Can America ever have a real open ocean offshore race series again?

[Top Banana]

I hope this will open a dialogue with many people, both in America and anywhere else, that have an interest in this type of racing. Before we even start, let's all agree that the type of racing that we are talking about here is the historic type of offshore races, like Miami to Nassau and Around Long Island....not the shore type races that have developed over the years in the sport.

THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THE SHORE RACES..... EXCEPT...THEY ARE NOT THE HISTORIC OR CLASSIC TYPE OF OFFSHORE RACE.

I'm not being critical, just looking for dialogue to keep the old stuff alive. Let's keep it positive here and maybe we can actually make some progress with this.

When the modern era of offshore racing started, the races were long point to point events. The first boats used were rather ordinary types of powerboats and the attrition rate was very high. Often just making it to the finish line meant you would win. The publicity that was gained by this kind of racing in the boating world, was noted by the boat manufacturers and they saw an opportunity to promote their product as not only fast, but also very reliable. As could be seen by the results of the race, their boat was safe and could bring you and your family home under actual sea conditions.

Added to this was an element of young men who were actual veterans of WWII and were looking for that combat rush that they no longer got in the civilian world. The engine manufacturers were in there too, trying to prove that this brand was the best outboard or this type of drive. Sterndrive was better than a V-Drive or straight shaft etc etc. Add in the many bilge pump and engine oil people and you had a sport that had quite a large foundation of products that could see positive benefits from participating in it.

The sport evolved into the form that seemed to be the final accepted version. When Don Aronow built and raced his 32 foot Cary in 1969, he set the bar at what has been copied ever since. A Deep Vee design boat over 30 feet, with twin big block motors set in staggered formation, driving two high speed sterndrives, carrying enough fuel for long distances and manned by a driver, throttleman and navigator. The boats grew larger as the horsepower increased and was able to power them, but the basic design and layout stayed the same. When anyone looked at a boat like that, they knew it was capable of racing offshore anywhere in the world.

I don't want to get into a cat vs a vee debate here, for the sake of this conversation let's stay with deep vees only and when we get that worked out, we can expand it further if there is interest. As the Brit's do, they limit their offshore racing to deep vees and boats with no canopies. This helps to maintain the value of the old race boats so much longer. Just look at the recent results of a older aluminum deep vee with new Ilmor power winning the Cowes race this past year.

What can we do to generate interest and support for this type of racing again? I propose a circuit of no more than 4 or 5 events per year that are geographically located around the country and actually run on the old classic courses. Around Long Island, Miami to Key West, Great Lakes and California.

[old377guy]

Charlie, thanks for your balanced approach. I seems like a positive approach to set aside the arguments about which format is "better" and simply note the historic value of the older point to point races.

[Ratickle]

I think there is opportunity to do so.

The biggest issues have started to be sorted out the last couple years with Bimini and Long Island.

Number one issue, when. I almost think the events have to be in conjunction with something else. Like the first Bimini run was with the OPA race and many of the required assetts were there for the race. So, possible choices that come to mind.

West coast.
A. San Diego used to have one that Bon Nordskog did. I don't recall the distance, but I think it was a couple laps of around 100 miles each? I'm positive Bob Teague would know. They have a speed week there that may work with it.
B. I think the Rum Run to Catalina ran every year until 2011?
3. Los Angelos to San Francisco. Does Nordskog still hold the record?

Great Lakes
A. Chicago, Milwaukee and back. Didn't T2x run that in an 18 foot outboard or something nuts like that?
B. Chicago, Michigan City, Milwaukee, Chicago.
C. Detroit, Cleveland

North East
A. Long Island
B.

South East
A. Miami, Bimini, Miami
B. Miami, Key West (One Way)
C.


What other events are around that could tie these in on the previous weekend, or maybe the day before?

What are all of the old offshore events that would make sense now days?

[ciao]

The Brits do allow canopies.

If only to keep Vee's cigarettes dry

[ciao]

Something I put together in my spare time last year.

http://vimeo.com/28408999

Fairly sure you can do the same over there?

[Ratickle]

Nice vid, I really like the true offshore races.


I'm not so sure the classes shouldn't be revisited for over here. What do you use there as a list of classes?

[seeroy]

CIAO - WOW! You just took me 43 years back in time. My brain has the itch...too bad my body can't. - Steve Sirois

[Bobcat]

Outstanding ! I've been wanting to watch that for a couple of days.....but my computer dictates what and when I get to watch something.

[Ratickle]

CIAO - WOW! You just took me 43 years back in time. My brain has the itch...too bad my body can't. - Steve Sirois

I think you and Charlie could win that thing......


Ask George about his new shock absorber seats.....

[C35]

europeans want competition. americans want trophies- and are willing to pay for them. that's our new self-esteem thing. every kids a winner. now every adult is a winner.

too many 1 boat classes. its a joke.

[Sean Stinson]

There are a few of us out there that would love to see this kind of series come to life I for one have been very vocal a while back about it!!!!! But it seems to generate alot of interest but at the end of the day not alot of participation!!!!!

[C35]

There are a few of us out there that would love to see this kind of series come to life I for one have been very vocal a while back about it!!!!! But it seems to generate alot of interest but at the end of the day not alot of participation!!!!!

follow the money. no sponsors means the guy payin the bills makes the rules and thats the owner. Owners wanna win or at least have a trophy. offshore has never had sponsors much beyond the owners real business. boat racing is like airplane racing. few want to see it.

[Ratickle]

I think there is a small amount of thruth in that. But, thatis also part of what ruined the sport of offshore racing. These classes with one boat participating for an entire season talking about their undefeated season is rediculous. The last time I looked up "Race" in the dictionary, it was against a competitor or clock record. Then they have the audacity to talk out loud about why there is no television coverage or major sponsorship? COme on, when was the l;ast time you saw television cover any race with only one vehicle or person competing against nothing? They call those demonstrations, not competitions.....

So, in the old style offshore races, I'd have participation trophies, runs against the records that stood for that particular class with another trophy if you broke it, and classes with more than one boat would have the addition of the chance to get an additional trophy for winning their class overall, or finishing on the podium if 3 or more boats were in that class.

The difference between boat racing and airplanes, the numbers of people who own boats and drive them vs those with their own airplanes who fly them.

Somehow we have to get back to having the possibility of someone's dream coming true. Everyone out there knows their chances of racing a Geico or similar type boat is miniscule. But, almost everyone of them know they may have a chance to race a 24 Pantera or Cigarette against thier buddies 26 Velocity someday. But, we've managed to make it so there is not even a class for the two to compete on an even basis except in a GPS limited competition where the biggest, most expensive, motor wins.

So, what Charlie is proposing is a very good opportunity for those who care to make critical input towards a small solution. Those who love offshore racing should assist with positive input and "what if's" in my opinion.

[C35]

i dunno if geico did more good or harm. they drew some fans but distracted fans from the racing with their show runs.

racing will bump along aimlessly until the promoter is stronger than the racer- permanently. nascar, indy, drags works cause it costs $$$$$$$ to build a speedway.

its never gonna work with so many diff boats and classes. but nobody wants to have to buy a new hull so there's a class for every boat- and a trophy!!



whens the last time you heard a poker runner say they werent going because there wasnt enough prize money? lots of these runs draw way more than most races. why is racing different?

[Top Banana]

In the old days, the promoter, Red Crise offered you a room in Nassau if you made it over there for the Miami to Nassau race. He promoted it as the toughest race in the world. He built up the expectation of those who would participate, so if you won or just finished, you would feel like you accomplished something worthwhile. Can the racers of today be satisfied with that feeling or do they really need the trophy?

For those of us who run an offshore boat in the ocean.....we know the feeling of trying to adequately describe that to a boater who stays on a lake or bay...now magnify that 100 times and try to explain racing an offshore boat in the open ocean with 360degrees of horizon. You only were successful because you could navigate and you only won because you could navigate and run harder and faster than anyone else in real ocean conditions.

If we could only get these guys to try it just once, they would not go back to poker runs or beach racing ever again. The NY races in September attempt to do that. Either the 271 mile race for the experienced or the 100 mile race for those who want to try it. Maybe it will grow each year as more people try it.

[Bobcat]

[Sean Stinson]

follow the money. no sponsors means the guy payin the bills makes the rules and thats the owner. Owners wanna win or at least have a trophy. offshore has never had sponsors much beyond the owners real business. boat racing is like airplane racing. few want to see it.

I would disagree with that your point has some validity but still companies have put money into the sport and substantial amounts at different times!!!!

[Ratickle]

Other than Mercury Marine, what are some of the others who have contributed substantial amounts of time and money to promote the offshore racing classes? There was the short-lived GM support with the Vortec program, but who else?

[Top Banana]

Benihana, Hennessey Cognac, Budweiser, Witco Chemical, Amalie oil, US Coast Guard....they ran a boat in the early Miami to Nassau races.

[Ratickle]

I guess I was thinking since the fracture of the offshore ranks into several seperate organizations. We have Amsoil and Geico currently, but I believe the majority of both of their involvement with sponsorship goes toward a specific boat, not for an event or series of events.