39 Gladiator Accident Texas

[catastrophe]

Friend just left message that 6 people ejected from CIG during PR in Texas.
Anyone hear of this?

[Ratickle]

Onlu thing I've found so far....


http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3448590/Re_Ray_Hubbard_Accident

[catastrophe]

Buddy just called back.. someone turned sharp 5 min into run..
barrel rolled it

[Ratickle]

Workin on it....


http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Six-Thrown-From-Boat-During-Charity-Event.html

[Ratickle]

Still searching

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30661835/


That's it. Looks like no deaths, don't know anything else right now.

[JupiterSunsation]

39 Top Gun w/ 1075's..... Driver error according to OSO

[Tank]

So was it a 39 top gun or a 36 gladiator?

Anyone have pics of the boat?

[Wrinkleface]

hope all R ok!

[MacGyver]

Sounds like bruises and broken bones :(

Photo and news video:
http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/latestnews/stories/wfaa090509_lj_boat.c5a39a0.html

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

. Driver error according to OSO


It is always driver error

[catastrophe]

So was it a 39 top gun or a 36 gladiator?

Anyone have pics of the boat?

39 Gladiator??????

Sorry I should have known better. Only excuse I got is I'm a Nortech guy.

[MacGyver]

It is always driver error

Witnesses said it was his second time out with the boat :(

[Scarab KV]

Drives up in a high speed turn:huh:

[Team Tsunami]

It was the 39 Gun with 1075's that blume sold recently. Not a Gladiator!!

[catastrophe]

All passengers business clients attending charity PR.

[Cash Bar]

I think that was the very first 39/1075 combo.

[MacGyver]

All passengers business clients attending charity PR.

I hope none of them were lawyers :leaving:

[catastrophe]

Dont know about yours but mine floats.

[niceguy]

WOW, just wow!!!

[sellsman11]

Not good....not good at all.:(:(

[DollaBill]

I think that was the very first 39/1075 combo.

Was that the boat "we" had in Laud 2 yrs ago?

[Slandrew]

1075'S Was the driver new to the boat Cig with that power is not really a starter boat??Any injurys or damage?

[Slandrew]

Turn @ 100+ mph lucky no one was killed guy said he was passed by Cigerette while he was going 85 so 100 good estimate.

[lucky strike]

it is always driver error

yep.

[stecz20]

which boat is it??

[lucky strike]

Bloom sold it within the last year to the guy who traded the Gladiator with the Sterlings in it. Grand Sport Center sold it new.

[BobbyB]

I am hope all are ok. I pray for a quick recovery for them.

[Sean Stinson]

Drives up in a high speed turn:huh:

Well technically you need to trim a step boat out during a turn otherwise the step will act as a pivot point and throw your a$$ in the drink!!!!

[stecz20]

Well technically you need to trim a step boat out during a turn otherwise the step will act as a pivot point and throw your a$$ in the drink!!!!

you're the first person ive ever heard say that...

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Well technically you need to trim a step boat out during a turn otherwise the step will act as a pivot point and throw your a$$ in the drink!!!!

The ones I have run you leave the trim where you run it going straight. The days of trimming in to turn are over.

[lucky strike]

Well technically you need to trim a step boat out during a turn otherwise the step will act as a pivot point and throw your a$$ in the drink!!!!

The voice of experience 4 sure.

[BobbyB]

They said my boat was trimmed out in my accident and i was like thats what you do with a stepped boat boat and they didnt understand that.

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Tres or Brad will confirm you do not trim them in to turn.

[DollaBill]

you're the first person ive ever heard say that...

lol

[lucky strike]

lol

He is a funny guy !

[JnT]

It can happen fast. I experienced my first spin out in a Fountain last weekend. Operator has many hours of seat time. We were pushing it hard but the actual spin caught us all by surprise.

[Sean Stinson]

The voice of experience 4 sure.

Been there done that have the pictures and t-shirt to prove it!!!

[Marginmn]

It can happen fast. I experienced my first spin out in a Fountain last weekend. Operator has many hours of seat time. We were pushing it hard but the actual spin caught us all by surprise.

Can you give us some details on what model and year of boat, drives, ect, and on where he went wrong?

[Sean Stinson]

The ones I have run you leave the trim where you run it going straight. The days of trimming in to turn are over.

I will debate that with you....I have tried it every which way possible.....I have slid them around a bit leaving it that way so I actually try to lift the step out just a bit but again the trim isnt the whole equation you still have to drive it....not point it but drive it and drive the balls off of it!!!! It responds well when you drive the balls off of it!!!!

[lucky strike]

It responds well when you drive the balls off of it!!!!

F-2 Cigs are fun...You have to let it know you are the boss.

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Sean, I suppose every boat has its preference. I do think we can agree don't trim in.

[Expensive Date]

Tres or Brad will confirm you do not trim them in to turn.

Martin Sanborn will also confirm stepped hulls should be turned with neutral trim.Martin taught me how to run a boat right and for that I am thankful

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Martin and I raced together in '98, '99 and once '03

[Tank]

Three pages into this and we still dont know which Cig this was?? Photo?? Anyone got a photo??

[Expensive Date]

Martin and I raced together in '98, '99 and once '03

I know Matco used to sponsor those boats thats how I met him

[Expensive Date]

Three pages into this and we still dont know which Cig this was?? Photo?? Anyone got a photo??http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/latestnews/stories/wfaa090509_lj_boat.c5a39a0.html

[Tank]

E.D.,

I meant a before photo....Is this the boat? Is it the "Skaterette"?

[Scarab KV]

Well technically you need to trim a step boat out during a turn otherwise the step will act as a pivot point and throw your a$$ in the drink!!!!

My bad. Wasn't thinking of a stepped hull.

[redhotsommer]

Tank- If what I'm reading is correct, it isn't the Skaterette, but the TG owned by the same dude that had the E-type built. Name on the boat here in Chicago was "Wern Dog," bought new from Grand Sport by Mike Wern. I think he only had it a year before commissioning the Skater/Cig. I'll post pics when I get to work.

Glad to here the injuries were not of the fatal variety this time...

[redhotsommer]

Here ya go....

[Ratickle]

Nice boat.....

Any new info on the extent of injuries? Some good news would be nice.

[Sean Stinson]

sean, i suppose every boat has its preference. I do think we can agree don't trim in.

absolutely

[Tres]

www.performanceboatschool.com its all you need to upright and safe. These boat will make you pay,,,,, More than you would for my course. Several accidents are poppping up and its just the beginning of the year. Kiss your insurance and boating freedom goodbye soon. Get educated guys, before we all pay. And for those of you that have been though our course, Thanks a bunch!

[Audiofn]

Amen

[Sean Stinson]

www.performanceboatschool.com its all you need to upright and safe. These boat will make you pay,,,,, More than you would for my course. Several accidents are poppping up and its just the beginning of the year. Kiss your insurance and boating freedom goodbye soon. Get educated guys, before we all pay. And for those of you that have been though our course, Thanks a bunch!

Hey Tres

How are the horses treating you these days?? Hope all is well talk with you sometime!!!!

Sean

[JupiterSunsation]

Three pages into this and we still dont know which Cig this was?? Photo?? Anyone got a photo??

Page one indicated:

1. 39 TG w/ 1075's
2. 2nd time out on the boat for the owner
3. Blume just sold a boat fitting the description recently to a guy in Texas taking back the Gladiator with Sterlings in trade.


How many yellow 39 TG's with 1075's are out there? You should have been able to figure it out, you are the west coast Cig expert! :sifone:

[BLAZE]

http://i42.tinypic.com/35j9te8.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/20u4vwl.jpg

[Magic Medicine]

Sorry to hear this, hope everyone involved is OK. Is it me or do we hear quite quite a few Cigs rolling lately???

[Ratickle]

Sorry to hear this, hope everyone involved is OK. Is it me or do we hear quite quite a few Cigs rolling lately???

I don't think it's been any particular manufacturer. Seems to usually be a turn, in a stepped boat, with usually minimal experience in a hull of that design with high horsepower. Different beasts to drive if you're used to no step.

And really, it does not seem to be that many for the number of high performance boats that are out there now. It's just big news because we are always concerned.

[scandelous]

I am hope all are ok. I pray for a quick recovery for them.

Your right Bobby. Thats an event non of us want to re-live.

[X-Rated30]

you're the first person ive ever heard say that...

We are talking powerboats, not sailbotes... Stick with what you know. :ack2:

[nomomoney]

Guys we were there when it happened. As everyone is saying,the driver just turned too sharp going too fast. The boat spun out and then rolled. Everyone on board was thrown. There was 10 boats on scene as soon as it happened and people were pulled out quickly. No life threatening injuries. A few broken bones,everyone is very lucky. Here is a few pics we took.

[Ratickle]

Guys we were there when it happened. No life threatening injuries. A few broken bones,everyone is very lucky.

Thank you. Good to know.....

[Mike A.]

Why would anyone feel the need to turn a boat hard at speed unless in a race?

Mike A.

[Sea-Dated]

Glad everyone will recover. Sad to hear about nonetheless..

[Magic Medicine]

Guys we were there when it happened. As everyone is saying,the driver just turned too sharp going too fast. The boat spun out and then rolled. Everyone on board was thrown. There was 10 boats on scene as soon as it happened and people were pulled out quickly. No life threatening injuries. A few broken bones,everyone is very lucky. Here is a few pics we took.

those pics make me sick to my stomach

[Geronimo36]

Good thing they're all ok.

damn shame about the boat... :(

[Tank]

Page one indicated:

1. 39 TG w/ 1075's
2. 2nd time out on the boat for the owner
3. Blume just sold a boat fitting the description recently to a guy in Texas taking back the Gladiator with Sterlings in trade.


How many yellow 39 TG's with 1075's are out there? You should have been able to figure it out, you are the west coast Cig expert! :sifone:

I have too much useless Cig information banging around up there. It gets jumbled at times:sifone:

[JupiterSunsation]

I have too much useless Cig information banging around up there. It gets jumbled at times:sifone:


Thought you may have been losing your mind...........:cheers2:

[Big Time]

Why would anyone feel the need to turn a boat hard at speed unless in a race?

Mike A.

I never make a hard turn in my boat....its a big ocean, no need for it. I usually have 3-4 guests on my boat who trust that I know what I am doing. I know the techniques used to set up for and execute a turn at speed, but I'm not looking to use those techniques if I don't need to, especially with people in the boat.

I hate to hear about these accidents but they always serve as a reminder to excercise caution. If anything can be taken away from this, it is that; BE CAREFUL!

[BobbyB]

Has anyone heard how everyone is doing?

[Chris]

I never make a hard turn in my boat....its a big ocean, no need for it. I usually have 3-4 guests on my boat who trust that I know what I am doing. I know the techniques used to set up for and execute a turn at speed, but I'm not looking to use those techniques if I don't need to, especially with people in the boat.

I hate to hear about these accidents but they always serve as a reminder to excercise caution. If anything can be taken away from this, it is that; BE CAREFUL!

It doesn't necessarily have to be a hard turn or even high speed. There was that incident last year where the guy rolled at about 35 in an easy turn- If I remember he had his mother or grandmother on board.

People got used to very neutral handling boats over many years. Steps are a different game. A guy really has two choices, learn by experimentation what works and what doesn't, or get some instruction. The first one is sort of like learning to box by booking money matches with a ranked heavyweight.

[Sean Stinson]

I never make a hard turn in my boat....its a big ocean, no need for it. I usually have 3-4 guests on my boat who trust that I know what I am doing. I know the techniques used to set up for and execute a turn at speed, but I'm not looking to use those techniques if I don't need to, especially with people in the boat.

I hate to hear about these accidents but they always serve as a reminder to excercise caution. If anything can be taken away from this, it is that; BE CAREFUL!

I have made a couple of hard turns in my life....most were while racing and a couple were dodging debris in the water....all I have to say is that a couple while racing didn't work out quite the way they were supposed to!!!!

[Ratickle]

It doesn't necessarily have to be a hard turn or even high speed. There was that incident last year where the guy rolled at about 35 in an easy turn- If I remember he had his mother or grandmother on board.

People got used to very neutral handling boats over many years. Steps are a different game. A guy really has two choices, learn by experimentation what works and what doesn't, or get some instruction. The first one is sort of like learning to box by booking money matches with a ranked heavyweight.

You just brought up something I hadn't thought of.

In an emergency move situation, idiots on jet skis with suicidal tendencies, I've done very hard turns at cruise speeds in almost every boat I've ever owned. Except the stepped BT.

[Mike A.]

I have made a couple of hard turns in my life....most were while racing and a couple were dodging debris in the water....all I have to say is that a couple while racing didn't work out quite the way they were supposed to!!!!

I had a couple of those myself. Eeew.:ack2:

[Geronimo36]

It doesn't necessarily have to be a hard turn or even high speed. There was that incident last year where the guy rolled at about 35 in an easy turn- If I remember he had his mother or grandmother on board.

People got used to very neutral handling boats over many years. Steps are a different game. A guy really has two choices, learn by experimentation what works and what doesn't, or get some instruction. The first one is sort of like learning to box by booking money matches with a ranked heavyweight.

Yeah, like the russian ghost boat! :ack2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qG5-Go1HH7Q

[Chris]

God that hurts to watch.

[Ratickle]

The first one is sort of like learning to box by booking money matches with a ranked heavyweight.

I remember the last time Stecz tried that.....:sifone:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K6lNNw0Kq3k

[Sean Stinson]

I had a couple of those myself. Eeew.:ack2:

I remember one time you guys went for a little afternoon dip!!!!

[JupiterSunsation]

Seems Cigarettes have one of the more aggressive designs that are less forgiving when a mistake is made. They are leading the V bottom spin record so far.

The Nortechs have trouble to but they seem to entrap too much air only when on the trailers. They are leading the "kissing asphalt" category in both the V bottom and Cat class.

[Jassman]

www.performanceboatschool.com its all you need to upright and safe. These boat will make you pay,,,,, More than you would for my course. Several accidents are poppping up and its just the beginning of the year. Kiss your insurance and boating freedom goodbye soon. Get educated guys, before we all pay. And for those of you that have been though our course, Thanks a bunch!


I keep pushing on these threads the validity of taking the course...Even for you stuffy old codgers:) you can always learn something..I did..and with the Tres Martin Lanyard..I always remember to wear it and be more attentive, especially in our area, no boating etiquette. Jeff

[BRAD SCHOENWALD]

Tres or Brad will confirm you do not trim them in to turn.

First off I am very glad the injuries we not worse. I did receive phone calls from the assisting boat crews immediately following the incident and applaud the efforts of all the good Samaritans who came to the aid of the injured.

In regard to boat operation, safety, risk, and our future I am very alarmed. All too often these discussions whether on the dock, in the bar, or even worse on an internet forum speak to absolutes. Trim in, trim out, trim out while you’re turning, stay neutral etc, etc.

In reality there are few if any absolutes in regard to settings. While the absolute of marking neutral while on the trailer is such, the net is affected by load, speed, weather, etc.

Additionally, if a boat becomes upset or something changes after the boat is properly set for a turn the instinctual human behavioral response is almost always the absolute wrong thing to do. I strongly caution anyone to attempt to believe or operate your craft without having an understanding of why and what. What makes a step work or to be affective, why are weight changes so critical aboard, why does the inboard RPM spike or kick up in a turn. Why do some boats go slower or become less efficient with more H.P. Why is high pressure and low pressure a big deal.
Here is again the reality. Boating safety as commonly referred is only a prescribed list of safety gear used as a responsive mechanism. The mitigation or reduction of risk is achieved by applying goal based initiatives or criteria to lesson exposure. This is achieved by providing education, followed by training, followed by experience. Think of it this way; If you play football the hard work is during practice and game day should be easy. Seat time as commonly referred too as experience is only exposure unless you have education and training.

Accidents never just happen. Accident is only vocabulary for intent. Incidents occur and in every single instance human factors are considered to be primary causal or a root cause. Speed is rarely if ever a root cause, speed merely dictates the severity of damage or injury.

I am also very discouraged and disappointed our industry has not taken a harder position to properly support REAL safety initiatives. While I understand the dollar drives the decision I truly believe the view is way too myopic.
Next week I will be in Genoa at the Fincantieri yard conducting the final inspection on a new cruise ship. Working in depth with an industry which by percentage spends volumes on safety compared to recreational boating. Sure its millions but on a billion dollar ship with declining revenue, these guys understand if they want to be around tomorrow they have to plan today and implement the plan for tomorrow because it means nothing without action. If the performance boat industry would just stand up and demonstrate some of the same type of leadership and responsible stewardship of the industry we just might be able to have a future. We might be able to get better insurance rates, we might be able to set precedence to ward off frivolous law suits, and we might be able to stop or derail tomb stone legislation that does not provide any value.
Leadership and responsible action costs nothing really. I wear my lifeline on my slow ass boat. I wont support a poker run if a race boat shows up. I don’t care if it has small blocks in it, this sends the wrong message. Some of the biggest organizers out there still shotgun start boats and use flags. I still feel like we have to be masters of the obvious and it is really getting tiresome.
Anyway, Stay Safe… I didn’t mean to get off on a rant but this just kept coming. See you all in Jacksonville and then down here at our SIB Offshore Race with the Bimini Ocean Race. Doing a second event at Texoma early August and then back to Emerald Coast.

Put it in get it wet and go FAST!!!

[Tank]

Next week I will be in Genoa at the Fincantieri yard conducting the final inspection on a new cruise ship.

Pics please!!:sifone::sifone:

Hope all is well Brad.

[BRAD SCHOENWALD]

Pics please!!:sifone::sifone:

Hope all is well Brad.

Tank,

Thanks All is well! I am still sliding sidewazes and refuseing to lift. I sure could use some SoCal time though, I would kill for a few day alone hideing out in the south bay, I really miss my little house in Redondo.

Pics>>> No ****ing way. I do not have the time and will just burn it all to my brain. B

[kurts111699]

Help,Just got 2009 38 zr with the 700s took the boat out and alarm 3beeps every min.The code says BLK,PSI,CKT,LO.......will not stop the same motor port side i dont know what to do.

[phragle]

I have made a couple of hard turns in my life....most were while racing and a couple were dodging debris in the water....all I have to say is that a couple while racing didn't work out quite the way they were supposed to!!!!


Job security :sifone:

[Slandrew]

Help,Just got 2009 38 zr with the 700s took the boat out and alarm 3beeps every min.The code says BLK,PSI,CKT,LO.......will not stop the same motor port side i dont know what to do.
Check your fluids!:seeya:

[AIR TIME]

Help,Just got 2009 38 zr with the 700s took the boat out and alarm 3beeps every min.The code says BLK,PSI,CKT,LO.......will not stop the same motor port side i dont know what to do.

bring it back to the dealer, they will now what codes are. thats your best bet, and check your fluids.

[DollaBill]

Help,Just got 2009 38 zr with the 700s took the boat out and alarm 3beeps every min.The code says BLK,PSI,CKT,LO.......will not stop the same motor port side i dont know what to do.

If you can hang on til about 4 oclock I'll tell you what the codes are

[Hammer01]

Sad to see this happen. It was an awesome boat. Mike Wern as stated had it custom built with the 1075's and 6's and even had AC/Heat with a diesel generator added for his family. Great people to boat with. It was in Powerboat Magazine a few years back with a top speed of 117 mph I believe. I know Mark and several of the Grandsport Center guys ran it the first year with the Wern's in the CPC run and gave it all it wanted. Great pics that Sommer put of it were also in the CPC video. Too bad!!!!!

[redhotsommer]

Damn! Trent found this place...time to find a new site everyone! :)

[Tank]

Tank,

Thanks All is well! I am still sliding sidewazes and refuseing to lift. I sure could use some SoCal time though, I would kill for a few day alone hideing out in the south bay, I really miss my little house in Redondo.

Pics>>> No ****ing way. I do not have the time and will just burn it all to my brain. B

You know you have a place to stay with us anytime. 1 hr north of redondo.:sifone:

Who's cruise line is the new ship going to?

[MarylandMark]

Excellent post Brad and thank you for your time to write it out!!

117MPH? 12-14MPH gain over the 700's- sweet!

[Divenstar]

Excellent post Brad and thank you for your time to write it out!!

117MPH? 12-14MPH gain over the 700's- sweet!

I agree!!!

My thoughts exactly...

A very informative and much needed post...

I am making it a point to take their class...

Divenstar

[JupiterSunsation]

Excellent post Brad and thank you for your time to write it out!!

117MPH? 12-14MPH gain over the 700's- sweet!

Yeah but I saw a post on OSO that said you had to have brass balls to run it over 110. I will save my 1075 money for the over 45 ft boats.....

A 39/700 boat is the perfect combo of size/speed/cost

[DollaBill]

Yeah but I saw a post on OSO that said you had to have brass balls to run it over 110. I will save my 1075 money for the over 45 ft boats.....

A 39/700 boat is the perfect combo of size/speed/cost

The brass balls part is true.

[DollaBill]

BTW.... great post Brad. Hope to see you soon buddy

[Cookee]

Well technically you need to trim a step boat out during a turn otherwise the step will act as a pivot point and throw your a$$ in the drink!!!!

I build and race stepped hull O/B boats in the UK, and it I agree it is critical to NOT trim in on the turns, but another thing that I haven't seen mention of is not to get out of the throttle mid turn either, this can also transfer the weight onto the front steps and cause a spin - even at slower speeds.

[Ratickle]

I build and race stepped hull O/B boats in the UK, and it I agree it is critical to NOT trim in on the turns, but another thing that I haven't seen mention of is not to get out of the throttle mid turn either, this can also transfer the weight onto the front steps and cause a spin - even at slower speeds.

You need to start a thread about your most memorable race or record attempt. With pics of course.....

http://www.bananasharkracing.co.uk/news/index.htm

[Cookee]

You need to start a thread about your most memorable race or record attempt. With pics of course.....

http://www.bananasharkracing.co.uk/news/index.htm

I can't really compete with the big boats like the Cigarette discussed here, but we still manage to have some good racing and high speeds with smaller engines over here - I'm afraid I'm getting married this weekend and going off to Mauritius on honeymoon for two weeks so I'm a little otherwise occupied right now - besides a lot of it you have found already!

[Ratickle]

I can't really compete with the big boats like the Cigarette discussed here, but we still manage to have some good racing and high speeds with smaller engines over here - I'm afraid I'm getting married this weekend and going off to Mauritius on honeymoon for two weeks so I'm a little otherwise occupied right now - besides a lot of it you have found already!

That'll give you something to think about on your honeymoon......



Have a great time, we will want stories and pictures when you get back.....

[Hammer01]

Damn! Trent found this place...time to find a new site everyone! :)

Just go back to your bend over and grab your ankles mountain biking while wearing a rainbow coalition president shirt site of choice and I will never have to run into you!!!!!!!!!! hahahahaha :26:

[DollaBill]

my bad re: the balls post about the boats handling. I thought that was the 38 with the 1100 (?) Cobras. THAT WAS A HANDFULL LOL

[JupiterSunsation]

my bad re: the balls post about the boats handling. I thought that was the 38 with the 1100 (?) Cobras. THAT WAS A HANDFULL LOL

That was a 38 non stagger, this was a 39 partial stagger so that would make the difference.

[DollaBill]

That was a 38 non stagger, this was a 39 partial stagger so that would make the difference.

Yes, I know it was at ASG's house in Lauderdale for a little. Needed some testing ;)

[TxHawk]

Yeah but I saw a post on OSO that said you had to have brass balls to run it over 110.

Not sure about that. I ran it once at 119. It was on rails! I have a couple videos of it somewhere at 110+ on board. It was MUCH better than a certain 42 Fountain at the same speed.:lurk5:

[Slandrew]

Not sure about that. I ran it once at 119. It was on rails! I have a couple videos of it somewhere at 110+ on board. It was MUCH better than a certain 42 Fountain at the same speed.:lurk5:

Here we go:lurk5:Spin out survey who spins out more??:rofl:

[TxHawk]

Here we go:lurk5:Spin out survey who spins out more??:rofl:

Im not trying to do that, just stating experience.