machine. Now if you are going for ammenities, cabin, etc... that is a different story, but just ride quality in big water I say hands down a Cat wins. If I could sell my boat, I would buy one in a minute.
glh
Charter Member
I have had a Cafe;
And a couple Tigers one with XR's and one with #6's;
And I now have a MTI 42;
I can only provide what I have experienced on each of these model by putting at least 60 hours of running on all of them in many various conditions...
Your question was "handle 2-3 ftrs at cruising speed"... Well 2-3's with all these boats are no problems at all for all these boats. You difference will be your cruising speed...
The Cafe I had had 502 MAG MPI's at 425 HP each and topped at 68 cruising around 60 MPH. The ride was great and in those waves it will run at whatever you can with the power you would have in a Cafe.
Both Tigers ran a little smoother than the Cafe but marginally in 2-3's as you asked, the cruising speeds were higher around 72mph for the XR boat (top 82) and 88-90 on the #6 boat (top 98)
The MTI cruising in 2'to3's is like sitting on your couch watching football on Sunday afternoon and cruising is around 100-105 mph (top 140... for now!)
I hope this helps you in your research, I 'll add a couple videos under here if you care to spend the time looking...
GL
Hello again Mr. Darr. Goodbye again Mr. Darr.:seeya::seeya::seeya:
Please seek professional help. You need it.:smash:
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