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    It should be very interesting when it comes out.........
    #1
    Icon/Founding Member Top Banana's Avatar
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    This past Saturday, a forum was held in Fort Lauderdale to discuss boat building, in regards to offshore racing in the 1960's.

    Brownie, Harry Schoell, Michael Peters, Richie Powers, Sammy James, John Conners, Bobby Saccenti and myself, were invited to sit down with the editor of Professional Boat Builder Magazine and Nick VanHoff who recently restored the old 31 foot Bertram, White Tornado.

    Unfortunately Bobby was still working on a boat that was scheduled for delivery and could not make it. I had planned to be there, but just lost a very close friend who had suffered through cancer for more than a year and was attending his funeral, so my son was invited in my place.

    From what I have heard about the forum, it was both lively and very informative. It was filmed and recorded the edited copy of the forum will be available to the public at some point in the future.

    Amazing what these guys did with fiberglass and automobile engines, in such a short space of time that changed offshore boating forever. I can't wait to get my copy of the film.
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    #2
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    That is quite the list of Offshore guru's......
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    #3
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    I would loved to have been a fly on the wall. Can't wait to see the video.
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    #4
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    #5
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    Come on Charlie. Can't we get a few leaks slipped out????
    Getting bad advice is unfortunate, taking bad advice is a Serious matter!!
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    #6
    Icon/Founding Member Top Banana's Avatar
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    I was able to see a sneak preview of the filming.

    Funny part when the writer for professional boat buildera magazine, asked a very logical question.....Say guys, it has been a long time since you competed against each other ......and those boat designs have been updated by the newer companies coming out with multi step designs etc. So looking back with 20/20 glasses, what boat design was the best?

    Silence filled the room, nervous looks from one to another and then finally Sammy James breaks the silence. Sam says....What no one seems to understand is that kind of racing was much different than today's style of offshore racing. By the late 70's the designs of the hull and the engines were all pretty even, so it really got down to the crews. After a certain point, it was up to the crew to decide if they could physically and mentally take the beating they knew they would get if they continued.

    For Instance, a Key West race that I won in a 38 foot Bertram back in the 70's, we raced from Key West out to Fort Jefferson, which was Dry Tortugas. When we got there we had to turn around and go back to Rebecca Shoals and then back to the harbor in Key West. There is a photo of my boat about 50 feet in the air. How do you get a boat that high? Well fortunately for the racers that day, there was a US Coast and Geodesic survey crew working at Rebecca shoals. In their log book they noted....The wave heights at Rebecca Shoals on this date are 18 feet.

    When the boat came down off one of those waves, it broke. We could see the water surface from inside the boat when we were flying. But I knew that if you bring a boat back in first place and it is really broken, you are a hero. If you break a boat and don't win but bring it back....your a zero. So we were in first place and only had another 40 miles or so to go, so we pushed it and we won.

    At the dock was the Governor of Florida. He was going to stand on the deck of the boat and give us this big trophy, but the boat was sinking so fast, I had one of the crew take the boat over to the crane and get it out of the water. So in answer to your question, it was how tough the crew was, not the boat design. You knew you were going to get beaten up on a rough day, but how much could you take and would it be more than the guy in the next boat could take.
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    #7
    Icon/Founding Member Top Banana's Avatar
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    Another funny story came from Brownie. He had the use of a big 53 foot Magnum that was owned by Victor Borge. Brownie was asked to provide a boat for a checkpoint, so not wanting to be alone on the big bad ocean, he invited a few of his female friends along. They were instructed by Brownie that whenever Davey Gilmore came by for a check....they should all moon him.

    Well after a few laps of this, they started to moon all the racers and then some of the racers started to return the favor etc etc. Sammy says.....Nice Brownie I leave my wife with you for safe keeping and when I turned at the boat, all I could see is your idea of fun. Brownie says, I kept your wife safely away from my girlfriends, she was not on the forward deck, she was in the stern of the boat. Sammy says, Thanks.
    Light travels faster than sound....that is why some people appear bright until we hear them speak!!
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    #8
    Founding Member / Super Moderator Ratickle's Avatar
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    I am looking everywhere for a picture of Sammy "about 50' in the air". Anyone recall seeing it at any time? Which Bertram was it?
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    #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Top Banana View Post
    Funny part when the writer for professional boat buildera magazine, asked a very logical question.....Say guys, it has been a long time since you competed against each other ......and those boat designs have been updated by the newer companies coming out with multi step designs etc. So looking back with 20/20 glasses, what boat design was the best?

    Silence filled the room, nervous looks from one to another and then finally Sammy James breaks the silence. Sam says....What no one seems to understand is that kind of racing was much different than today's style of offshore racing. By the late 70's the designs of the hull and the engines were all pretty even, so it really got down to the crews. After a certain point, it was up to the crew to decide if they could physically and mentally take the beating they knew they would get if they continued.

    For Instance, a Key West race that I won in a 38 foot Bertram back in the 70's, we raced from Key West out to Fort Jefferson, which was Dry Tortugas. When we got there we had to turn around and go back to Rebecca Shoals and then back to the harbor in Key West. There is a photo of my boat about 50 feet in the air. How do you get a boat that high? Well fortunately for the racers that day, there was a US Coast and Geodesic survey crew working at Rebecca shoals. In their log book they noted....The wave heights at Rebecca Shoals on this date are 18 feet.

    When the boat came down off one of those waves, it broke. We could see the water surface from inside the boat when we were flying. But I knew that if you bring a boat back in first place and it is really broken, you are a hero. If you break a boat and don't win but bring it back....your a zero. So we were in first place and only had another 40 miles or so to go, so we pushed it and we won.

    At the dock was the Governor of Florida. He was going to stand on the deck of the boat and give us this big trophy, but the boat was sinking so fast, I had one of the crew take the boat over to the crane and get it out of the water. So in answer to your question, it was how tough the crew was, not the boat design. You knew you were going to get beaten up on a rough day, but how much could you take and would it be more than the guy in the next boat could take.
    Well, I cannot be 100% positive, but I'm thinking the boat was Whittaker Moppie and the year was 1974. Following is what I've been able to find. You'll have to get ahold of Sammy to see if this is correct.
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    #10
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    Excerpts from Sports Illustrated, link below

    Romance versus realism on a cruel sea
    In Key West's offshore powerboat race the rooster tails were as lofty and the men as intrepid as ever, but ignominy awaited a new marvel and injury a salty old hand. Even for the winner it was touch and go

    by Robert F. Jones
    Originally Posted: November 18, 1974

    It is easy to romanticize the sport of offshore powerboat racing—and almost as dangerous as the sport itself. Once they have gotten to speed, the long, slim hulls seem to leap from wave to wave with the grace of a greyhounding marlin. The crews, standing erect against their padded back rests, appear almost military in their insouciance, like so many young PT-boat skippers dashing to meet the Imperial Japanese fleet. The sound of the engines, as visceral as anything heard at the stock-car track; the lofty white rooster tails erupting yards behind the slashing screws; the loud and lovely violation of the rolling seas for nothing more than the hell of it and a piddling $2,000 first prize—all of it puts one in mind of old-time automobile racing back before that sport got so costly in terms of life and loot. But in Florida last week, during the 12th annual running of the Key West Offshore Race, romance got the deep six and a hard, briny realism ruled the waves.

    For openers, the favorite in the field of 10, Paul Cook's "tunnel-hulled" catamaran Kudu, crashed into the first checkpoint boat only a few minutes after the start of the 190-mile race and retired in ignominy. That was not the only error. Another boat whose crew was new to the Key West course missed a check-point out in the flats and took off for Texas, despite the ardent pleas of officials on the voice radio. It had to be herded back by airplane. Worst of all, the veteran Roger Hanks and one of his crewmen were seriously injured when their Blonde III suddenly swapped ends at 80 miles per hour. The race was eventually won by another old pro, Miami's Sammy James, in the 38-foot Bertram Whittaker Moppie, but just barely. The slam-bang stresses of the ride peeled the fiber-glass rear transom from James' boat as neatly as if Poseidon himself had slapped it away.

    .............................................

    The sudden end of Hanks' stern chase left the race to the front-runners. Sammy James, 40, a vice-president of the Bertram Yacht Company, led from the start clear on out to the Dry Tortugas, nearly 100 miles west. Then trim tab troubles forced him to ease off on the throttle. Bob Higgins of Miami, driving The Red Baron, a 32-foot Cigarette of ancient and honorable lineage (it had won the 1971 world championship), nipped into the lead as the boats swung around the Tortugas and began the pounding ride back home. That was too much for James. "I was worried about stability," he said later. "The seas were standing up out there, up to 14 feet high, but I told my throttle man to nail it and we went right back after them."

    And catch them he did, blowing home with a 2½-minute lead over the Baron. A crowd of more than 5,000 lined the dock-side at Mallory Square and cheered James in. Then came the traditional dunking and champagne ablutions all around. James' total elapsed time of two hours, 51 minutes worked out to an average speed of 66.7 mph, not a record but plenty fast enough for the day. Only six of the original 10-boat field finished the race and for a while it looked as if only five would do it.


    Full Story: http://www.si.com/vault/1974/11/18/6...on-a-cruel-sea
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    #11
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    Getting bad advice is unfortunate, taking bad advice is a Serious matter!!
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