The Auto Racing thread...

[MikeyFIN]

Before we screw up the Apache threads with offtopic I thought this would be a proper topic and start of a thread here instead.

Fact is F40 was never intended to be a racecar per factory as the Rally B group got axed (because of Henri Toivonen and Italo-American Sergio Crestos death at Corsica) and sportscars was on the demise in road racing in general.
It was "just" a tribute to Enzo of his 40 yrs in the car biz and a opposite contender to Porsches 959 Hitech wonder.
It was not until the mid 90´s that privateers started asking about Factory support and firstly the Factory turned their backs because that car is a tube frame car wrapped in carbon sheets.

IMO If Ferrari would´ve gone the racecar route from day one it woulda been a Carbon monocoque. Just like (earlier) Alfa Romeo with their 33 TT12 made instead of a tube chassis a cast magnesium monocoque (safe???) provided by Campagnolo.

F40 was considered to be a Rally car, what a bastard idea in itself as they are 2wd´s and have no chance against the Porsche 959, Audi S1 or Lancia S4´s.
Even in LeMans the Porsche 959 put F40 on the backburner, still I like the F40 more than a 959 and have witnessed it on a racetrack but mustered only times a homemade C3 smallblock Vette could do... although the CSBin
question RPM´s more than the F40 and sports a Guldstrand upgrade plus a T-56 and some minor mod´s only (*minor in my eyes...).
But seeing it take of in full force on the Street was astonishing although I´ve been personally even in faster 4 door Malibus...or ElCaminos.

So the question of Ferrari asking Michelotto didn´t come from the request of Ferrari but the owners of F40´s who wanted to race and be competitive and especially after the production of F40 had ended.
A F40 had no chance against an McLaren. The 1995 LeMans just proves it when the F40 program was in full force and led by late Olofsson
and Della Noce.
One JJ Lehto made the fastest laps of the race at night...and F40 drivers faced a brick wall.

Some race results from the F40 years.
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/1403/90s.htm
And a F40 registry with race info
http://www.qv500.com/ferrarif40p7.php

Therefore IMO the F40 is one of the perfect 80´s icons...they´ve had more show than go.

MikeyFIN

[Dude! Sweet!]

Did the C3 Vette happen to have Bob Riley's name stamped on the chassis and John Paul's name over the door?!

I don't know much about the F40s but to be slower than a lightly modified C3 Ferrari must have really dropped to ball on the cars balance and geometry... Because you're average C3 is diabolical.

A guy I grew up with held the short course record at Watkins Glen in an A production Vette. He said it was the second worst handling race car he'd ever driven.

[MikeyFIN]

No names and here´s a pick of it....
Although this is not how it looks like anymore, a bulge in the hood and lowered some and different set of wheels...


And yes a C2/C3 is the second worst car I´ve driven too and I´ve driven several of them.
Still I like them all from 1965-1972 the 65/66 being the best and as Coupes. A runner up would be a 69-72 Ragtop, all manual of course.

[MikeyFIN]

And when we got into talking about bad handling cars I´d think this suits the thread...

The Widowmaker ;

[Dude! Sweet!]

I'll vote for the De Tomaso Pantera in IMSA trim as the worst handling race car ever.

I love the Vettes as well. Frankly the C3 is actually my favorite. I love the JP3 (Riley IMSA car) and the Greenwood cars. Of course my love of those cars doesn't change the fact that they were play-things compared to the later iterations of the 935.

I'll post pics that I think you'll enjoy when I'm on my office computer next.

[Dude! Sweet!]

I'll vote for the De Tomaso Pantera in IMSA trim as the worst handling race car ever.

I love the Vettes as well. Frankly the C3 is actually my favorite. I love the JP3 (Riley IMSA car) and the Greenwood cars. Of course my love of those cars doesn't change the fact that they were play-things compared to the later iterations of the 935.

I'll post pics that I think you'll enjoy when I'm on my office computer next.

Not bad for an old lady, huh?

[Dude! Sweet!]

Couple more...

[MikeyFIN]

Not bad for an old lady, huh?

as home built as one can be and therefore genuine american

Would love to get my hands on some crossram intakes for f.i. in CSB/CBB form...

[MikeyFIN]

I'll vote for the De Tomaso Pantera in IMSA trim as the worst handling race car ever.

.

Did somebody mess up a good Dallara platform???

[Dude! Sweet!]

as home built as one can be and therefore genuine american

Would love to get my hands on some crossram intakes for f.i. in CSB/CBB form...

Yah, we're planning on putting the x-ram on this Camaro...

That Vette is homebuilt, but built in the home of Bob Riley... Former NASA aeronautics engineer and future legend of sports car racing.

He doesn't build them out of his house anymore...

http://www.rileytech.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riley_&_Scott

Then again, Tony Cicale built a lot of high end Indy and prototype motors in his home garage!

[Dude! Sweet!]

Did somebody mess up a good Dallara platform???

This would have been around 1974 or so and my recollection is it was a Category I car built by a small race shop in Georgia (US). I don't think the Dallara guys had much to do with it! Then again, I don't think the Dallara guys could have helped it much either!

[MikeyFIN]

This would have been around 1974 or so and my recollection is it was a Category I car built by a small race shop in Georgia (US). I don't think the Dallara guys had much to do with it! Then again, I don't think the Dallara guys could have helped it much either!

Well Gianpaolo Dallara himself designed the Pantera chassis and It´s not that bad...
And Dallaras have been ruling the Formula3´s totally the last 20 years...

Panteras in Grp5 did quite good regarding the funds they had and the Competition they faced in Europe.

[MikeyFIN]

Yah, we're planning on putting the x-ram on this Camaro...

That Vette is homebuilt, but built in the home of Bob Riley... Former NASA aeronautics engineer and future legend of sports car racing.

He doesn't build them out of his house anymore...

http://www.rileytech.com/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riley_&_Scott

Then again, Tony Cicale built a lot of high end Indy and prototype motors in his home garage!

I Do know who Bob Riley is

A lot of good racecars are built in small garages at home actually.
A Friend did a Renault Megane for Super Touring all by himself and it even won some...

[Dude! Sweet!]

I figured you knew! I do know what you do for a "semi" living... Ha ha ha.

It doesn't entirely suprise me that the Panteras did well in europe. I don't know if it was a chassis set up philosophy difference or what, but back then, it seems like cars that worked over there frequently didn't work as well here, and vice versa. I think the Group C to GTP conversions were probably the most obvious example of that. Especially the TWR and Group 44 Jaguars.

Roger just said that the cars were sensationally unbalanced.

[Dude! Sweet!]

It also suprises me that with all of the people here who are in to high performance marine, very few also appear to be into sports car racing. This thread will likely only go on as long as you and I decided to prattle back and forth about it!

[kidapache]

my car 900hp

[Dude! Sweet!]

my car 900hp

Nice ride Paul. V6 turbo car?

Speaking of, this is one of my favorite all time V6 Turbo cars...

[Pete B]

Pics from SCCA racing @ Daytona Motorspeedway
Taken July 2009
http://www.seriousoffshore.com/forum...ead.php?t=9280

[Dude! Sweet!]

Nice pics. I haven't been to an SCCA race in years. Probably since I stopped running IT and started running my AIX car with NASA.

[Dude! Sweet!]

Mikey, here you go... Race Pantera for sale.

http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/ot...55136553ss.htm