Handgun for a friend question

[Ratickle]

Another option is a Taser. As has been said, a weapon you can't effectively use is more of a detriment than a benefit. And ANYONE can use a Taser.

And ask Bill how well they work.... (45Sonic)

[MarylandMark]

And ask Bill how well they work.... (45Sonic)

[Chris]

I'm reasonably impervious to most things and I think I'd have preferred to have been shot. It sucks the will to continue out of you like a giant harda$$ vacuum cleaner.

[X-Rated30]

Actually, we are drinking buddies and we drink WAY too much for someone in our group to own a taser. We would be testing that **** on each other and comparing how much alcohol we need to drink before we agree to have it done to us.

Also, Ammo is $25 a cartridge if we get it through our local Sheriff.

Funny thing... I was talking to some female baliffs and ALL of them agreed getting shot with the Taser wasn't that bad. LEOs that carry a taser have to experience it or they can't carry one. Every big burly macho dude I have ever talked to about the experience agreed with Chris. Keep in mind, these are court support women - not the rough and tumble dykes that wanna crack heads in the streets, but motherly types. Some were grandmothers. Maybe child birth really is that bad, LOL!

[X-Rated30]

Now back to the XD9 sub - what do you think?

[Chris]

Some people have had good luck with the S/A handguns. I have not. Personally, I would consider carrying only one brand of handgun if it were being used to protect my life- HK.

[Uncle Dave]

Some people have had good luck with the S/A handguns. I have not. Personally, I would consider carrying only one brand of handgun if it were being used to protect my life- HK.

I dont know of any modern revolvers that are S/A only (unless someone bobs a hammer)

What single action only weapon did you have a problem with?

I ask because out of curiosity because I have problems with all kinds of weapons across the gamut of sizes and actions.

some automatics Ive had issues with-

Walther PPK - yes the famous Walther PPK is PP of ****e
AMT - Hardballer ridiculous operationally but very cool.

The revolver that gives me most fits is a Chrome S&W 686 - after magnum rounds it wont index anymore and the cylinder binds..

It was supposed to be smiths answer to the python- hardley.




UD

[Chris]

S/A = Springfield Armory

[Uncle Dave]

S/A = Springfield Armory

Ahh...

Grashopper understands.


UD

[Trim'd Up]

I have a 686, and it is a great shooting gun, never had a problem. It was my dads duty weapon for alot of years, and has had a ton of 357 mag loads through it.. I have never seen a chrome 686. I am ALMOST positive that there was never a chrome 686. In fact, I believe the 686 is just the stainless version of the 586 which was available in nickel. Nickel plating did cause some problems on revolvers. Mine is polished stainless that looks like chrome but it's not. 686/586's were probably the best selling revolver S&W ever made. They were very big with law enforcement in the 80's. They are just K frames with a different cylinder to accommodate 357/ 38 +p.

[Sea-Dated]

Some people have had good luck with the S/A handguns. I have not. Personally, I would consider carrying only one brand of handgun if it were being used to protect my life- HK.

I have a 4" XD 40 and have fired several thousand rounds through it and the only issue I have had is if it gets too dirty, like 750 rounds without a cleaning, the slide stop will keep the slide open when there are still rounds in the clip. Never had a jam or any other problems.

I love my XD and would buy another one in a heartbeat.

[Uncle Dave]

I have a 686, and it is a great shooting gun, never had a problem. It was my dads duty weapon for alot of years, and has had a ton of 357 mag loads through it.. I have never seen a chrome 686. I am ALMOST positive that there was never a chrome 686. In fact, I believe the 686 is just the stainless version of the 586 which was available in nickel. Nickel plating did cause some problems on revolvers. Mine is polished stainless that looks like chrome but it's not. 686/586's were probably the best selling revolver S&W ever made. They were very big with law enforcement in the 80's. They are just K frames with a different cylinder to accommodate 357/ 38 +p.

I have the weapon in my hands right now.
Chrome was not the correct word.
Its a 6" SS 686. with aftermarket Hogue grips.
I stand corrected.

There is supposedly a recall on this particular revolver for just this issue and I might be able to dig up a few threads that discuss the problem.

I had a 4" blued 686 that was great- Im sure your dads was great- This particular 686 is a POS.

I defy anyone to show me three cylinders of .357's without a bind. Thats being generous

Its F-d and gunsmiths around here dont want to touch it-

(anyone out there know a good local one?)



UD

PS: Weapon is sitting on my parking ticket receipt for "no front plate-" GRRRRR

[Uncle Dave]

Security & more deterrence.


UD

[Slick02]

Theres no reason to modify the trigger if you buy the concealed hammer version, there is actually a hammer to cock with your thumb, its just real small, a slight knurled nub on the back of the pistol. The DAO, "dual action only" or commonly called hammerless versions have a stout and long trigger pull that take some time and frequent practice to master.

If I'm not mistaken Smith calls that a shrouded hammer and I would keep her away from the hammerless 38's due to not being able to de-cock them, and I personally have never been a big proponent of giving the average female an automatic of any kind.
Just my personal opinion, not meant to offend anyone.

[Uncle Dave]

If I'm not mistaken Smith calls that a shrouded hammer and I would keep her away from the hammerless 38's due to not being able to de-cock them, and I personally have never been a big proponent of giving the average female an automatic of any kind.
Just my personal opinion, not meant to offend anyone.

The ability to de cock easily is a big deal, especially in the home. (grandson/neighbor mistaken for burglar) hence my comments about which small autos have a de-cocker. Preferably a silent HK style de-cock- not the Ruger P80 stye that sounds like a "dry firing"- this could potentially escalate a situation you want calmed down.

Beginner + female + automatic for me has been an especially bad combo.

An experienced Female with standard arm /hand strength- no problem.

Id advise some reading along with the handgun experience a book called "in the gravest extreme" by Massad Ayoob.

He is a highly respected former LEO with tremendous knowledge of the system & the book is loaded with good sound advice.


UD

PS: here come the "decocker" jokes........

[Sea-Dated]

PS: here come the "decocker" jokes........

In my best Beavis voice.....

He said cock........

[Ratickle]

PS: here come the "decocker" jokes........

I thought that had been upgraded to Bobbit?????

[X-Rated30]

...I personally have never been a big proponent of giving the average female an automatic of any kind.

I have personally never been a fan of arming a woman. There is a fair chance you will see my name in the "victim" space in the report.

But I took a chance starting this thread looking for some information, because she lives alone in the country and works in the court system. I know most people like small frames in .38 for newer female shooters, but she doesn't have the finger strength for a revolver in D/A mode. As she squeezes the trigger her hand begins to shake from the exertion, so much so that even at close range it could cause a miss or non-debilitating hit. And no - she can't afford a $500 handgun and $300 in trigger work.

Yes, ideally a revolver would be nice for a newer shooter, but with a little training, I see no reason an intelligent young woman can't carry an XD9 safely and with some practice in her purse. I mentioned getting her in the CCW class, and there is little more training out there - certainly very little til after you get past that step. We talk of "clearing drills" and what ifs, but frankly the average handgun shooting involves 5 rounds or less, regardless of weapon capacity.

Someone mentioned trouble loading auto clips and cycling the action. Neither of these should be done while there is a life threatening situation going on. A revolver is the best handgun ther is for the first 6 rounds... Does that mean autos are useless?

Sorry to vent, but I guess this thread went from "does any one have a suggestion?" to "If you can't carry a $900 auto or work a DA revolver, don't carry." Thats not correct and all of you know it.

...Theres no reason to modify the trigger if you buy the concealed hammer version, there is actually a hammer to cock with your thumb, its just real small, a slight knurled nub on the back of the pistol.

Ummm lessee... if she has trouble pulling a trigger in a dire situation, why would a bobbed hammer make ANY sense? This shows as little thought for the original question as the "limp wrist" opinions. At least someone with a safely carried weapon could get the first round off accurately... I'd consider this a distinct advantage over an unarmed potential victim.

Frankly it isn't an ideal situation, but I believe the knowledgable folks on this board can come up with an acceptable solution that might allow her to carry safely to and from her office/car/house. Training is important, but I was asking for a good mechanical situation. Don't wail on me too bad - I am really looking for some good info.

[Trim'd Up]

You said yourself that most shootings involve 5 rounds or less. Why carry an XD that is bulkier and heavier due to the high cap? (not dogging them in anyway, I have one)
If you are wanting to get her into an auto look into the Ruger LCP. They are reasonably priced, easily concealed and light. If trigger pull is really an issue than I guess a 1911 pattern compact, maybe in 9mm, carried cocked and locked would be the best bet, but they are pricey.

[Chris]

You are maybe misunderstanding some of the advice being given here.

If you're going to carry ANY autoloading pistol, you either need to be proficient at clearing a misfeed or a failure-to-fire or you need to come to grips with the fact that you may be carrying a single-shot pistol. Maybe.

I own a number of autoloading handguns and I can tell you there are only a few that I would carry for self-defense. I have experienced issues failure issues with almost all of them. I'm at the range at least 2 or 3 times a week and see lots of people clearing obstructions from their autoloaders and I get asked lots of questions about what the problems are. And this is the primary reason that law enforcement agencies mandate what an oficer will and won't carry- and they spend much time and much $$ determining what weapons to choose. I only know of two or three departments that authorize the Springfield piece you're asking about- and only as a secondary (backup) weapon. Virtually everyone mandates Glock or SiG. To be blunt, if you choose a revolver purely to avoid becoming proficient in the use of an autoloading handgun, you have no business carrying it in the first place.

I think the most important take-away from this discussion is she really shouldn't consider purchasing or carrying a weapon if she's not committed to becoming proficient in it's use. And that takes training and practice. And not just once. And at the risk of being sexist, I think it's even more important for a woman. Not only just he mechanics of discharging the weapon, but techniques for employing it. Self-defense shooting is never a planned event. You're being forced to react to someone else's plan. That makes them events that occur on purely instinctive action on the part of the victim. And, quite frankly, if you have no instinct, you ARE better off not having a weapon. It's hard to beg for your life after you've tried unsuccessfully to kill the assailant.