Thinking about a shotgun

[Buoy]

The rule of thumb for a home defense weapon- there's nothing more useless than an unloaded weapon. The second most useless thing is having that weapon on the other side of the person looking to do you harm.

I fully agree with this.
I keep my handgun within arms reach of my bed - loaded, but chamber empty and safety on.

I am far from a gun nut, but I certainly am strong on the right to have and carry (although I'm not CCW certified or do I feel the need to be).
Just realized a guy at work has family in the firearms/sportsman shop biz. Never really talked to the guy, but maybe I will tomorrow.

[jryan26]

Hey Chris
I had a friend tell me about home defense shot gun shells that were much shorter that 2 3/4 shells. He said that he saw them at a gunshow. Have you heard of these?

[Sea-Dated]

Great thread. I have a .40 for carry but am looking at a shotgun to keep under the bed for home defense.

[Chris]

Hey Chris
I had a friend tell me about home defense shot gun shells that were much shorter that 2 3/4 shells. He said that he saw them at a gunshow. Have you heard of these?

I have a vague memory of something like that from years back. If you need something like that, go to a 20 gauge.

The big issue is over-penetration. You don't want to shoot through a wall behind your bad guy and kill one of your own kids. iI this is a possibility, you might want to step down to #1 shot or even #4. Another thing to remember is you don't want any choke in your barrel. Your hunting shotgun with a 22" barrel and a full choke is a bad choice for home defense. You're dealing with very close ranges (measure your longest hallway or down your staircase) and it does you no good if all the shot is still inside of the wad's shotcup. You might as well use a 9mm and hope for a hit.

Someone mentioned a sawed-off shotgun. Another poor choice. Not only does a very short barrel give away alot of velocity, you're also now deafened by the first shot and flash-blinded. Smokeless powder is progressive-burning and made to burn down the length of the barrel. In a 10" barrel, half the powder is unburned and expelled in a loud, brilliant flash. Not good if you need to make a follow-up shot on a second assailant- or if you missed.

This brings up some other good points- you really should fire your home defense weapon in a dark enclosed space without hearing protection- at least once. You don't want to fire down that staircase and be so startled that you drop the shotgun and it slides down to your assailant's pal. Try shooting it left-handed too. It's hard to make a semi-concealed shot from cover on the right side of an opening without firing left-handed. You don't want your first time to be the one you need to do it right.

[jryan26]

I keep 7 1/2s in my shotty in the house. It still is not real fun to shoot with the pistol grip/

[Buoy]

Some very good discussion here.
I'm learning alot.
I don't think I'd want to try to handle one of those pistol grip shotguns. I'm not a real big guy (5'11 165#) and I think I'd rather have something to hold steady in my shoulder.
Again, my intention is to never need to use the gun - But I'd like to have it in the event I need it, and in that case, I wouldn't be afraid to use it.

[stecz20]

Some very good discussion here.
I'm learning alot.
I don't think I'd want to try to handle one of those pistol grip shotguns. I'm not a real big guy (5'11 165#) and I think I'd rather have something to hold steady in my shoulder.
Again, my intention is to never need to use the gun - But I'd like to have it in the event I need it, and in that case, I wouldn't be afraid to use it.

only way to know what you like is to shoot a lot of different guns... most places will rent you anything you can shoot, so its a easy way to see what feels good... i know what i think is cool does not always feel good in my hand.. i shot a lot wheni was a kid and my close buddies are getting back into the swing of things....

[Chris]

I keep 7 1/2s in my shotty in the house. It still is not real fun to shoot with the pistol grip/

The 7 1/2's will only penetrate about 2- 3 inches. You can cause some nasty flesh woulds, but if your assailant is motivated, they can definitely return fire.

[Ratickle]

Here's what you're talking about. It's why I have the 1300.


Straddling both the law-enforcement and civilian markets for low-recoil shells is the unique offering from the Mexican manufacturer, Aguila. It's the 1 3/4-inch, 12-gauge Minishell. This cute little number was designed originally for the law-enforcement and military market. Given its compact size, officers can carry a lot of them, and 12 to 14 Minishells can easily fit into the tube of a 20-inch riot gun. Only the Winchester 1300 pump will cycle them without a hitch, but they are just perfect for single- and double-barrel guns. The Minishell comes in three combinations. There's a 5/8-ounce load of 7 1/2s a 7/8-ounce slug load, and a duplex buckshot load consisting of seven 4-Buck plus four l-Buck. Minishells are beginning to appear in local retail stores where their low recoil and recreational qualities haven't gone unnoticed by the shooting public. They're fun to shoot and a great conversation piece at the range.

[Chris]

We are talking about the close confines of a house. If I do not end your life with one blast, I would have to be Hellen Keller....Then again I have a second round......not to mention my other alternatives. Ever see the spread pattern of a 10 gauge in close quarters, say from 10 to 15 feet....Then again to each his own. My opinion.
High-Tide

Another common misconception- actually two. First, there are very few places in the average home that you'll be shooting 15 feet. 7 feet is the average distance for a residential confrontation. Second, even with a cylinder bore, the average pattern for 00 buckshot at 10 feet is about 8". Certainly better than a single 9mm projectile, but you still need to have a decent aim.

[insanity]

this is what I have its the Marine Magnum Remington 870

A highly durable 12-gauge utility gun that resists corrosion on land or water. Electroless nickel plating covers all metal, including the inside of the barrel and receiver. The synthetic stock has generous checkering for positive control. Comes with 18" Cylinder barrel with single-bead front sight, six-round magazine, padded Cordura® and sling swivel studs.

I second this vote, both for the overall length and the additional shell capacity. Would convert my current 870 but pops commandeered it for turkey hunting. I plan to add one of these myself after I find a 1911.

[Ratickle]

Watch this.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PK3xt...eature=related

[MattBMiller]

Remington 870 Express w/18" cylinder bore barrel and pistol grips. I'll take some pics.

[jmeng]

Pump action- scary noise and absolute reliability

Planning on putting together a home defense shotgun myself pretty soon. Everyone talks about the noise from racking a slide but why would you not keep one in the chamber? My worry is that waking up in the middle of the night with the dogs barking and alarm blaring, the slide release (or whatever the thing is called) might be hard to find. Especially for my wife if she's home by herself. I was thinking about finding a beat up old 1100 and shortening the barrel on it.....

[Audiofn]

Buy a good dog and the need for most of this discusion is moot. If you are going to keep a gun by your bed side then please make sure that the kids in the house understand what it is and take them to the range to understand how to shoot. Go to the range often yourself and shoot so that if god forbid you do ever need to use your gun you hit what you are aiming for. I shoot on average once a week.

[BradB]

Good home defense gun, has a pistol grip also but I like the standard stock better. Mossberg Mariner...... . Good for the boat also!!!!

[Chris]

Planning on putting together a home defense shotgun myself pretty soon. Everyone talks about the noise from racking a slide but why would you not keep one in the chamber? My worry is that waking up in the middle of the night with the dogs barking and alarm blaring, the slide release (or whatever the thing is called) might be hard to find. Especially for my wife if she's home by herself. I was thinking about finding a beat up old 1100 and shortening the barrel on it.....

You don't need to use the slide release if you have a full mag and an empty chamber if you pulled the trigger on the empty chamber once you loaded it. The shotgun noise making the bad guy leave it GREATLY PREFERABLE than having to engage in a gun battle so why not use it. Pump shotguns are like revolvers. They ALWAYS go off. Automatics can and do have cycling issues. If you have the skill and experience to deal with a clearing drill on a semi-automatic weapon in a high-stress situation of exchanging gunfire in your home in the middle of the night in your underwear... you get the picture. The best home-defense weapon is practice. Buying a gun and parking it until the very moment you need it is a very bad idea.

If you have barking dogs and an alarm and you still have concern about repelling armed assailants, you need one of these-

[jmeng]

If you have barking dogs and an alarm and you still have concern about repelling armed assailants, you need one of these-

I wouldn't say concern but always wonder about what if. Good point on dry firing it.

[Chris]

Watch this.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PK3xt...eature=related

The guy in the vid mentions "tube jam". What he's talking about is a double-feed from the magazine. The magazine tube has a small pawl that releases one cartridge into the lower receiver which is then lifted up into the action and fed into the chamber. It pops back and prevents the next shell from following it in. If you put an extended magazine tube on a shotgun it makes this problem more prevalent. 7 shells compress the follower spring more than 5 and that increases the tension on those first two cartridges. If you really think you'll need more than 5, you probabaly need more guns- or a better neighborhood. Or a different line of work

More isn't always better. Fancy isn't always better. More arguments have been ended with the old, now-useless .38 Special round fired from an old-fashioned Smith revolver than all other calibers combined.

[Chris]

I wouldn't say concern but always wonder about what if. Good point on dry firing it.

Too many people get caught up in thinking about the exchange of gunfire portion of having a stranger in their home. The often overlook the most important objective- making the threat to their family go away. I would gladly trade my TV and stereo equipment for not having to risk engaging in a gun battle. Even if I have a higher skill level than the guy that sneaked into my home, he might get lucky. Even if I win cleanly, I now have a whole batch of issues on my hands that I really don't need. If I can skip all this by scaring them into leaving, I'm up for that option. Sure, I'm going to have that moment of being pi$$ed and wanting to do these scumbags in, but I also don't want to risk the potential costs associated with that happening. Plus, I have insurance.

Like the guy that shot the two burglars on his front lawn last year in Texas- He may not have gone to jail, but I'm certain he spent a nice chunk of his retirement on lawyer's fees to make that happen.