It's good to be King........

[Brownie]

Three of our tin Cougars leading the Key West Worlds in the early 80's. Gentry's red 48' looks funny because Sammy James, the throttleman de jour, discovered that it didn't fit in his shop, so he cut off the bow by a foot or so. We had a couple or three years where nobody messed with us. Our braintrust in England had more empirical knowlege about the full range of cats in general than the rest of the world put together, but the world was gaining fast. James Beard, Clive Curtis, Peter Birkett, the Cunningham brothers and the rest of them gave us some great stuff to play with. In my five years there, we built 85 or 90 different boats, no two alike. We sunk more tonnage of raceboats than the average U-boat in WWII, but we learned something each time.

[phragle]

good god Brownie!! be carefull!!! naming a thread "It's good to be king" people will start to think you have succumbed to the kool aide!! Your stories are too good and your knowledge to vast to partake in the evils that abound!!

[Ratickle]

Three of our tin Cougars leading the Key West Worlds in the early 80's. Gentry's red 48' looks funny because Sammy James, the throttleman de jour, discovered that it didn't fit in his shop, so he cut off the bow by a foot or so. We had a couple or three years where nobody messed with us. Our braintrust in England had more empirical knowlege about the full range of cats in general than the rest of the world put together, but the world was gaining fast. James Beard, Clive Curtis, Peter Birkett, the Cunningham brothers and the rest of them gave us some great stuff to play with. In my five years there, we built 85 or 90 different boats, no two alike. We sunk more tonnage of raceboats than the average U-boat in WWII, but we learned something each time.

How long was the course then?

[skrap]

The Benihana Grand Prix in the late '70's and early '80's was 208 miles for Open Class 1.

[phragle]

innovation and dedication are wonderfull things.. I try to explain to people on another forum I am on that bolting on aftermarket parts makes your quad as fast as the next...stand back..think build something better.

[Sean Stinson]

The Benihana Grand Prix in the late '70's and early '80's was 208 miles for Open Class 1.

That was real offshore racing not tunnel boat racing like they have now

[skrap]

If you can see land...you ain't racin' offshore!

[Scarab KV]

If you can see land...you ain't racin' offshore!

[tony davis]

the Cunningham brothers .

John Cunningham builds all of my fuel tanks. Great guy and a fantastic welder.

[T2x]

good god Brownie!! be carefull!!! naming a thread "It's good to be king" people will start to think you have succumbed to the kool aide!! !!

Take it from me....Brownie is the ONLY one who can claim the "Crown" from that era. We tried to knock the mantle off and made a pretty good effort, and so did Apache and Fabio...... but in the end the 80's belonged to Cougar.

Since then the "Crown" has rested on only one other head.... Peter Hledin's.

When you think about it, very few marques (2) in the last 30 years have dominated the sport worldwide.

My hat is off to both groups......

T2x

[T2x]

That was real offshore racing not tunnel boat racing like they have now

Don't insult tunnel boat racing...............

What they have now is more like a parade.

T2x

[Airpacker]

Don't insult tunnel boat racing...............

What they have now is more like a parade.

T2x

albeit, a very fast one....................

[T2x]

albeit, a very fast one....................

You obviously haven't slept through a "Bracket" class race lately.

[Fast Shafts]

I went to alot of races in the 70's and 80's, it was more of a "parade" back then, waiting for 20 minutes for a 40' boat to "race" by every 20 minutes-at 70 MPH. Now class 6 races at that speed. Although its not perfect, bracket racing in the ocean (with short courses) is still better, and more competative than the "old days". I guess the older one gets-the better it was.
As a fan, I liked what Mike A. did with Factory I and 2. Close racing, courses that one could see (they still raced in the ocean), and similar boats racing. If I'm not mistaking, this is how/why NASCAR became so big...
OK T2X, start slamming me....
I do agree that Brownie/Cougar brought this to another level and could claim the "Crown" from that era.

[Sean Stinson]

Lets face it the speeds todays boats are running coupled with an old time course.....if they could survive it..... would be real offshore racing!!!!

Sorry Rich didn't mean to offend the tunnel boat guys....

Also I know of many boats back in the day that were faster than 70 mph....The question was could they do it in real water not bay racing.....

[T2x]

.
As a fan, I liked what Mike A. did with Factory I and 2. Close racing, courses that one could see (they still raced in the ocean), and similar boats racing. If I'm not mistaking, this is how/why NASCAR became so big...
OK T2X, start slamming me....
I do agree that Brownie/Cougar brought this to another level and could claim the "Crown" from that era.

Why would I slam you? To each his own. I agree that Factory 1, 2 and 3 ("Spec" Racing) levelized the playing field (Factory 3 is today's Super Cat Lite). I also agree that the same "spec" formula is what drives Nascar and,while I do sleep through Sprint Cup races on Sunday afternoons at times, that has more to do with my easy chair and general end of the week exhaustion than the competition model presented. On the other hand if Nascar had a "speed limit"....nobody would tune in. Add to that highly suspect GPS technology, and the whole "bracket" concept is called into question. I watched Joe Imprescia take a boat that was propped at 75 mph max on the limiters and be DQ'd because he "broke out" at over 90 mph......according to the onboard GPS.

My fundamental belief is that close racing involves actual racing....not locking a bunch of raceboats together with an artificial, inconsistent, and sometimes subjective speed tether. I know many of the bracket guys and I respect some of them, but in most cases what they do each week is more like showing off than racing.

T2x

[Sean Stinson]

The old Key West course was real water....trust me if that course was run today then you might have something!!!!!!!!!

[T2x]

I went to alot of races in the 70's and 80's, it was more of a "parade" back then, waiting for 20 minutes for a 40' boat to "race" by every 20 minutes-at 70 MPH. Now class 6 races at that speed. Although its not perfect, bracket racing in the ocean (with short courses) is still better, and more competative than the "old days". I guess the older one gets-the better it was.
.

I agree with the 70 mph speeds in the 70's, but the racing was very even...and much closer than 20 minutes between boats.

BUT!!!!!

As far as the 80's are concerned...... speeds skyrocketed.

The Cougars, Conquests, Buzzi's, Cuvs, Skaters, Maelstroms and Shadow/Chris cats all raced at speeds between 100 and 160 mph in that decade...(H*ll, Willie Diaz AVERAGED over 100 mph in a Sport class boat as early as 1982 and the Open boats were in the same range already). The racing was quite close as well (The slugfest between Popeye's and Morales at Sarasota being one prime example).......

Today you have Turbine and Extreme boats racing against themselves..... and that is not only boring, it is an insult to real racing. On the other hand, I am more amazed (dismayed) at the so called "fans" of this nonsense, because their support just feeds the poor competition model that they tolerate without knowing any better.

T2x

[T2x]

The old Key West course was real water....trust me if that course was run today then you might have something!!!!!!!!!

One year we ran halfway out to the Dry Tortugas, came back and ran to Sand Key made a left and ran parallel to the reef the full length of the island, back in toward shore...along the South Coast of Key West and back into the harbor....only to start the course all over again. Now you can see the whole course from a single vantage point...... and none of it is in big seas.....but there is unparalled opportunity to wave to the crowds in the harbor....and you are never out of sight of your "posse".

T2x

[smokeybandit]

Having been to a few races with the new inshore format I must say that I find it boring. The problem with the format is that it just isn't offshore racing. Maybe it's semantics. The sport was created to test man and machine in the open ocean. This seems a whole lot more like hydroplane racing. Not that there is anything wrong with that, it's just a totally different animal. The sport drew more attention and spectators when we raced "offshore". Maybe that was the characters or the drug money but the sport has not grown into what it was in the heyday.