Warpath!

[MarylandMark]

I saw it in Puerto Rico a few years back, I had on outfit made with the same art work!

pics.... :biggrinjester:

[lucy]

:)..

[DAREDEVIL]

:)..

I don't know who that sexy lady is in this pic,,,but Lucy would u introduce me to her ??!!:drool5::kiss:

[stecz20]

I don't know who that sexy lady is in this pic,,,but Lucy would u introduce me to her ??!!:drool5::kiss:

you better watch you dont get a fresh one boy!!!!!!!:03::03:

[DAREDEVIL]

you better watch you dont get a fresh one boy!!!!!!!:03::03:

????:lurk5::seeya:

[lucy]

name?

[xlr8by]

name?

Fatal Attraction I saw boat in Somer's Point NJ before. BTW the boat is a 36 for those that are unsure. Not sure if it still in the NJ, PA, DE area?
PS Lucy rename the photo next time to make it harder ;)

[lucy]

Oh yeah silly me!!:blush5: any way while I am waiting for my plane to South America, I thought of a question I like to ask all of you.
I like to hear your individual reason for being interested or attractive to the Apache Power Boats? all opinions are welcome!:)

[DAREDEVIL]

Oh yeah silly me!!:blush5: any way while I am waiting for my plane to South America, I thought of a question I like to ask all of you.
I like to hear your individual reason for being interested or attractive to the Apache Power Boats? all opinions are welcome!:)

BECAUSE OF APACHE LUCY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:sifone:

[Ratickle]

The greatest pass in the history of offshore performance on video.....:sifone:

Can crank it up and watch it over and over.......:) :26: :)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pDV7vHF2G4&feature=related

[Geronimo36]

I like to hear your individual reason for being interested or attractive to the Apache Power Boats? all opinions are welcome!:)

Lucy, I had a few reasons that pushed me towards the tribe.

1. Ride comfort for my wife was first priority. ;) The wife hated the ride of the Scarab Panther and didn't like ocean runs. The last season I ran it and if we were running the ocean, she would opt to stay home...:( So in the quest for finding the right boat, I had to get something that was seaworthy and Apache fits the bill. I also looked at Top Guns but really wanted an Apache. ;)

2. History; As a little kid the story behind Apache was so compelling I wanted to join the tribe.

3. Looks: I love the lines on Apache's and Cigarette's. Always have my whole life.

4. Space, I'm 5'11" and I wanted to have a roomy cabin for overnighting and at the time, a future family which is what we have now. Headroom is what ultimately turned me away from Top Guns, I don't like to "bend over"....:leaving::rofl:

5. Trailerability; I didn't want to go 41' because trailering is more difficult and I would need a much larger vehicle so the 36's was a great compromise.

That's pretty much my honest reasoning.

[fund razor]

Lake Erie had been kicking my azz all my life and I wanted to kick back. :D

[cashbrain]

Oh yeah silly me!!:blush5: any way while I am waiting for my plane to South America, I thought of a question I like to ask all of you.
I like to hear your individual reason for being interested or attractive to the Apache Power Boats? all opinions are welcome!:)


Cause I could buy the company...:sifone:

[MikeyFIN]

Don Aronow heritage, Bobby Saccentis involvement.
Too much Zane Grey books as a kid, my favourite being the Wildfire...

And finally looking at pics and clips of Apaches you, Lucy

XXX from over here.

[MikeyFIN]

:)..


Hmmm your first cousin or some other from the Same Tribe ???:sifone:

[MikeyFIN]

you better watch you dont get a fresh one boy!!!!!!!:03::03:

I always knew from your posts this would turn up someday.... :dupe:

[xlr8by]

Oh yeah silly me!!:blush5: any way while I am waiting for my plane to South America, I thought of a question I like to ask all of you.
I like to hear your individual reason for being interested or attractive to the Apache Power Boats? all opinions are welcome!:)

I have always been into vintage cars and tracking the history of them especially Ferrari's, which the vintage cars have a huge cult following. I have been a boating fan forever, and with only 75 41' the number isn't so huge that it is too difficult to remember and keep track of the histories. I have a file where I keep all the information on each boat (done by name this does not include EVERY 41' but about half the boats) and a couple pics that I have taken from the internet over the years. I was under agreement to buy a 41' almost 2 years ago, the deal fell through, and I am glad today that it did, as I would really have to stretch right now if I owned it. Also, the other thing I like is that all of the boats were unique and different! I am still trying to figure out why they changed the exhaust placement from above to below the transom? Not to mention Gail's paint work is awesome, and the rough water heritage :)

[MarylandMark]

The #1 reason I like Apache threads is the drama...

That and the old race stories when racing was racing and lines meant some thing other than what you tied your boat to the dock with.

[MattBMiller]

The #1 reason I like Apache threads is the drama...

That and the old race stories when racing was racing and lines meant some thing other than what you tied your boat to the dock with.

:sifone:

[DAREDEVIL]

I am still trying to figure out why they changed the exhaust placement from above to below the transom? Not to mention Gail's paint work is awesome, and the rough water heritage :)

A little side note,,,the reason ,(or 1 of them) to change the exhaust was becasue some costumers wanted a swimplatform ( i hate them ).
So by changing that it was alot esyer to sell them to pleasure boaters since otherwie its above the platform.
U can easaly change it back if u want, since the tailpipes are bend down on the thru transom type ,,just get a straight one ,cut new holes and fill the transom holes. DONE

It had nothing to do with angle or such . JUST MARKETING !!!

[ChiefApache]

When I met my husband, I knew nothing about boats as I was not a boater before meeting him almost 7 years ago.

He talked about Apaches all the time even though he owned a 312 Stinger. I can recall him saying that before he died he wanted to own an Apache. He would speak of the rough water, he loves the lines in the boat, he's a true V-bottom type guy, the history, etc.

We brought our Apache home 2 years ago on this day. Everyday that Rob wakes up, he still can't believe he owns an Apache. It is truly a great rough water boat and well, then there's the Apache "talk." :biggrinjester:

[xlr8by]

A little side note,,,the reason ,(or 1 of them) to change the exhaust was becasue some costumers wanted a swimplatform ( i hate them ).
So by changing that it was alot esyer to sell them to pleasure boaters since otherwie its above the platform.
U can easaly change it back if u want, since the tailpipes are bend down on the thru transom type ,,just get a straight one ,cut new holes and fill the transom holes. DONE

It had nothing to do with angle or such . JUST MARKETING !!!

That is the first time i have heard anything that makes any sense about moving them!! :). I also hate swim platforms, and just love the high mounted exhaust, thanks for the info...

[xlr8by]

What was this 41' before it was firewater? (It is currently a 6 man boat and painted silver)

[DAREDEVIL]

What was this 41' before it was firewater? (It is currently a 6 man boat and painted silver)

I tought it was always firewater >>>> and why would they change it to a 6 pack ??
Are u shure that boat is silver now ????

mmhhhhh,i liked it the way on the picture.

[Toasty]

was one of kramers back up yellow boats. was the head dress hull
made 3-4 back up yellow hulls another was pred, and star chaser...now u know... a little more... it was not always firewater, stotler and oliver made that boat what it is / was today. Herb knows his stuff

[DAREDEVIL]

was one of kramers back up yellow boats. was the head dress hull
made 3-4 back up yellow hulls another was pred, and star chaser...now u know... a little more... it was not always firewater, stotler and oliver made that boat what it is / was today. Herb knows his stuff

Cool,,thanks

[xlr8by]

I tought it was always firewater >>>> and why would they change it to a 6 pack ??
Are u shure that boat is silver now ????

mmhhhhh,i liked it the way on the picture.

I believe this is the same boat... http://www.stotlerracing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=46&Itemid=116

[Smarty]

Lucy, I had a few reasons that pushed me towards the tribe.

1. Ride comfort for my wife was first priority. ;) The wife hated the ride of the Scarab Panther and didn't like ocean runs. The last season I ran it and if we were running the ocean, she would opt to stay home...:( So in the quest for finding the right boat, I had to get something that was seaworthy and Apache fits the bill. I also looked at Top Guns but really wanted an Apache. ;)

2. History; As a little kid the story behind Apache was so compelling I wanted to join the tribe.

3. Looks: I love the lines on Apache's and Cigarette's. Always have my whole life.

4. Space, I'm 5'11" and I wanted to have a roomy cabin for overnighting and at the time, a future family which is what we have now. Headroom is what ultimately turned me away from Top Guns, I don't like to "bend over"....:leaving::rofl:

5. Trailerability; I didn't want to go 41' because trailering is more difficult and I would need a much larger vehicle so the 36's was a great compromise.

That's pretty much my honest reasoning.

Reason number one is compelling. I hear ya...

[xlr8by]

was one of kramers back up yellow boats. was the head dress hull
made 3-4 back up yellow hulls another was pred, and star chaser...now u know... a little more... it was not always firewater, stotler and oliver made that boat what it is / was today. Herb knows his stuff

Correct!! :) I also am 100% with you about Stotler and Oliver, both those men know Apache's :). I still like the 47' firewater which has Stotler power. Feel free to post questions in this thread and keep it going!

[Ratickle]

Reason number one is compelling. I hear ya...

Yep, as I'm constantly reminded. A happy wife is a good thing.....:sifone:

[Offshoredrillin]

I believe this is the same boat... http://www.stotlerracing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=46&Itemid=116
correct and before that is was either the apache bandit, or apache trader...I'm leaning towards trader.

[xlr8by]

correct and before that is was either the apache bandit, or apache trader...I'm leaning towards trader.

I believe it was trader, as there is no way it is apache bandit. This is due to the fact that Apache Bandit was previously the Team Apache Banner boat and was raced as Apache Bandit with Kurt of Bandit Motors.

[Nykamp]

I bought mine for the ride, I loved my 36, it was great for trips. But the ride of a 41 is amazing. We rode in Parn's old 41 Saber in huge waves on winter day, and came home and put our 36 for sale. I would still love a 36 for summer trips, or a 28, maybe someday. I built my shop to fit a 47 but i don't think I'll go there.

[Ratickle]

I bought mine for the ride, I loved my 36, it was great for trips. But the ride of a 41 is amazing. We rode in Parn's old 41 Saber in huge waves on winter day, and came home and put our 36 for sale. I would still love a 36 for summer trips, or a 28, maybe someday. I built my shop to fit a 47 but i don't think I'll go there.

Bout time you chimed in. You're boat is still the best Apache blow by ever recorded....:sifone: :26: :sifone:

[Hannibal41]

toasty has it right
i was there i saw them all being built
Stotler and keith hazel knew more about rigging well then anybody
and manny, kramer, Toth, kerbeck, oliver etc could pay for it back then
olivers 41 with 6s went.

[Sean Stinson]

I bought mine for the ride, I loved my 36, it was great for trips. But the ride of a 41 is amazing. We rode in Parn's old 41 Saber in huge waves on winter day, and came home and put our 36 for sale. I would still love a 36 for summer trips, or a 28, maybe someday. I built my shop to fit a 47 but i don't think I'll go there.

I believe I was along for that ride wasn't I bro.....

[Sean Stinson]

I believe it was trader, as there is no way it is apache bandit. This is due to the fact that Apache Bandit was previously the Team Apache Banner boat and was raced as Apache Bandit with Kurt of Bandit Motors.

The banner boat is now Warpaint and was, if not still, owned by Bob Vesper from Hammonton, NJ

[Offshoredrillin]

toasty has it right
i was there i saw them all being built
Stotler and keith hazel knew more about rigging well then anybody
and manny, kramer, Toth, kerbeck, oliver etc could pay for it back then
olivers 41 with 6s went.
Dont Leave John Pompei out of that little rigging loop.

[Sean Stinson]

Dont Leave John Pompei out of that little rigging loop.

and how

[xlr8by]

The banner boat is now Warpaint and was, if not still, owned by Bob Vesper from Hammonton, NJ

That is correct for today for the whereabouts of the banner boat. Kurt told me how all they did to the banner boat was remove "Team Apache" and replace it with Apache Bandit See this post for a pic from his brother. http://www.seriousoffshore.com/forums/showpost.php?p=233641&postcount=98

The banner boat=Apache Bandit=warpaint

[Nykamp]

Sean, you where along for that cold winter run. Hope all is well, Poppi rigged mine when she was brand new, Carl's was done the rigger that went to Nortech.

[Geronimo36]

Steve, you've had some beautiful Apaches!! Quite the lineup!:driving:

[DAREDEVIL]

NEWS !!!!! WARPATH II is running today in Miami @ 1 pm ( lets hope for the best ) !!!!

[DAREDEVIL]

By the way,,,what got me into the Apache's is the Hystory and the look and ride of them.

My favorit 41's are ......ALEZ VITE, MM's Mercruiser Special, Lambo boat !!!

IN THAT ORDER.

Hopefully soon i have one of those ?!:sifone:

[lowblue320]

NEWS !!!!! WARPATH II is running today in Miami @ 1 pm ( lets hope for the best ) !!!!

what do you mean by "let's hope for the best" ????? It ran fine and it's also nice to own #1 and #2 Warpath.

[xlr8by]

what do you mean by "let's hope for the best" ????? It ran fine.

Do you have a shot of the interior? Boat looks good :)

[lowblue320]

Do you have a shot of the interior? Boat looks good :)

here you go.. and Yes I also believe the boat looks good and they couldn't be owned by a better down to earth guy.

[lowblue320]

there's something about the deck of these Apache's.

[lowblue320]

how about a front shot..

[Nykamp]

Thanks Frank, I really love them in any size. I wish I could have had more then one ride in my first 36 before some ass clown stole her while she was still in Canada. My second 36 was way fun, we did an 8 day trip on her years ago up the coast of lake michigan. Hope all is well with you and your family, and your 36.

[xlr8by]

Thanks for posting the pics!

[lowblue320]

Thanks for posting the pics!

anytime....

[warpath]

Im very happy at the way yellow warpath ran. I dont run it often but every time I do, it amazes. We all had a great time and Id like to thank Jimmy from the Marine Shop. He is a master of his craft.

[MarylandMark]

it's also nice to own #1 and #2 Warpath.

Yea- I'd say.. Like really, really, really nice!

[DAREDEVIL]

Cool,,,despite u had a flood problem with a carb,,,but offcoarse there nice and they should run nice aswell. CONGRATS and thanks for the pics.

[lowblue320]

Cool,,,despite u had a flood problem with a carb,,,but offcoarse there nice and they should run nice aswell. CONGRATS and thanks for the pics.

what's your beef, you seem to get off on little things...ALOT of people wanted to go for a ride today "YOU KNOW WHO" and were turned down LOL ....keep in mind that your post says alot about you and "envy is the fruit of all evil" .Your first post of Warpath going out today from the start was off on the wrong foot and this last one seems to make fun of the flood ( minor things) Like you seem to get off on little things, and we are all on the same page here can you post a pic of your boat and mullet LOL:03:

I really needed to do that...LOL

[DAREDEVIL]

what's your beef, you seem to get off on little things...ALOT of people wanted to go for a ride today "YOU KNOW WHO" and were turned down LOL ....keep in mind that your post says alot about you and "envy is the fruit of all evil" .Your first post of Warpath going out today from the start was off on the wrong foot and this last one seems to make fun of the flood ( minor things) Like you seem to get off on little things, and we are all on the same page here can you post a pic of your boat and mullet LOL:03:

I really needed to do that...LOL

LOL,,,i did not mean that post in any bad way,,,sorry when u missunderstood me or i wrote it wrong.
I think every Apache is great and i don't think its funny at all if u have a problem on a boat,,been there,,don't like problems.
By the way ,,i did cut my hair some .LOL:sifone:

[lowblue320]

"daredevil" I guess it takes a man to say that "I wrote it wrong" and respect you for comming out and admitting that, but nothing is a problem when you got health, money and beautiful woman.... and being the owner of 2 Warpath's also makes it oh so much better...

[J-Bonz]

Wow, THat boat looks Great!! I havnt seen to many pics of it lately. Just might have to paint the 21' Scout like it..... :)

[lowblue320]

LOL,,,i did not mean that post in any bad way,,,sorry when u missunderstood me or i wrote it wrong.
I think every Apache is great and i don't think its funny at all if u have a problem on a boat,,been there,,don't like problems.
By the way ,,i did cut my hair some .LOL:sifone:

.......

[DAREDEVIL]

"daredevil" I guess it takes a man to say that "I wrote it wrong" and respect you for comming out and admitting that, but nothing is a problem when you got health, money and beautiful woman.... and being the owner of 2 Warpath's also makes it oh so much better...

I don't know if i am a man,,last time she said yes ..LOL and about the health and money...hats off. Women i got myself. HEHE

Have fun and maybe i can get a ride one day.:sifone:

[DAREDEVIL]

Oh,,forgot the pictures of me and my boat. LOL

its kind of hard to take a picture of myself ,,but here u go . Don't show this to any women that are married they might reconize me .hehe

I did not shave either.ooops

[Ratickle]

Im very happy at the way yellow warpath ran. I dont run it often but every time I do, it amazes. We all had a great time and Id like to thank Jimmy from the Marine Shop. He is a master of his craft.

Welcome, from all here I'm sure, may that be your first post of many......

[DAREDEVIL]

Oh,,,yep i forgot. WELCOME WARPATH !!!!!!!!!:seeya:
And don't take me tooo sirious on sirious !!! LOL

[Ratickle]

Oh,,forgot the pictures of me and my boat. LOL

its kind of hard to take a picture of myself ,,but here u go . Don't show this to any women that are married they might reconize me .hehe

I did not shave either.ooops

You lost weight since you took your avatar pic......:sifone:


It is nice to have the Apache group talk about the history of the all the tribes members. Hopefully we'll figure them all out.

[DAREDEVIL]

You lost weight since you took your avatar pic......:sifone:


It is nice to have the Apache group talk about the history of the all the tribes members. Hopefully we'll figure them all out.

Noooo,,,only my face shrunk.:rofl:

[warpath]

If any of you go out in one of these boats that havent been run in 1 year, run it hard in 4 to 5 footers for about 1 hour and the only problem you had to fix was to tap on a trim pump and take out a float seat and clean it. You had a great day.

[DAREDEVIL]

If any of you go out in one of these boats that havent been run in 1 year, run it hard in 4 to 5 footers for about 1 hour and the only problem you had to fix was to tap on a trim pump and take out a float seat and clean it. You had a great day.

LOL..true !!!!!!!:)

[Ratickle]

If any of you go out in one of these boats that havent been run in 1 year, run it hard in 4 to 5 footers for about 1 hour and the only problem you had to fix was to tap on a trim pump and take out a float seat and clean it. You had a great day.

I'm nominating that for the understatement of the year award.......:sifone:

[lowblue320]

If any of you go out in one of these boats that havent been run in 1 year, run it hard in 4 to 5 footers for about 1 hour and the only problem you had to fix was to tap on a trim pump and take out a float seat and clean it. You had a great day.

so true... J that boat you have is just bad aszzzz. I have been in many boats and I was very impressed by the ride of that boat (very solid) in the water conditions that we had today. I was also pleased by the way Jimmy checks everything to make sure it's all right. He also knows how to work the sticks and ran that beast today hard...It was ran wide open for long periods of time, with those water conditions and that's the way it's meant to be run.. Thanks for allowing me to take a ride in Warpath#2 it was a dream come true. I can't wait to run Warpath #1.....

[phragle]

the 41 I posted about the otherday, saw it this afternoon again... no name on it so I cant help you there, but the exhaust exited over the transom if that means anything...

[MarylandMark]

what's your beef, you seem to get off on little things...

a lot of people (not just DD) like to post little things just to show every one else they are "in the know".

Warpath- welcome to SOS and congrats on the good run. Best kind of boating- trouble free!

[DAREDEVIL]

a lot of people (not just DD) like to post little things just to show every one else they are "in the know".

Warpath- welcome to SOS and congrats on the good run. Best kind of boating- trouble free!

The reason why i posted this,,,is because i wanted to inform people that live there and are intrassted in seeing it !!!!
Thats all.

[xlr8by]

the 41 I posted about the otherday, saw it this afternoon again... no name on it so I cant help you there, but the exhaust exited over the transom if that means anything...

Was the boat all white? If so it could be MM's Mercruiser Special...

[ChiefApache]

If any of you go out in one of these boats that havent been run in 1 year, run it hard in 4 to 5 footers for about 1 hour and the only problem you had to fix was to tap on a trim pump and take out a float seat and clean it. You had a great day.

Boat looks great! Thanks for posting the pics.

Whoever posted the shot of the bow.........I look at that on our 41' everytime we head out and love the look....it's just beautiful.

[Geronimo36]

Warpath, awesome boat(s) you have there!!!!!!!

[Geronimo36]

Thanks Frank, I really love them in any size. I wish I could have had more then one ride in my first 36 before some ass clown stole her while she was still in Canada. My second 36 was way fun, we did an 8 day trip on her years ago up the coast of lake michigan. Hope all is well with you and your family, and your 36.

Thanks Steve all is well and the family and boat are great!!

[OldSchool]

If any of you go out in one of these boats that havent been run in 1 year, run it hard in 4 to 5 footers for about 1 hour and the only problem you had to fix was to tap on a trim pump and take out a float seat and clean it. You had a great day.

So true! :)

Welcome to Serious Offshore JC.

Craig

[lowblue320]

Boat looks great! Thanks for posting the pics.

Whoever posted the shot of the bow.........I look at that on our 41' everytime we head out and love the look....it's just beautiful.

I took the shot and it is bad aszz to look at, here's a shot of what I look at..

[ChiefApache]

I took the shot and it is bad aszz to look at, here's a shot of what I look at..

I think I'll stick to the 41'! :biggrinjester:

[lowblue320]

;);)
I think I'll stick to the 41'! :biggrinjester:


to each it's own, but the Apache deck is bad aszz to look at....:sifone:

[ChiefApache]

;);)


to each it's own, but the Apache deck is bad aszz to look at....:sifone:

Which I what I look at when we got out.....................

[cashbrain]

You have to love that view...
On Magnum Mark's boat, you need to be north of 6'(I'm 5'-8") just to see over the fairing...

[lowblue320]

You have to love that view...
On Magnum Mark's boat, you need to be north of 6'(I'm 5'-8") just to see over the fairing...

I can imagine,

J has both fairings for this boat as he changed it when he got it .. He was explianing that the original one is taller than what's on this boat now and the Warpath #1 still has the original one. I believe he said it is also north of the one that's on Warpath #2 (maybe I understood wrong).

You Apache guys are lucky to have one of these beast. The ride is solid and in the rough it just goes and goes and goes without letting NOTHING get in it's way..... I have always been a fan of Apaches as you can read back on offshoreonly and here since I can remember but after the ride no-one can take that away..

[cashbrain]

Now that you mention it...I'm pretty sure that there are two fairings on his boat...

[ChiefApache]

You Apache guys are lucky to have one of these beast. The ride is solid and in the rough it just goes and goes and goes without letting NOTHING get in it's way..... I have always been a fan of Apaches as you can read back on offshoreonly and here since I can remember but after the ride no-one can take that away..

It is incredible!!!

[fund razor]

Which I what I look at when we got out.....................

Odd. I had a different view. ;) :D

[nocigarette]

Thanks for posting the pics........You are a very fortunate man to have the coolest and second coolest boat that exists...... Welcome to serious, its the premiere site for the non pretentious crowd......Nothing like a big blower screaming apache.....

[lucy]

Just logged in to see how you guys are doing!!! glad to see you guys are having fun!! miss you! talk to you and a few days!!

[MarylandMark]

.........

[MattBMiller]

Just logged in to see how you guys are doing!!! glad to see you guys are having fun!! miss you! talk to you and a few days!!

Damn Lucy! You don't screw around when you go on vacation!!

[MattBMiller]

Which I what I look at when we got out.....................

I could get used to that view....

[SKRAMER]

what do you mean by "let's hope for the best" ????? It ran fine and it's also nice to own #1 and #2 warpath.

holy cow that apache is amazing!! Awesome rig!!!!!!

[ChiefApache]

Odd. I had a different view. ;) :D

Ah, that's a nice pic John!

[xlr8by]

Figured I would put up some pics of 41's that used to run or still run in NJ.

[lowblue320]

Figured I would put up some pics of 41's that used to run or still run in NJ.


I really love that Isand Racer, do you have any interior shots??

[lowblue320]

holy cow that apache is amazing!! Awesome rig!!!!!!

I'm sure he appreciates the comments.This boat belongs to screen name Warpath. This boat was the yellow Warpath and he also owns the Blue one....

[xlr8by]

I really love that Isand Racer, do you have any interior shots??

I don't but he posts on this site, so maybe he will chime in ;)

[kidapache]

here are some pics of it

[DAREDEVIL]

Good job Paul !!!! Looks nice.

[thedonz]

I really love that Isand Racer, do you have any interior shots??

i love the name hahaha:26:

mike

[DAREDEVIL]

LUCY .... please get back soon,,,,,this thread is getting boring !!:sifone:

[xlr8by]

LUCY .... please get back soon,,,,,this thread is getting boring !!:sifone:

+1! We need more trivia! What was the cost of a race setup or a pleasure 41' when they were brand new and what would have been the motors/drives?

[DAREDEVIL]

+1! We need more trivia! What was the cost of a race setup or a pleasure 41' when they were brand new and what would have been the motors/drives?

My guess is between 220-260 with 600 HP a side ??????mmhhh

[Chris]

The original '85 pleasure boat with 3's and 600's was $250K.

[xlr8by]

The original '85 pleasure boat with 3's and 600's was $250K.

Thanks Chris,
What speeds was that doing, 65-70mph? Anyone know the first pleasure boat and have pics?

[Chris]

Ran about 70. First one went to Cleveland to Kevin Brown.

[tjscarab]

Did the first 41 pleasure have red hull sides? If it did a friend of mine owned it in the past. This 41 had a race style dash that was modified to put a cabin door in.

[Chris]

It was a beige color with the nickel on the side in the rear

[lucy]

it is good to be back!:seeya:

[lucy]

Like to know your opinion on light Apaches versus heavy Apaches, what is your preference and why??:)

[DAREDEVIL]

I like light lay ups in ANY boat,,because u can always add weight to perform better if ness. but u can't make a heavy sled faster due to the weight.
I like it when a boat runs loose, that way i can adjust it to my liking and feel the water.:driving:

AND ITS ABOUT TIME U SHOWED UP !!!!!!LOL

[DAREDEVIL]

it is good to be back!:seeya:

The second and third one are non believers and should get banned from the tribe,,,,,they are not focused. HOUGHW;)

[SKRAMER]

I like light lay ups in ANY boat,,because u can always add weight to perform better if ness. but u can't make a heavy sled faster due to the weight.
I like it when a boat runs loose, that way i can adjust it to my liking and feel the water.:driving:

AND ITS ABOUT TIME U SHOWED UP !!!!!!LOL

I'll second that!!

[warpath]

Light vs heavy all depends on its intended use. The concept that lighter is faster in racing is not a new one. The limiting factor to how light a boat can be built is durability. Apaches claim to fame is that of wave crushers and to do that they needed to be built strong. The factory racing team had all of the money and resources to build their race boats and they built their own boats heavy. It seems to me that most light 41s were mules to carry more weight while not looking heavy or as rabbits or to outrun the other boats in smaller seas and lure them into a faster pace. The winningest Apaches including Predator werent light layups.

[Chris]

There's a reason that there are way more old race boats from the 70's than there are from the 80's. Light layups don't last. And light isn't faster in big water.

The old Apache layup schedule was about 40% useless weight. There was a ton of mat in the schedule, used for bonding between layups. And that stuff is a resin sponge. It made the boats heavier (better ride) but it was necessary to allow subsequent layers of cloth to bind to the previous plys. Modern construction materials and techniques provide for the elimination of those materials. Today you can build light and strong. But you lose the ride.

[DAREDEVIL]

Modern construction materials and techniques provide for the elimination of those materials. Today you can build light and strong. But you lose the ride.

A well placed ballast tank,,will give u that ride in any water.

If u stay on top with a well balanced boat ,,,u don't need to crush waves.

[lucy]

indeed!:). look at what happened to this light layup with todays modern construction materials and techniques.

[DAREDEVIL]

indeed!:). look at what happened to this light layup with todays modern construction materials and techniques.

That has nothing to do with light layup or modern technoligy,,,,diffrent story.

I WAS THERE,,TRUSST ME.

[Chris]

I'll make this easy.


First boat is heavy layup. Second one is much lighter. Water conditions are almost identical.

In Bobby's own words- "The boat slammed down hard. The forward buoyancy pushed the nose up and I went forward on the sticks, driving the boat out of the hole. In any other boat we'd have gone under".

Fpj_NYNDKgs

If your theory were true, you could put a Sterling 1550 in a 24' Fountain and clean up. On this topic, Sir Isaac Newton prevails.

[ChiefApache]

it is good to be back!:seeya:

Welcome back Lucy! How was your time away?

[Chris]

indeed!:). look at what happened to this light layup with todays modern construction materials and techniques.

Purely an instance of where the engineered capabilities of the hull were exceeded. Everyone thinks something went wrong- it didn't. They just asked more of the design than it was engineered to deliver.

There has yet to be constructed by man any device that can't be broken.

[DAREDEVIL]

Purely an instance of where the engineered capabilities of the hull were exceeded. Everyone thinks something went wrong- it didn't. They just asked more of the design than it was engineered to deliver.

There has yet to be constructed by man any device that can't be broken.

Absolutley fals,,,but i can't and will not discuss this here !!!

On the TRIP and almost STUFF,,,i think it was a throttle man error,,,,,SORRY BOBBY....the reason why i say this ,,i have done it in a strong boat !!!:kiss:

[lucy]

Welcome back Lucy! How was your time away?Thank you sweetie,:) it was breath taken!:seeya:

[DAREDEVIL]

Nice pictures and again a gourges blond.:kiss:

[Geronimo36]

I'll make this easy.


First boat is heavy layup. Second one is much lighter. Water conditions are almost identical.

In Bobby's own words- "The boat slammed down hard. The forward buoyancy pushed the nose up and I went forward on the sticks, driving the boat out of the hole. In any other boat we'd have gone under".

If your theory were true, you could put a Sterling 1550 in a 24' Fountain and clean up. On this topic, Sir Isaac Newton prevails.

Absolutley fals,,,but i can't and will not discuss this here !!!

On the TRIP and almost STUFF,,,i think it was a throttle man error,,,,,SORRY BOBBY....the reason why i say this ,,i have done it in a strong boat !!!:kiss:
Chris, I'm in agreement with you although the second race in the banner boat they had an electrical problem where every time he ran the trim it would cut the engines so they had no trim during the race. According to Bobby they started the race late and set the drives/tabs at a good all around setting and told everyone to hang on.

I found it out because a long time ago on OSO I posted that just a little tab would have avoided the trip/stuff and later Bobby came on to clear the air and let us all know the details of what/why it happened! :driving:

My view on lighter vs. heavy... I've ridden on a lot of different boats and I prefer the heavier ones. I'm not in love with needing 800 hp and yes the lighter ones can run on top of the water instead of thru it but when it gets big enough all that crap goes out the window! The same goes for steps, where in rough seas they're almost negligible. and talk about adding ballast and yadda yadda yadda.. you better be ready to add 1000 - 1500 lbs of water. ;)

In fact, I've been on a few of these new Epoxy light weight rocket ships that are 5-10 ft longer than mine and they can land pretty darn hard under 70 mph. It's awesome to achieve the 100 mph with stock power but there's always a sacrafice.

Nowadays the races are near-shore or even greater amount are in-shore so the landscape of the sport has changed significantly and so have the boats.

Just my opinion.

[lucy]

In Bobby's own words- "The boat slammed down hard. The forward buoyancy pushed the nose up and I went forward on the sticks, driving the boat out of the hole. In any other boat we'd have gone under".
words of wisdom!!:)

[Geronimo36]

As far as cats are concerned, I believe the opposite is true... Cats achieve speed by essentially "flying" so a lighter and stronger lay-up can be better... They don't call them "skaters" for nothin!

To compare, I've been in a 36' Skater in 4-5's and it ran great, if not better than my Apache...It also did 100 mph with 500 efi's and I could sip a cup of coffee... ;)

I even think Apache knew this and (stick my kneck out for saying this) but it could even be why towards the end they started experimenting with the concept. ;)

[ChiefApache]

Thank you sweetie,:) it was breath taken!:seeya:

I saw something on the History Channel on that statue. You were in South America? Was it Rio or at least in Brazil?

Awesome pictures! Thanks for sharing them.

[lucy]

:)Rio de Janairo, Brazil.

[lucy]

Like to know your opinion on light Apaches versus heavy Apaches, what is your preference and why??:) any more opinions??:)

[lucy]

The second and third one are non believers and should get banned from the tribe,,,,,they are not focused. HOUGHW;)LOL!!:seeya:

[MikeyFIN]

Like to know your opinion on light Apaches versus heavy Apaches, what is your preference and why??:)

Light and Low CG. Simple physics...
Resin Buckets stay outtada way.
And Like Daredevil said....ballast tanks are the key.

Plus something that makes noise like steel plate, is yellow and black, crossbonded and is 1/3 the weight...That in the Avatar is 100% that...

[MikeyFIN]

Absolutley fals,,,but i can't and will not discuss this here !!!

On the TRIP and almost STUFF,,,i think it was a throttle man error,,,,,SORRY BOBBY....the reason why i say this ,,i have done it in a strong boat !!!:kiss:

Maybe you´ll get a chance to show it to me IRL in a month, I´ve got a green light from work.

[MikeyFIN]

I'll make this easy.


First boat is heavy layup. Second one is much lighter. Water conditions are almost identical.

In Bobby's own words- "The boat slammed down hard. The forward buoyancy pushed the nose up and I went forward on the sticks, driving the boat out of the hole. In any other boat we'd have gone under".



If your theory were true, you could put a Sterling 1550 in a 24' Fountain and clean up. On this topic, Sir Isaac Newton prevails.

Warpath is nose heavy period.
And I´d hate that, But Bobby Saves it only with his skill IMO.

Team Apache on the other hand is just like I like it... loose and FAST..you gotta be alert an Yes Bobby missed one jump only.
Great timing he had in the day especially with no trim.
I´d take Team Apache anyday vs Warpath ans so did the Factory team back in the day and IMO the sea is a bit rougher with sharper waves in this vid.

Regarding the theory of a Sterling 1550´s (or a hull full of T´N´T) in a 24 footer...well enter Isaac Newton and lets consider something else also than pure hp/weight....

[MikeyFIN]

As far as cats are concerned, I believe the opposite is true... Cats achieve speed by essentially "flying" so a lighter and stronger lay-up can be better... They don't call them "skaters" for nothin!

To compare, I've been in a 36' Skater in 4-5's and it ran great, if not better than my Apache...It also did 100 mph with 500 efi's and I could sip a cup of coffee... ;)

I even think Apache knew this and (stick my kneck out for saying this) but it could even be why towards the end they started experimenting with the concept. ;)

Our Racecat builder advised us not to Autoclave our cat but we did it anyway...
And every one we in the future will be fabricating well be done likewise.

At the Last European Champs in the rough we still put 100lbs of extra ballast and being at least that much overweight, still being able to run good in the rough so the theory in the rough is extra ballast to avoid unneccessary airing. *100lbs is 5% of our total raceweight...

[Geronimo36]

Lucy, you've been on both, how do you feel about them? :) ;)

A new question for the masses....

In rough water what do you prefer? A 24 degree deadrise or another variant?

[MikeyFIN]

Nice pictures and again a gourges blond.:kiss:
+1
I´d say Yes ;):26:

[MikeyFIN]

A new question for the masses....

In rough water what do you prefer? A 24 degree deadrise or another variant?

A 28...

Back in the day a 28 degree deep Vee made Don Aronow more or less eat outta the hand of two Swedish Airline pilots who started racing offshore with their own boats...
And It was a 21 footer that Beat Don´s Magnums...in the rough.
Don wasn´t pleased after the race...

http://www.smuggler.se/bilder/50069tumbs.jpg

I did understand the question right..you meant Rough as in SHARP waves...like shipbreaking sharp...

The second best are the 26´s of for Example Sutphen and Flying Flipper (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&VideoID=40242730).

[lowblue320]

This is my opinion,

I like light cats (but strong) in the flat and with a little chop but as far as with rough I would want a boat like the Apache Warpath #2 that I rode in. It serves the purpose right. Besides non of these boats are going to break any speed records anytime soon.

If I were to own one I would want Warpath #1, due to it being in the original condition, has lots of real history on and off the coarse..Again my opinion.

[lucy]

Lucy, you've been on both, how do you feel about them? :) ;)


First let me tell you how I feel about Apache;:)
Each and every boat was given that special individual treatment, whether for race or pleasure application, to become part on the TEAM- to be involved in the entire process of building your own custom, high performance powerboat was a big plus. When you make the decision to step up to an APACHE you became a member of the Apache Family. A member of our Apache Tribe!.. For you Apache owners each of your boats were build with quality, with that extra care given to detail and performance. Layout, design, artwork, graphics, color coordination, and interior accents; even custom bolsters were INDIVIDUALLY attended. Each Apache boat represents the owner's personal preferences and that makes them all unique!!! I have driven many different boats, and I got to tell you there is no ride like on APACHE,. Light or heavy Apache....not just another race boat!! and that is my opinion!;)

[Geronimo36]

I did understand the question right..you meant Rough as in SHARP waves...like shipbreaking sharp...

The second best are the 26´s of for Example Sutphen and

rough by my definition is say over 5-6+ ft, whether it be chop (sharp as you say) or ocean swells. Big enough to where you're airborne consistently and changing conditions.

As far as Sutphen goes, although I'm a big fan, I didn't find them to be the best rough water boat I've been on. I spent a good amount of time on a 33' and I wasn't overly impressed. The nose was way too flightly (needed a lot of extra weight) and overall not the best ride I've experienced.... However, I think they are competitive, run fast and can run with the best of them!

[Geronimo36]

A 28...

Back in the day a 28 degree deep Vee made Don Aronow more or less eat outta the hand of two Swedish Airline pilots who started racing offshore with their own boats...
And It was a 21 footer that Beat Don´s Magnums...in the rough.
Don wasn´t pleased after the race...

Back then Bertram was the major contender...now we're pre-dating a bit.

[lucy]

Saccenti collaborated with Aronow on the design of the first Apache boat, the 41 Warpath. Last time I went to visit Ben in the federal prison, we spoke for hours about warpath and he said "Warpath was my baby and it was the perfect ride":)

[MikeyFIN]

words of wisdom!!:)

Or just pure (racers) instinct...

[MikeyFIN]

Back then Bertram was the major contender...now we're pre-dating a bit.

Globally I beg to differ and Don was after all after the World championship...
Just like Benny...

[MikeyFIN]

First let me tell you how I feel about Apache;:)
Each and every boat was given that special individual treatment, whether for race or pleasure application, to become part on the TEAM- to be involved in the entire process of building your own custom, high performance powerboat was a big plus. When you make the decision to step up to an APACHE you became a member of the Apache Family. A member of our Apache Tribe!.. For you Apache owners each of your boats were build with quality, with that extra care given to detail and performance. Layout, design, artwork, graphics, color coordination, and interior accents; even custom bolsters were INDIVIDUALLY attended. Each Apache boat represents the owner's personal preferences and that makes them all unique!!! I have driven many different boats, and I got to tell you there is no ride like on APACHE,. Light or heavy Apache....not just another race boat!! and that is my opinion!;)


Here´s when the Pride of owning and building something unique comes to play it´s a Niche market but what a ride...
Regarding that aspect yes Apache was in A class of it´s own.
Here Apache had a lot of common with the upscale blowboat builders.

But thenagain howabout those second hand owners who custom their Apaches to their own taste..sometimes the result is good and improves the heritage and sometimes the heritage and identity goes out the window.
Tough Decisions when owning something unique IMO.

[MikeyFIN]

rough by my definition is say over 5-6+ ft, whether it be chop (sharp as you say) or ocean swells. Big enough to where you're airborne consistently and changing conditions.


Just take a small enough cat and Chop get´s you airborne all the time :ack2:



As far as Sutphen goes, although I'm a big fan, I didn't find them to be the best rough water boat I've been on. I spent a good amount of time on a 33' and I wasn't overly impressed. The nose was way too flightly (needed a lot of extra weight) and overall not the best ride I've experienced.... However, I think they are competitive, run fast and can run with the best of them!

Mario Andretti once said once your in control of your racer you ain´t going fast enough.
So it hasn´t to be nice , but win IMO to be a legend.
If your body can´t take it then your washed up.

[xlr8by]

Saccenti collaborated with Aronow on the design of the first Apache boat, the 41 Warpath. Last time I went to visit Ben in the federal prison, we spoke for hours about warpath and he said "Warpath was my baby and it was the perfect ride":)

Did Warpath race after 1984, also could someone see the boat on display at Fort Apache back in the day?

[Geronimo36]

Mario Andretti once said once your in control of your racer you ain´t going fast enough.
So it hasn´t to be nice , but win IMO to be a legend.
If your body can´t take it then your washed up.


Wow, that makes lots of sense. Build a product that beats kidneys out of it's owners and is out of control... Sounds like a great business model... :rofl:

Wait, that's exactly what most V-bottom manufacturers have done in the past two decades in their quest for speed... :lurk5:

In my opinion the reason Apache became a legend is because of its rough water prowess. :seeya:



I think what Mario meant by that and maybe it was lost in the translation ;); you're not racing hard enough unless you're on the edge... The most accomplished racers are the ones who have found and went past the edge. There's two kinds of racers, those that have wrecked and those that are going to wreck... :driving:

[Geronimo36]

Just take a small enough cat and Chop get´s you airborne all the time :ack2:.

As they say; "it's all relative" :USA:

[DAREDEVIL]

There's two kinds of racers, those that have wrecked and those that are going to wreck... :driving:[/QUOTE]


This is unfortanitley very true.:seeya::driving:

[DAREDEVIL]

But hey guys,,,have u reliazed ,,,Lucy is back and the thread comes alive. :sifone:

[smokeybandit]

Did Warpath race after 1984, also could someone see the boat on display at Fort Apache back in the day?

Yes and Yes. Warpath raced in 1985. I'm not 100% sure but I think the banner boat debuted in Key West in 1985 at the worlds. Might have been a few races earlier.

Warpath was always at Fort Apache. Not only was it on display, but if you were buying a boat, and Ben and Bobby were there, you could even get a ride. I did, and it was awesome. We ended up buying the banner boat and a 41' pleasure. The banner boat raced in NPBA as Apache/Bandit.

40006

[xlr8by]

Yes and Yes. Warpath raced in 1985. I'm not 100% sure but I think the banner boat debuted in Key West in 1985 at the worlds. Might have been a few races earlier.

Warpath was always at Fort Apache. Not only was it on display, but if you were buying a boat, and Ben and Bobby were there, you could even get a ride. I did, and it was awesome. We ended up buying the banner boat and a 41' pleasure. The banner boat raced in NPBA as Apache/Bandit.

40006

That's awesome you got a ride with Ben and Bobby, I met your brother Kurt a few times and he has/had a picture of the banner boat up in the front of his entrance to his shop.

[LEOPAJM]

Lake Erie had been kicking my azz all my life and I wanted to kick back. :D

AMEN !!! :sifone:

[Sean Stinson]

Did Warpath race after 1984, also could someone see the boat on display at Fort Apache back in the day?

Yes and yes!!!!

[smokeybandit]

That's awesome you got a ride with Ben and Bobby, I met your brother Kurt a few times and he has/had a picture of the banner boat up in the front of his entrance to his shop.

As much as I always loved Kurt like brother, he's not my brother. That's Steve that you are thinking of. I'm Robert. Driver and occasional U-boat commander.

[DAREDEVIL]

As much as I always loved Kurt like brother, he's not my brother. That's Steve that you are thinking of. I'm Robert. Driver and occasional U-boat commander.

mmhhh,,,U-Boat comander ????? hehe i stuffed my PP before,,does that make me one too? :ack2:

[xlr8by]

As much as I always loved Kurt like brother, he's not my brother. That's Steve that you are thinking of. I'm Robert. Driver and occasional U-boat commander.

Yep, I thought you were Steve sorry about that.

[Geronimo36]

speaking of chop....Here's pic I ordered, came in yesterday....Just an average day in Jersey... sorry for the quality, it's my cell phone picture of a picture...:ack2:

It was over a month ago coming home in 2-3's with a 20 mph head-wind, we were running 60 mph...

the girls (my wife and her cousin) had some pretty knotty hair!!:26:

[lucy]

Mario Andretti once said once your in control of your racer you ain´t going fast enough.
by the way sweet heart the racer who said that was not Mario Andretti, it was PARNELLI JONES when he drove the 1970 Boss 302 in Transam racing!!:seeya: just a fact!:)

[lucy]

Warpath was always at Fort Apache. Not only was it on display, but if you were buying a boat, and Ben and Bobby were there, you could even get a ride. I did, and it was awesome. We ended up buying the banner boat and a 41' pleasure. The banner boat raced in NPBA as Apache/Bandit.

40006Hi Robert, beautiful boat you got there!! great to have you here!!:) I have a question for you, I always wanted to know if there is a big weight difference between the Warpath and your Banner boat?, what is the estimated weight on your boat?

[lucy]

speaking of chop....Here's pic I ordered, came in yesterday....Just an average day in Jersey... sorry for the quality, it's my cell phone picture of a picture...:ack2:

It was over a month ago coming home in 2-3's with a 20 mph head-wind, we were running 60 mph...

the girls (my wife and her cousin) had some pretty knotty hair!!:26:

way cool frank!:)

[Geronimo36]

Thanks Lucy!!

Now I need to decide if I'm going to keep em or send them back to boatpix... I have a plethora of pics already so maybe I'll only keep just one..

I think I need more video, I'm bored with pics! :) My wife had a good point; "How many more of these pictures do you need?" I guess she has a point...so more video it is!! ;)

[smokeybandit]

Hi Robert, beautiful boat you got there!! great to have you here!!:) I have a question for you, I always wanted to know if there is a big weight difference between the Warpath and your Banner boat?, what is the estimated weight on your boat?

I wish I still had that boat. I know that it was much lighter than Warpath. We lost our whole stable of boats in 1987 due to my Dad's misdeeds. Included 3 Apaches. He's dead so I can talk about him. His money got me into a lot of places back in the day. Fort Apache was one of them. He was a colorful character who is remembered fondly by some and not so fondly by others. I choose to only remember the fun stuff. He spent like it was water and we had about 6 raceboats at one time. He and Jack Kramer got along very well. They tried to b.s. each other. I can only imagine how much $ my dad dropped at Apache.

That's my cathartic rant. Sorry to hijack the thread.

[lucy]

stop by any time!!:seeya:

[Ratickle]

Thanks Lucy!!

Now I need to decide if I'm going to keep em or send them back to boatpix... I have a plethora of pics already so maybe I'll only keep just one..

I think I need more video, I'm bored with pics! :) My wife had a good point; "How many more of these pictures do you need?" I guess she has a point...so more video it is!! ;)

You always keep the ones that are better than anything you have. Other than that, it's just another picture......

[lucy]

Red Banner boat= Apache Bandit= Warpaint, the other one is a copy of the banner boat!:willy_nilly:

[lucy]

You always keep the ones that are better than anything you have. Other than that, it's just another picture......

you can never have to many pictures!!:) keep them all Frank your daughter will have a story to tell when she grows up!!

[lucy]

Does any one knows if there is a significant weight differences between Warpath I, II, and The Banner Boat?:)

[DAREDEVIL]

you can never have to many pictures!!:) keep them all Frank your daughter will have a story to tell when she grows up!!

LOL,,,yeah.......like ..."thats how daddy spend my college money" . HAHA:sifone::rofl:

[lucy]

LOL!! or like look at me I am driving daddy's Apache!!!:03:

[lowblue320]

LOL!! or like look at me I am driving daddy's Apache!!!:03:

cute pic....

[Geronimo36]

LOL,,,yeah.......like ..."thats how daddy spend my college money" . HAHA:sifone::rofl:

Yeah, my wife says that everytime I open the engine hatch!:seeya:

Actually, I think Ashley might have more savings than I do! :03:


LOL!! or like look at me I am driving daddy's Apache!!!:03:

Right on Lucy! The pictures that my mother took on the boat and at the races have inspired me over the years... Combine that with the "campfire stories" my father told me about some of the crazy chit they did, I became a boating addict! :26::USA:


cute pic....

Thanks! Kid has me wrapped around her little finger... ;)

[Geronimo36]

We lost our whole stable of boats in 1987 due to my Dad's misdeeds.

He was a colorful character who is remembered fondly by some and not so fondly by others.

I choose to only remember the fun stuff.

He spent like it was water

That's my cathartic rant. Sorry to hijack the thread.

Hey, maybe your father knew my father or maybe we're somehow related??? :rofl::willy_nilly::willy_nilly:

They called my father "frankie fino" or "frankie chains" :leaving:

[lucy]

Does any one knows if there is a significant weight differences between Warpath I, II, and The Banner Boat?:)I guest a call to the Chief is in order!:)any one?

[smokeybandit]

Hey, maybe your father knew my father or maybe we're somehow related??? :rofl::willy_nilly::willy_nilly:

They called my father "frankie fino" or "frankie chains" :leaving:

I always wondered about my father. I was the only jewish kid hanging out with all italians. Stuck withe me to this day. I even earned the nickname Hesh after the character on the Sopranos.

[xlr8by]

I guest a call to the Chief is in order!:)any one?

Keep us posted on the outcome :)

[Geronimo36]

I always wondered about my father. I was the only jewish kid hanging out with all italians. Stuck withe me to this day. I even earned the nickname Hesh after the character on the Sopranos.

Ok, now that's too f'ing weird..... My father is also jewish although I'm catholic... lol :willy_nilly::willy_nilly:

[Sean Stinson]

rough by my definition is say over 5-6+ ft, whether it be chop (sharp as you say) or ocean swells. Big enough to where you're airborne consistently and changing conditions.

As far as Sutphen goes, although I'm a big fan, I didn't find them to be the best rough water boat I've been on. I spent a good amount of time on a 33' and I wasn't overly impressed. The nose was way too flightly (needed a lot of extra weight) and overall not the best ride I've experienced.... However, I think they are competitive, run fast and can run with the best of them!

Hell I never took mine out until it was at least 4'-6' seas.....otherwise it was a boring ride!!!!

[Geronimo36]

I hear ya Shawn and what you and I consider 4-6's are other peoples 8-10's I've come to notice! ;)

My 5-6's don't include holes in the trough, just the actual wave height! Kinda like how local Hawaiians say it's 4-5' and it's like way overhead surf!

[smokeybandit]

I have some video of the Banner boat racing as Apache/Bandit. I'll put it up as soon as I can.

[lucy]

NEWS !!!!! WARPATH II is running today in Miami @ 1 pm ( lets hope for the best ) !!!!
NEWS!!!!! WARPATH I is running tomorrow at 3PM out of Hallover Marina!! be there or be square!!:)(lets hope for the best):ack2:

[Geronimo36]

Nice!!! Best of luck and please get some pictures etc!

[lowblue320]

NEWS!!!!! WARPATH I is running tomorrow at 3PM out of Hallover Marina!! be there or be square!!:)(lets hope for the best):ack2:

just got the call and it's a go.....:sifone:

[lucy]

Nice!!! Best of luck and please get some pictures etc!I am sure lowblue will have a full report and photos!!:)

[lucy]

I have some video of the Banner boat racing as Apache/Bandit. I'll put it up as soon as I can.
Great I like to see that!

[Geronimo36]

You always keep the ones that are better than anything you have. Other than that, it's just another picture......


you can never have to many pictures!!:) keep them all Frank your daughter will have a story to tell when she grows up!!

I decided to hang onto this one by negotiating a deal with boatpix..:driving:

All the bad press they get and I've never had an issue since first using them in 1999. :seeya:

[MikeyFIN]

by the way sweet heart the racer who said that was not Mario Andretti, it was PARNELLI JONES when he drove the 1970 Boss 302 in Transam racing!!:seeya: just a fact!:)

Offtopic:
Dear Lucy :kiss:

Now I my memory serves correct Mario stated it in the 60´s while driving CanAms and the phrase was exactly
"If everything seems under control, you`re just not going fast enough."
And It would seem to be in the correct context regarding vehicles he was driving...

I find it strange that a Racer like Parnelli would say anything like that driving a 5.0 Mustang unless he had already become too old 1970... :sifone:
I mean he had driven way tougher machines in his life already.
That was a first for me hearing that Parnelli said that but It would´nt be the first time I´m misinformed :)
But anyway I´m all ears for you :seeya:

[MikeyFIN]

great i like to see that!

+1

[MikeyFIN]

Wow, that makes lots of sense. Build a product that beats kidneys out of it's owners and is out of control... Sounds like a great business model... :rofl:

Now it´s not an american way of thinking...
Race on sunday sell on monday is.
For a true racer it´s repair on monday, and uptil the next race, sadly...
Just ask Enzo Ferrari..he didn´t care a dime for the products he made unless it provided him dough to get racing...just Ask Ferruccio Lamborghini and his problems of Ferrari ownership and reasons for building an own marque.




Wait, that's exactly what most V-bottom manufacturers have done in the past two decades in their quest for speed... :lurk5:

In my opinion the reason Apache became a legend is because of its rough water prowess. :seeya:

In my opinion it has also a lot to do with the shady characters around them...

Regarding Apaches Racing, Globally they had their opponents and then some.
But was the others comfortable enough to get adapted for pleasure use also ?
Noway and that wasn´t even the purpose of the other boats.
Just check the CUV thread...





I think what Mario meant by that and maybe it was lost in the translation ;); you're not racing hard enough unless you're on the edge... The most accomplished racers are the ones who have found and went past the edge. There's two kinds of racers, those that have wrecked and those that are going to wreck... :driving:

The most Accomplished Racers are those who are on the brink of the edge and saves from there. Those who go past it don´t come back :angelsad2:
Ayrton Senna and Henri Toivonen being the prime Examples and my ultimate heroes.

[Geronimo36]

Race on sunday sell on monday is.
For a true racer it´s repair on monday, and uptil the next race, sadly...
Just ask Enzo Ferrari..he didn´t care a dime for the products he made unless it provided him dough to get racing...just Ask Ferruccio Lamborghini and his problems of Ferrari ownership and reasons for building an own marque.

But was the others comfortable enough to get adapted for pleasure use also ? Noway and that wasn´t even the purpose of the other boats.
Just check the CUV thread...

Very true, we aspire for that. Selling products raced on Sunday to the public on Monday is what makes money for corporations in a capitalistic society and also includes the global economy to a cetain extent!:driving:

We'll just have to agree to disagree on the rest but that's all good, it's what makes you I who we are. That I completely respect!!! :)

[Geronimo36]

Those who go past it don´t come back :angelsad2:

Not always, my good friends won the SCL National and World Championship in 01'. They found the edge and fortunately lived to tell about it! :)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8328869055189237949&ei=xjihSqy9OcrWlQfu-biDBg&q#

[MikeyFIN]

Not always, my good friends won the SCL National and World Championship in 01'. They found the edge and fortunately lived to tell about it! :)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8328869055189237949&ei=xjihSqy9OcrWlQfu-biDBg&q#

Well I could say that they weren´t at the edge yet as they´r still here And I´m glad they are and have to give in here and admit there´s a truth in there.
Those kinda accidents are the worst, they look to the audience nothing really serious happened because the stop was actually so hard.

[Ratickle]

Wasn't it Pepe who said if you're not scared, you're not going fast enough?

[MikeyFIN]

Very true, we aspire for that. Selling products raced on Sunday to the public on Monday is what makes money for corporations in a capitalistic society and also includes the global economy to a cetain extent!:driving:

We'll just have to agree to disagree on the rest but that's all good, it's what makes you I who we are. That I completely respect!!! :)

Agreed on all counts.

Thenagain CUV for example is a big luxury shipyard... so the profit is somewhere else than "tenderboats"

I´ve never actually thought of racing as none other than racing only and a "waste of time" vs true testing of a product, there´s other people looking for some profit even here (and there) but I´ve always seen it as just a money pit and a (FUN) way to spend time.
I´ve tried to build racecars as profession once in my life but found out there´s easier ways to make a living...
Thenagain, now we are thinking of building our own raceboats in the future..where is a big also ?... :ack2:

Hmmm any A41 molds up for grabs so we can make some stepbottoms and lowslung sitdown types... :reddevil:

END of offtopic from my behalf, I Promise, on this thread.

[MikeyFIN]

Wasn't it Pepe who said if you're not scared, you're not going fast enough?

If yes then let´s take it on the Pantera section !

[phragle]

by the way sweet heart the racer who said that was not Mario Andretti, it was PARNELLI JONES when he drove the 1970 Boss 302 in Transam racing!!:seeya: just a fact!:)
Parnelli Jones also raced desert in a Bill Stroppe built "Bronco". (which Jones helped design) It really wasn't a bronco at all, but the first tube framed "funny truck". Way ahead of its time,it used a 4 lnk rear end, a TTB front end, tube chassis and was 2 wheel drive as opposed to 4wd. his basic design with evolution dominated desert racing for the next 20+ years eventually evoling into the trophy truck class. Mario Andretti also was the marshall for (I believe) the 2003 baja 1000 and is shown driving a 2wd "trophy truck" prerunner with a 4 link rear end and TTB front end, (with a BIG smile on his face) in the movie "From dust to glory".

http://www.bajabronco.com/Pictures/BigOly.jpg

[Geronimo36]

Thenagain CUV for example is a big luxury shipyard... so the profit is somewhere else than "tenderboats".

Reminds me of Bertram a bit.


Well I could say that they weren´t at the edge yet as they´r still here And I´m glad they are and have to give in here and admit there´s a truth in there.
Those kinda accidents are the worst, they look to the audience nothing really serious happened because the stop was actually so hard.

No doubt! Garry got knocked out cold in the slide as it caught the sponson and went over... He came to as the water was filling up inside the cockpit! They said he he was "out for the show."

I still joke with him saying he hasn't been the same since! :rofl:



So back on Apache! Isn't it go-time for Warpath?

[lucy]

Offtopic:
Dear Lucy :kiss:

Now I my memory serves correct Mario stated it in the 60´s while driving CanAms and the phrase was exactly
"If everything seems under control, you`re just not going fast enough."
And It would seem to be in the correct context regarding vehicles he was driving...

I find it strange that a Racer like Parnelli would say anything like that driving a 5.0 Mustang unless he had already become too old 1970... :sifone:
I mean he had driven way tougher machines in his life already.
That was a first for me hearing that Parnelli said that but It would´nt be the first time I´m misinformed :)
But anyway I´m all ears for you :seeya::seeya::) check this out! http://www.geocities.com/freakracing/philos.html:kiss::kiss:maybe this helps!

[phragle]

Phragle 1993 "Racing is man's attempt to control an out of control situation, with varying degrees of success"

[MikeyFIN]

Darn Lucy It echoes here :)

http://www.quotelucy.com/quotes/mario-andretti-quotes.html :biggrinjester:

[MikeyFIN]

Phragle 1993 "Racing is man's attempt to control an out of control situation, with varying degrees of success"

And Females way of saying they´re on top of us without even racing...

So Is Warpath a She ?

Ben just told Lucy it was his baby, now how should I take it ????
In my eyes not all boats are She..some are Racehorses and some workhorses...

[lowblue320]

I am sure lowblue will have a full report and photos!!:)


Damn weather :confused:

[lucy]

Darn Lucy It echoes here :)

http://www.quotelucy.com/quotes/mario-andretti-quotes.html :biggrinjester:LOL!!:biggrinjester:

[lucy]

.....
Does any one knows if there is a significant weight differences between Warpath I, II, and The Banner Boat?:)Just spoke to Tom Evans Original crew chief of Apache Power boats and he said. Warpath I was the heaviest one Warpath II and the banner boat were subsequently, marginally lighter but that none of them were light boats. According to Tom, later experiments with light layups for racing, were mostly unsuccessful forcing the return of the stronger heavier boats. He also like Ben said" Warpath was my favorite, and the best ride" "Like a freight train":)

[lucy]

Wasn't it Pepe who said if you're not scared, you're not going fast enough?I think it was "if you're not swallowing salt water you are not going fast enough" :blush5:

[xlr8by]

.....

Thanks Lucy, for getting in touch with Tom! :)

[lucy]

Just ask Enzo Ferrari..he didn´t care a dime for the products he made unless it provided him dough to get racing...
...I did!:biggrinjester:

[xlr8by]

...I did!:biggrinjester:

Lucy nice Ferrari F40 pics. Enzo's last supercar only 213 were produced for the US market. The car in Lucy's photo is a US car, the large front black "chin" spoiler is a dead giveaway, as only the US cars had this. Also the US cars had the thick black rub strip around the body of the cars, which the rest of the world cars lacked. The car in the pics has aftermarket wheels and rear spoiler insert (black section), but is very sharp :).

[lucy]

Lucy nice Ferrari F40 pics. Enzo's last supercar only 213 were produced for the US market. The car in Lucy's photo is a US car, the large front black "chin" spoiler is a dead giveaway, as only the US cars had this. Also the US cars had the thick black rub strip around the body of the cars, which the rest of the world cars lacked. The car in the pics has aftermarket wheels and rear spoiler insert (black section), but is very sharp :).
very observant!!:) In an effort to beat the Mclaren F1 in endurance racing, Ferrari contracted Michelloto to develop the F40 LM and the F40 GTE which finally proved much faster than the Mclaren. The carbon fiber rear wing and magnesium wheels on this car are from the Michelloto F40 LM race car.:):seeya:

[lowblue320]

very observant!!:) The carbon fiber rear wing and magnesium wheels on this car are from the Michelloto F40 LM race car.:):seeya:

I was going to waite to add this but Lucy is correct...:sifone: and from the "actual" car not "like" the one used in the actual car....

[Dude! Sweet!]

I think it was "if you're not swallowing salt water you are not going fast enough" :blush5:

But he said that in 2002... Previously, Paul had the quote nailed. :sifone:

My favorite PJ quote... When asked about racing Indy roadster and dirt cars in the early sixties Parnelli replied "When the invented roll cages, everybody got brave."

PJ's a legend and as hard as they come.

Hey Stinson, what's with the Mystic avitar? You get a new job? :sifone:

[MikeyFIN]

.....

Lucy only if you like your ride like a freight train...

I like my Ride a bit bumpy too in the process...lasting like a freight train.
There´s no ride like a rollercoaster ride.

And yes WE ARE TALKING BOATS...:reddevil:

[Toasty]

leave it to the Fin to get dirty...who would have thought? Ha.
Post some more pictures of old apaches! Where is Star Chaser?

[MikeyFIN]

very observant!!:) In an effort to beat the Mclaren F1 in endurance racing, Ferrari contracted Michelloto to develop the F40 LM and the F40 GTE which finally proved much faster than the Mclaren. The carbon fiber rear wing and magnesium wheels on this car are from the Michelloto F40 LM race car.:):seeya:


Lucyyyy...nice pics :ack2:
But I took this offtopic here (http://seriousoffshore.com/forums/showthread.php?p=312613#post312613)

[MikeyFIN]

leave it to the Fin to get dirty...who would have thought? Ha.
Post some more pictures of old apaches! Where is Star Chaser?

I was talking Boats you old pervert...:bigear:

[warpath]

Lucy only if you like your ride like a freight train...

I like my Ride a bit bumpy too in the process...lasting like a freight train.
There´s no ride like a rollercoaster ride.

And yes WE ARE TALKING BOATS...:reddevil: You got the right type of boat for the ride you like.

[MikeyFIN]

You got the right type of boat for the ride you like.

Got that right.

Light and Nimble.

And Yes I´ve swallowed saltwater in that too without being upside down or stuffed...

[warpath]

Got that right.

Light and Nimble.

And Yes I´ve swallowed saltwater in that too without being upside down or stuffed...

No B.S. It looks like fun! but trust me Apache rides can be bumpy enough.

[MikeyFIN]

Sure they can..wouldn´t doubt it and therefore a big mono for me is preferrably a raceboat or a former one, something that has as little as possbile to break (and no extra weight) like Magnum Mark once said.
Therefore I like racecars too over exotic cars.
In the right conditions a big boat starts to feel alive too.
But it has to be REAL offshore like Charlie is touting here.

[lucy]

Post some more pictures of old apaches! Where is Star Chaser? ...!:)

[lucy]

name the crew in this vessel?:)

[lowblue320]

that starchaser Apache is bad aszzz.. but then again I like white:) BTW what power does it have??

[lowblue320]

name the crew in this vessel?:)

what ever happened to this boat?

[warpath]

Sure they can..wouldn´t doubt it and therefore a big mono for me is preferrably a raceboat or a former one, something that has as little as possbile to break (and no extra weight) like Magnum Mark once said.
Therefore I like racecars too over exotic cars.
In the right conditions a big boat starts to feel alive too.
But it has to be REAL offshore like Charlie is touting here.

These race boats won World and National Championships they had 0 extra weight. They had precisely the necessary amount of weight to last the race and outrun the competition. Heavier they would have been too slow. Lighter they could have broken. They were made for their intended purpose and won. We're talking about Apaches, right?

[lucy]

:)
that star chaser Apache is bad assize.. but then again I like white:) BTW what power does it have??check previous pages on this thread! there is also a video Frank posted running with starchaser.!

[lucy]

name the crew in this vessel?:)any one?

[MikeyFIN]

These race boats won World and National Championships they had 0 extra weight. They had precisely the necessary amount of weight to last the race and outrun the competition. Heavier they would have been too slow. Lighter they could have broken. They were made for their intended purpose and won. We're talking about Apaches, right?

You gotta mean the Key West Worlds ?
Warpath etc in their allowable minimum in their class or over?
Now you say COULD have broken...A damn big IF there...
And here we go again (NOT)

We are Talking Apaches and Warpath in particular yes.
Would be interesting to know How much under a CUV 41 for example is ...which could give Apaches some serious headache and did back in the day (among others)
Theneagain if you built your equipment to last the whole season and then some then there´s a lot left to shave off IMO.


PERIOD.

[MikeyFIN]

name the crew in this vessel?:)

Jerry Kilpatrick Lent the money/was the funds of Apache Powerboats and Owner Driver
Bobby Saccenti the President of above corp and Throttleman.


Navigator/Mechanic ???

Edit a Wild guess ;
Tom Evans Navigator ?

[MikeyFIN]

there is also a video frank posted ruining with starchaser.!


wtf??????:(

[MikeyFIN]

what ever happened to this boat?

I´ve been asking this for years...

As There was a Squadron XII project once in my mind... and it´s original colour is red..

[lucy]

Hey Stinson, what's with the Mystic avitar? You get a new job? :sifone:+1:)hi:seeya:

[lucy]

any one?

Kilpatrick, Saccenti, Doc King!:)

[lucy]

Apache always at front! PERIOD!!!!!:USA::USA::USA::USA::USA::USA::USA::USA:

[MikeyFIN]

Kilpatrick, Saccenti, Doc King!:)

Doc who ??
any relation to Don King ?

Lucy can you tell more ?

[lucy]

Going boating now!! but... stay tune;)

[MikeyFIN]

Apache always at front! PERIOD!!!!!:USA::USA::USA::USA::USA::USA::USA::USA:
Amen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Indian_Religious_Freedom_Act)

[lucy]

Best balanced 47 ever build?:)

[lucy]

which 41 it is supposed to be the lightest ever constructed?

[lucy]

your opinion, 41 versus 47, how different is the ride?

[Lee]

Best balanced 47 ever build?:)

Kemosabe.

[fund razor]

your opinion, 41 versus 47, how different is the ride?
Depends who's driving? :D

[Toasty]

which 41 it is supposed to be the lightest ever constructed?

Prob a real work boat that no one has ever seen or even heard...
MM was pretty light and star chaser was even lighter i think...
...cdc

[lucy]

:sifone::sifone::sifone::sifone::sifone::sifone:
Kemosabe.

[lucy]

Depends who's driving? :Dgood one!:)

[lucy]

Prob a real work boat that no one has ever seen or even heard...
MM was pretty light and star chaser was even lighter i think...
...cdc
true to both!:).... Shaka!!! look how it seats on the water,!!

[xlr8by]

On Saturday I went out on Island Runner with Frank Kerbeck on the sticks and Johnny Stanch at the wheel. The boat ran great and was a real treat to blast down the Jersey Coast on! Island Runner is a Full stagger race boat with a six man cockpit for those who don't know. :) Pics to follow in a day or two I have to dump them onto the computer.

[lucy]

just for the record, Warpath II is not "the Rabbit" this is Yellow Warpath before and now.!