Who is the most copied boat builder?

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

It is probably Aronow. Magnums and Cigarettes have been splashed, stretched and remolded over and over. Skaters must be a close second with there designs and step configurations mirrored in many boats. Who else has created something worth copying?

Cigarette stickers show up on everything under the sun. I can't count how many people I have seen adding Cig decals to a boat. I did recently see a Polaris jet boat with a Baja sticker on the side. That was a first for me.

[2TR]

Most copied boat builder would be the Aboriginal people in Australia. They have been there for around 50,000 years and some people say they built the first "boat" ...

[old377guy]

outside of our indigenous friends, you may be right Jim. Where did Larry Smith get his design for the 38 Scarab?

[Bobcat]

Gary Armington (sp) 25 ' Talon cat is way up there....and there was a Sidewinder V bottom that actually proved it was copied...the vent on one side was off a few inches...and it was copied exactly.....I think Peter Hledin could add a few that copied his Skater;)

[Flying Dutchman]

The 21 challenger would be another one with lots of "children".

[Offshore Ginger]

Wow Sidewinder and to tell you the truth that hull has been copied for years now , and not to mention that when i worked at Thompson Boat Co we were building them which was a copy, of a copy of a copy, of a copy and the list goes on .......................................from the West coast to the East along with Canada ..............and yes Skater without mentiong any names has had the $hit copied out of it .

[phragle]

how many different 24x7's are there??

[phragle]

and then you can get a 41 apache, mcmanus, chief, saber, pantera, north coast,checkmate, In sure i missed a few other companies. Almost forgot, Saber (the company) its assests and molds are currently for sale, so if your interested you could throw your name in the hat too..... (you would of course, be responsible for getting your own leather jacket though):willy_nilly:

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

The 21 challenger would be another one with lots of "children".

I love it. "Lots of children."

I raced a 21 Challenger with a 12 or 18" bracket plus a 12" jack plate with a hot 2.4. One of the funnest rides ever in Key West. Great Boat!

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

how many different 24x7's are there??

Yep, what was the original?

Was it a Superboat, Wellcraft, PTM? or what?

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

The Fountain 10 Meter was a stretched and modified Excaliber.
A 30 Velocity appears to be a stretched and modified 29 Mirage.
A 26 Thoroughbred is an extended 22' Velocity. Same designer. 22 was a Great Boat.
A 25 Motion is a mildly stretched 24 Skater.
The list goes on.

What is the most copied hull?

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Was it a 27 Magnum?
A 38 Cigarette?
36 Skater?

[Flying Dutchman]

233 formula shows up in alot of places as well...

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Wasn't Formula originally an Aronow boat and the first of many on NW188st?

I may be mistaken. Any know for sure?

[old377guy]

Wasn't Formula originally an Aronow boat and the first of many on NW188st?

I may be mistaken. Any know for sure?

Yes, but I thought that the Formula 233 was a Bertam derivative

[Offshore Ginger]

http://www.supernova19.com/pre_history_at_supernova19_com.htm Nova Marine at SuperNova19.com (http://www.supernova19.com/nova_marine_at_supernova19_com.htm) there are two links here .

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Great reads Artie!

[rschap1]

Saber is for sale??

[old377guy]

That was a good chronology Artie - thanks

[phragle]

yep...

[Offshore Ginger]

I really thought the photo taken with Don and the Beatles in a Formula back in 65 was really interesting , and where were all of you back then Ha Ha Ha .And for starter's .....when is the last time you heard I wanna hold your hand by the Beatles ....................................

[Offshore Ginger]

I can almost bet that more then a few of you have already seen this which more or less is a restoration in process which in my opinion is a very interesting read considering Coyote was actually the start of ................................................. http://www.joesboats.com/

[Ryan Beckley]

Yea, the 25 Talon, is definitely one of the most copied, almost all of the west coast builders have splashed it a time or two, plus Motion, American Offshore, Aronow and I am sure a few more.....

[Ratickle]

The Fountain bottom designs seem to get copied a lot in the Vee community. No one copies the "Beak", but the bottoms are popular here in the later days of the step designs. The latest knockoff has certainly improved in handling and performance over the original.....

[Steve 1]

and then you can get a 41 apache, mcmanus, chief, saber, pantera, north coast,checkmate, In sure i missed a few other companies. Almost forgot, Saber (the company) its assests and molds are currently for sale, so if your interested you could throw your name in the hat too..... (you would of course, be responsible for getting your own leather jacket though):willy_nilly:

That Pantera is NOT a copy !

[Offshore Ginger]

:hurray:Welcome back ole friend.................. long time no see .

[old377guy]

That Pantera is NOT a copy !

Thanks Steve, I didn't realize that.

[Bobcat]

:hurray:Welcome back ole friend.................. long time no see .

:iagree:

[phragle]

That Pantera is NOT a copy !

Derivative....

75638

[Ratickle]

From Pepe......

Paul, Steve's post is in Re/ to the 41' Pantera which he built the molds for, before I got them.

Re/ the 24' x 7' the original boat was a magnum built w/ outboards for Doc Magoon, original mold was bought from magnum and sold to Excalibur in Sarasota.

While the molds were in Miami a duplicate set of molds was built by P+D and there you have the PD 24' while in late 1975 I bought a PD changed the deck and asked PD to build me the Pantera verson but their build was junk, so I took my deck mold and made the hull mold and there you have Pantera (me) building the boats.

About that time Superboat was born by having PD build a few boats and then basically doing the same as I did.

I think (not to brag) the pantera 24' became the most popular of all 24/7 because of all the racing I did back then especially the Miami to NY run in 1978.

There you have it from the horses mouth.
Thks,
PP

And a quick follow-up......

Forgot one thing,
I consider Steve Koss to be probably the most knowledgeable and experienced all around guy in the go fast boat biz.
I mean that! (and have told him)
PP.


And along Pepe's thoughts, I think the Pantera may be the most popular because of the bullet-proof build quality they do. How many times have you read about a Pantera breaking in rough water???????

[Ratickle]

Which, getting back to the original question of this thread, makes the Magnum the most copied Vee ever in my opinion. The Excalibur was also the base model for the first Fountain from what I recall. The first dozen or so Fountains were even built at the Excalibur factory I believe...

[Bobcat]

Noah....hands down.....:eek:

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Noah....hands down.....:eek:

Oh yea.. Show me a picture of one afloat.

[phragle]

Oh yea.. Show me a picture of one afloat.


75646

[Buoy]

I have to agree that I think the 27 Magnum was the base of a majority of the iconic hulls over the years.
At least the vee hulls.
If I'm not mistaken, the 35 Misstress was also based on this hull.
If I could have 3 boats in my stable it would be a 24 Pantera (have one), a 27 Magnum, and a 35 Mistress.

[old377guy]

25' Nova Marine, 31' Bertram, 41' Apache

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

10 Meter, 21 skater wi twin's, 38 SE Cigarette and why not a 25 Bertram cruiser.

[Ratickle]

10 Meter, 21 skater wi twin's, 38 SE Cigarette and why not a 25 Bertram cruiser.

Because that's 4, not 3......:toetap05:

[Offshore Ginger]

Bertram Baron , another 27 - Magnun Sport , 35 - Cigarette Mistress , and if it was a cat it most likely would be ................................. a Skater .

[old377guy]

Pamela Anderson. Catherine Zeta-Jones, Vanessa Williams

[Bobcat]

For Pamela you'd better have an "OLD 377 GUY Tattoo spaced out accordingly:sifone:

[Offshore Ginger]

To tell you the truth is Pamela a girl that old 377 could really have safe sex with, and live to tell about it .............or Die with a big smile on his face before having a organism .:p

[T2x]

Funny that Sidewinder is mentioned here as something that was "copied" since they started out by putting a Rayson Craft deck on a 16' Glastron hull. Add Glastron to this list as they were the basis for companies like Checkmate, Baja, Sidewinder, Wreidt, and others. Also don't forget Allison whose hulls are the very foundation of almost the entire bass boat industry (except for those taken from Glastron of course).

T2x

[old377guy]

To tell you the truth is Pamela a girl that old 377 could really have safe sex with, and live to tell about it .............or Die with a big smile on his face before having a organism .:p
Hey! do I need to be offended or something? How many times do I need to point out to you clowns that I'm SENSITIVE?

[old377guy]

Funny that Sidewinder is mentioned here as something that was "copied" since they started out by putting a Rayson Craft deck on a 16' Glastron hull. Add Glastron to this list as they were the basis for companies like Checkmate, Baja, Sidewinder, Wreidt, and others. Also don't forget Allison whose hulls are the very foundation of almost the entire bass boat industry (except for those taken from Glastron of course).

T2x

Thanks Rich

[Ratickle]

Funny that Sidewinder is mentioned here as something that was "copied" since they started out by putting a Rayson Craft deck on a 16' Glastron hull. Add Glastron to this list as they were the basis for companies like Checkmate, Baja, Sidewinder, Wreidt, and others. Also don't forget Allison whose hulls are the very foundation of almost the entire bass boat industry (except for those taken from Glastron of course).

T2x

What's your guess as to the "Most Copied"?

I'm thinking there has to be several classes of copies. As you say; Bass Boats/Padded Semi-Vees, Catamarans, and Deep Vees. What else?

[T2x]

What's your guess as to the "Most Copied"?

I'm going to stick with the 14 and 16' Glastron hulls as the"most copied".... They had a lower price point than the 24 Magnum/Donzi/Aronow (whatever it started as).... and therefore spawned higher volume. In addition the bass boat and skiffs that were pulled off of "re-pops" would probably fill volumes. Another Glastron that was copied shamelessly and repeatedly is their 15' trihull which also has a number of fishing and skiing descendants worldwide.

[Offshore Ginger]

:iagree: http://www.classicglastron.com/gl-carlson-index-web.html http://www.classicglastron.com/gl-preglastron-carlson-index.html

[Ratickle]

My first boat was a Glastron Carlson with a 115 Rude. Had to have a "Bond" copy right after the movie came out...... (Then it ended up having a 235 Rude on it)......


"in 1973, the company built 26 Glastron and Glastron/Carlson boats for the James Bond film “Live and Let Die.” Seventeen boats were destroyed in the 100+ practice jumps to find the optimum speed and ramp design to achieve what became the world record 110' jump. The Glastron GT-150 flying over two police cars became a cover story in Time magazine."


http://youtu.be/B-fy87rSSwk

[Offshore Ginger]

Great clip !!!

[Ratickle]

And that's the real "Bond, James Bond", not a copy!!!!!:sifone:

[old377guy]

Does Timothy Dalton even count?

[Ratickle]

Who? :sifone:

[phragle]

Who? :sifone:

That would be Daltrey not Dalton... Nice guy, ran into him a few times around san diego.

[Ratickle]

Great clip !!!

One of the best movie boat chase sequences of all time, if not the best ever.....