View Full Version : Breakthrough cat.
Brownie
03-01-2009, 05:51 PM
I think that everyone who was fortunate enough to ride in this boat thought that it was the best ever (back then). The wooden cats we delicate, but very true. This was built for Howard Arneson, and then sold to Gentry. It was the best running of all the 4 engine cats, in my opinion. By the way, Fast Donzi, I told Pizza Bucket 'hello' for you. He said 'back to you'.
FastDonzi
03-01-2009, 06:19 PM
Thanks, wasn't it Me, You & Peter that where out on your Lil 15' Whalerish boat with 2 different brand outboard motors and we took one (wave) over the bow :ack2:coming in haulover cut? He's a fun dude to hang around. Whats he doing over here, just visiting? or do you and him have a secret project going???
Steve 1
03-05-2009, 10:15 AM
Mr Arneson likes that color combination, He had a boat called Sea Sweep at the old Bushmills race.
chewiekw
03-05-2009, 10:32 AM
Was that when Tony Garcia drove the boat? Did it actually ever race before Gentry bought it?
Great picture
Brownie
03-05-2009, 11:16 AM
Tony and Keith Hazell were leading the Key West Worlds when they turned to corner to come into the harbor, they hit the bump that is always there, went airborne for about fifty yards, landed and smapped off both propshafts and props.
glassdave
03-05-2009, 11:50 AM
that bump is still there today :D
Great pics/stories Brownie, thanks.
Ryan Beckley
03-05-2009, 11:53 AM
That is the boat that is at the motorsports hall of fame in Talladega, right?
FastDonzi
03-05-2009, 12:51 PM
that bump is still there today :D
Great pics/stories Brownie, thanks.
Yep, it's there every time the tide heads out, I knew it was there and wasn't thinking and hit it going 85mph in a 26 corsa, very much a azzhole tightening moment.
Mr Arneson likes that color combination, He had a boat called Sea Sweep at the old Bushmills race.
Here are two of the Sea Sweep boats.
That is the boat that is at the motorsports hall of fame in Talladega, right?
Yes
Wrong boat. This is the 38
Tony and Keith Hazell were leading the Key West Worlds when they turned to corner to come into the harbor, they hit the bump that is always there, went airborne for about fifty yards, landed and smapped off both propshafts and props.
Howard sent a diver down to try and find the propellers. Surprised looking back that the ASD6 propeller shaft would have held both engines compared to what we have today.
Steve 1
03-05-2009, 02:33 PM
Here are two of the Sea Sweep boats.
I think I was next to him at the dock there.
Steve 1
03-05-2009, 02:36 PM
Wrong boat. This is the 38
When It got to Cougar on 188 St we did a partial Rerig and I put a 3/8" Aluminium overlay on the transom . Cool days.
Anchored
03-05-2009, 02:49 PM
Here's the one at Talladega.
Jeff
Anchored
03-05-2009, 02:50 PM
More...
Ryan Beckley
03-05-2009, 03:45 PM
It's really amazing how many different cockpit and hatch configurations that it went through. Like the one show in rigging with those monster hatches......I LOVE these posts....Rik, how old were you when this was happening? Who's rig shop was that?
chewiekw
03-05-2009, 03:58 PM
Did the boat really weight 25,000 pounds? That's more then the 50 foot aluminum Popeyes did that only weight 18,000?
skrap
03-05-2009, 06:07 PM
Hey Rik,
Here are a few picture from when I was with Howard in 1982.
John
It's really amazing how many different cockpit and hatch configurations that it went through. Like the one show in rigging with those monster hatches......I LOVE these posts....Rik, how old were you when this was happening? Who's rig shop was that?
The 38 and 48 were rigged at KS&W back in the early 80's. The third Arneson boat was called "Arneson Special" which was formerly owned by Eddie Trotta. Had a little sticker on it.
Hey Rik,
Here are a few picture from when I was with Howard in 1982.
John
Is this you:)
skrap
03-05-2009, 06:14 PM
Rik,
Here are all three boats from my collection of pictures.
John
skrap
03-05-2009, 06:21 PM
Rik,
Great picture! Yes that is Tony Garcia, Howard Tobeck, Me, and Howard Arneson. That was taken at the Coral Gables Challenge Cup, Arneson's first win. Thanks for posting it. All my best to you and Howard! I'll be sending you more pictures.
John
They changed the engine scoops back then around a couple of times.
It really is amazing how shallow the free board is on these cats. The engine hatch was just that a complete engine hatch as the deck was at the block level unlike todays cats.
chewiekw
03-05-2009, 06:59 PM
why did Howard sell the 38 to then go our and buy another 38? Was the second one lighter?
Howard had a 48' being built so he sold the 38' and the 48' was taking longer than expected so he purchased the second 38' from the Gov.
chewiekw
03-05-2009, 07:21 PM
Did Tony race the original 38 back in Key West worlds in 84 under the name SHERATON KEY LARGO? and didn't the second Arenson become Surgin?
Ryan Beckley
03-05-2009, 07:26 PM
The second one was SURGIN' if you ever catch the movie "RUSKIES" shot in KW you can catch a glimpse of it being repaired in a Stock Island ship yard. It later became KalKustom and was DESTROYED in a race out west some where....
skrap
03-05-2009, 07:41 PM
Rik,
Here's another picture of Me, Tony Garcia and Howard Tobeck on the deck of the 38' Cougar. I think this was from the 1982 Benihana Grand Prix in Point Pleasant Beach, NJ. Also there is a shot of the Arneson Surface Drives back in the "old days." Keep those pictures coming, there's a lot of offshore history there.
John
The second one was SURGIN' if you ever catch the movie "RUSKIES" shot in KW you can catch a glimpse of it being repaired in a Stock Island ship yard. It later became KalKustom and was DESTROYED in a race out west some where....
Howard sold the boat to Dr. Larry Spergel, a surgeon in SF. The boat was a winning boat, Spergel got it, won the first race and then changed the boat around with the help of Bonner and never won a race again. :ack2:
It sat for a while and Karl Kosker purchased it and raced it in POPBRA. It was pretty old by then as it was the mid 90's.
Sat down at Sanger for years and they were going to splash the bottom and make a cat but it never happened and it was destroyed to get rid of it.
Ryan Beckley
03-05-2009, 08:14 PM
Am I wrong? I thought I remember a picture of it, maybe in POWERBOAT, with canopies installed, but the boat blown apart in the water?????
chewiekw
03-05-2009, 08:17 PM
Thanks for the pictures. How many 4 engine cats were there with Arenson drives?
1) 48 Wood cougar (Arneson then Gentry)
2) 46/48/50 Aluminum cougar (Gentry)
3) 46 Popeye's Cougar
4) ?
1) 48 Wood cougar (Arneson then Gentry)
2) 46/48/50 Aluminum cougar (Gentry)
3) 46 Popeye's Cougar
4) 50' Jaguar (Dan Campbell)
5) Dirty Laundry
6) Recycler
A few more that I cannot remember at this moment.
Am I wrong? I thought I remember a picture of it, maybe in POWERBOAT, with canopies installed, but the boat blown apart in the water?????
I'll have to check with one of my guys. Its been so long now. I know that they had an internal steering hose let go and the boat spun in one race. I do not know if it ever had canopies on it though. Will have to ask.
Anyone with an old PB mag? Would be in the early 90's I believe.
chewiekw
03-05-2009, 08:49 PM
http://www.howardarneson.com/articles/masterofmotion.asp
Do you have a picture of Recycler?
Ryan Beckley
03-05-2009, 08:57 PM
46' Jaguar Insatiable......
Didn't the 50' Popeyes Cougar end up with Arnesons when it last raced....
46' Jaguar Insatiable......
Didn't the 50' Popeyes Cougar end up with Arnesons when it last raced....
The aluminum 50' Cat, the one that Chuck Norris raced in had the 4 Eickerts (PSI's back then) and two Arnesons.
http://www.howardarneson.com/articles/masterofmotion.asp
Do you have a picture of Recycler?
It was the original "Big Thunder Marine" Boat
http://www.powerboatmag.com/four-in-one.html
Thanks for the pictures. How many 4 engine cats were there with Arenson drives?
1) 48 Wood cougar (Arneson then Gentry)
2) 46/48/50 Aluminum cougar (Gentry)
3) 46 Popeye's Cougar
4) ?
Dirty Laundry
By the way..
This is all Allen Brown's Fault!!:)
fobes
03-06-2009, 06:09 AM
Rik: you mentioned Dan Campbell's 50' Jag, do you happen to know what happened to that boat?
Great pics all, please keep them coming, nothing beats the old school stuff.
Thanks: Matt
Ryan Beckley
03-06-2009, 11:19 AM
Actually Campbell had 2 different 4 engine Arneson Jags......
FastDonzi
03-06-2009, 12:27 PM
Wasn't it Dan Campbell That crashed into the Back of Errol Lanier in sarasota, Errol was racing an A Class boat, Dan was in a superboat, Errols engine hatch went 150' up in the air he hit him so hard. In the drivers meeting there was specific instructions that bigger boats had to pass to the outside of the smaller boats, well Dan tried to cut inside him at the turn and smashed right into the transom.
Sean Stinson
03-07-2009, 10:44 AM
Rik: you mentioned Dan Campbell's 50' Jag, do you happen to know what happened to that boat?
Great pics all, please keep them coming, nothing beats the old school stuff.
Thanks: Matt
Call the Aqua Toy Store
RACESDAD
03-07-2009, 02:52 PM
here is a classic
RACESDAD
03-07-2009, 02:53 PM
found it in marina del rey in january...... for sale
Offshore Ginger
03-07-2009, 11:10 PM
It was the original "Big Thunder Marine" Boat
http://www.powerboatmag.com/four-in-one.html Funny thing seeing this because Frank and I reworked the fuel tanks adding more height to the tanks for more fuel capacity at Skater and talk about a BI*CH .
Dude! Sweet!
03-08-2009, 11:41 PM
found it in marina del rey in january...... for sale
When I looked at it last summer it was parked out behind a seedy strip joint up in Signal Hill.
RACESDAD
03-09-2009, 12:36 AM
it is at the little dealer where the coast guard station is
Dude! Sweet!
03-09-2009, 02:46 AM
Yah, recognized it from the photos. The guy who owned it when I looked at it must have sold it because its been up at MDR for a while now and has a revised "sales strategy". The guy I talked to was a repo guy named Sal (as I recall) and said he'd also be able to hook me up with a rig to tow it on the cheap.
The amount of work it would take to bring her back is overwhelming. Got to be someone with the passion and the pocket depth...
Sean Stinson
03-09-2009, 08:53 AM
Rik: you mentioned Dan Campbell's 50' Jag, do you happen to know what happened to that boat?
Great pics all, please keep them coming, nothing beats the old school stuff.
Thanks: Matt
Its for sale on the other site in classifieds under raceboats
fobes
03-09-2009, 09:26 AM
Sean: I saw that one but I remember another one that was featured in Hot Boat magazine a while back. If I remember right one of the sponsors was Payless car rental. The boat had a 4 man canopy and two tails above the engine hatches.
RACESDAD
03-09-2009, 06:40 PM
sean its stancombe here you fool.
Dude! Sweet!
03-09-2009, 07:41 PM
Which Sean me or Stinson? :D
Here's some photos from when it was on ebay. Didn't take any pictures when I went to look at it...
RACESDAD
03-09-2009, 10:49 PM
stinson !
it didnt have the drives when i saw it
Len S
03-09-2009, 11:23 PM
So were is it now?? whats it really worth????
Anyone heard of a real dollar amount to buy it
Who has other pic's of it and at the dock in the water
Dude! Sweet!
03-10-2009, 12:20 AM
I have some pics saved from the other site. I'll post when I'm on my computer. As I recall, price was around 15k maybe a litte more from the guy in LB.
Mike, that thing is all you! Paint it up in the Peppers colors, tilt it up and put it in the parking lot! :D
RACESDAD
03-10-2009, 02:56 AM
we bought the old charlie marks 48 McManus. had it for years. everyone remember that one?
it had 4 gentry turbo eagles in it.
Dude! Sweet!
03-10-2009, 12:23 PM
Len,
As Mike S said, it's in Marina Del Rey CA. Down at the south end by Bali and Tahitian Way right off Linlcon at the end of the 90 (if I've got by bearings right).
Here's a couple of in water pictured I'd saved from other websites.
Perlmudder
03-10-2009, 02:02 PM
are the engines connected?
are the engines connected?
They are running two into one combiner box like the Arneson does. So, technically yes, but not crank to crank like the new KE Engine that were at the Miami show.
Perlmudder
03-10-2009, 03:19 PM
They are running two into one combiner box like the Arneson does. So, technically yes, but not crank to crank like the new KE Engine that were at the Miami show.
cool. so whats the benefit of running only 2 drives on 4 engines? why not 4 drives?
Dude! Sweet!
03-10-2009, 04:10 PM
Keep in mind that I'm a know-nothing rube, but I'd guess it has to do with hydro drag on 4 drives and props, packaging space and more importantly more crap to break if you have more drives, steering, trim controls, etc.
Keep in mind that I'm a know-nothing rube, but I'd guess it has to do with hydro drag on 4 drives and props, packaging space and more importantly more crap to break if you have more drives, steering, trim controls, etc.
You left out the cost of purchasing 4 drives:)
With two drives, there is less stuff and the outside propellers on a quad drive do not seem to bite all that well as they boats lift out of the water at speed and that is the first place to lift and thus you loose efficiency on the outboard drives.
Dude! Sweet!
03-10-2009, 04:29 PM
You left out the cost of purchasing 4 drives:)
I assumed that with a guy like Gentry "cost" was measured in time, not dollars... :)
Sean Stinson
03-11-2009, 11:30 AM
we bought the old charlie marks 48 McManus. had it for years. everyone remember that one?
it had 4 gentry turbo eagles in it.
Yep that boat was built for Ben Kramer originally
chewiekw
03-11-2009, 04:04 PM
Did Mcmanus design that boat or was it design by cougar?
Sean Stinson
03-11-2009, 04:59 PM
Did Mcmanus design that boat or was it design by cougar?
Well according to legend it was all to Apache specs at the time
Well according to legend it was all to Apache specs at the time
It's a Cougar....... I'm not sure what McManus "designed"....but the Vee Apaches are stretched Cigarettes....and the Apache Cats were designed by Mike Peters with a little help from John McCall....The Eric's Reality Cougar was very much like the older Morales hull so where would McManus fit into this? I was unaware that he ever actually designed anything.....
T2x
Sean Stinson
03-11-2009, 06:39 PM
McManus never designed anything other than a vision now and then.....He was traded to Apache in a Don Aronow-Ben Kramer deal and was a number cruncher mgmt type guy....
Rich what I was referring to in legend was your interview with Jack Kramer concerning the Erics Reality boat remember that interview????
Ryan Beckley
03-11-2009, 07:24 PM
Hey Rich go watch the Big Seas APACHE DVD it mentions it being and APACHE / COUGAR a few times.....I can't remember who narrated those videos though?????
Jamie B.
03-11-2009, 08:02 PM
and the Apache Cats were designed by Mike Peters
I bet he leaves that off his resume.
I bet he leaves that off his resume.
Why?
Why?
Probably the same reason for Malstrom
Hey Rich go watch the Big Seas APACHE DVD it mentions it being and APACHE / COUGAR a few times.....I can't remember who narrated those videos though?????
That is the basis for the "legend"....Jack Kramer said on tape in an interview with me that the boat was built to "Apache specs". I still have no idea what that means..... but it does not mean that it was "designed" by Apache or anyone there. Even as he was talking I recall thinking that it looked like Maggies Mercruiser Special with the C/G moved aft. Watching it run...it might have had some additional rocker as well.
For the record, there were a number of things that I said on tape that was more in deference to our customers or what they said, than what I may have actually believed....or known to be true.
If a guy tells you his hull is the best on the planet.....and buys 10 tapes...who am I to doubt him...... :D :p
Besides....Phil (who paid for the gig) did the editing and cut out many of my more "colorful" candid comments.... :D
T2x
I bet he leaves that off his resume.
Why? The Apache Cat was a pretty good hull especially for the era. The boat he definitely should leave off his history is the Cigarette/Halter Cat..that he designed before he learned to pick other people's brains. That P.O.S. sunk in its one and only race.......although it wasn't as bad as Jacoby's monstrosity of the same year.
T2x
Sean Stinson
03-12-2009, 09:03 AM
That is the basis for the "legend"....Jack Kramer said on tape in an interview with me that the boat was built to "Apache specs". I still have no idea what that means..... but it does not mean that it was "designed" by Apache or anyone there. Even as he was talking I recall thinking that it looked like Maggies Mercruiser Special with the C/G moved aft. Watching it run...it might have had some additional rocker as well.
For the record, there were a number of things that I said on tape that was more in deference to our customers or what they said, than what I may have actually believed....or known to be true.
If a guy tells you his hull is the best on the planet.....and buys 10 tapes...who am I to doubt him...... :D :p
Besides....Phil (who paid for the gig) did the editing and cut out many of my more "colorful" candid comments.... :D
T2x
Esay Rich not trying to rile you up what I mean there were alot of claims for alot of things back then that really had no merit to them....I remember the interview and was chuckling abit as it played along.....You guys should bring back the blooper reels of those days....Now I would pay alot to see those!!!!!:sifone::sifone::sifone::sifone:
Esay Rich not trying to rile you up what I mean there were alot of claims for alot of things back then that really had no merit to them....I remember the interview and was chuckling abit as it played along.....You guys should bring back the blooper reels of those days....Now I would pay alot to see those!!!!!:sifone::sifone::sifone::sifone:
What you really want to hear are the arguments that Phil and I had........
It usually started with Phil saying into my ear piece in the helicopter----or on a dock.... "Richie...at the risk of annoying you.....etc, etc"........
Have him tell you about what I did with a rental car in Northern Michigan when one of our crew wanted to stop for cigarettes.
There are dozens of other Kodak moments that will be forever lost in the NNRT archives. The bottom line is that we were both passionate and, some might say, talented in a quirky way. We fought like cats and dogs but the result was often worth it. Later on when I got to sit in voice over studios at production companies for ESPN, Speedvison, Prime, MSG, etc..... it became slicker and more professional and I learned a lot, but Nothing beats the raw, honest realism of those original live to tape airborne moments. No video today compares to it...and probably ever will.
T2x
Jamie B.
03-12-2009, 10:58 AM
Why? The Apache Cat was a pretty good hull especially for the era.
T2x
Can you recall any races that one did ok in ? I seem to remember...maybe one...?
Sean Stinson
03-12-2009, 11:11 AM
It was a champion back in 86 I believe.....Lorne Liebel's boat ran well in 89 and just missed a championship!!!!!
It was a champion back in 86 I believe.....Lorne Liebel's boat ran well in 89 and just missed a championship!!!!!
That is not exactly correct. The '86 boat was a shaky wooden prototype and raced only a limited schedule. It also was in a stuffing accident in the Rochester, NY race that almost killed Bobby Saccenti. In fact Ben borrowed Sal Magluta's Cougar for the final '86 regular season race.
An Apache Cat, owned by a New England electrical contractor ("Wildcat" I think?) did win a Championship. Lorne's hulls were also quite competitive and one races to this day. I clearly remember watching Bobby Idoni throttle one of the glass Apache Cats in a rough race in Michigan and being very impressed with the rough water it was getting over and the speed it was maintaining. I also remember being very impressed with Idoni in that race as he never let the bow come up and kept the boat completely out of harm's way.
T2x
Sean Stinson
03-12-2009, 11:30 AM
Harold Street or Streep wasn't it & Smitty throttled it I believe!!! I just remember seeing the US-1 logo on one of Kramers glass cats with the small canopies on it....I have pics of Bobby being pulled out of the water in Rochester with Benny on the deck of the boat washing up on shore all busted up
Dude! Sweet!
03-14-2009, 04:31 AM
Harold Street or Streep wasn't it & Smitty throttled it I believe!!! I just remember seeing the US-1 logo on one of Kramers glass cats with the small canopies on it....I have pics of Bobby being pulled out of the water in Rochester with Benny on the deck of the boat washing up on shore all busted up
Sean, were you at that race? That was the first offshore race I'd ever been to ('86 seems like it was up in Charlotte but a million beers have gone through my brain since then) Typical of being at an event, we didn't really have a clue what happened until we read the paper the next day. Even though I'm a Pacific Ocean boater now, you'll never hear me talk sh*t about the Great Lakes not being "real offshore" they'll break your ass just as quick as the ocean (maybe quick if you consider that the conditions seem to be capable of changing more rapidly). Prior to that, the only "real" boat racing I'd see were hydros on Onondaga Lake.
Sean - his name was Dave Street- he owned an electric company in New Hampshire -
Richie - Thanks for the words- you always are good with words - too bad i never listened to you when editing - i would just turn off the sound and go for what I saw ! think I head enough when in the Chopper ! haha ! anyway - fun doing it all - and you were quite a Challenge - do you remember what color a bouy was in California - I can remember you and my brother Peter arguing about what color it was - i said to myself - WHO CARES ! hah !
As for the story in Rochester about buying Cigarettes for Dave Herbert - well- all i can remember is: I am not Thirsty ! - you can tell the story- others might enjoy it -
Phil
Sean Stinson
03-14-2009, 09:27 AM
Sean, were you at that race? That was the first offshore race I'd ever been to ('86 seems like it was up in Charlotte but a million beers have gone through my brain since then) Typical of being at an event, we didn't really have a clue what happened until we read the paper the next day. Even though I'm a Pacific Ocean boater now, you'll never hear me talk sh*t about the Great Lakes not being "real offshore" they'll break your ass just as quick as the ocean (maybe quick if you consider that the conditions seem to be capable of changing more rapidly). Prior to that, the only "real" boat racing I'd see were hydros on Onondaga Lake.
I was there and if memory serves me correct they had made a last minute decision to run the cat instead of the V bottom boat all in all Bobby Saccenti suffered a basil skull fracture and is the only one to survive that kind of injury Rich has more input on that I believe!!!
Sean Stinson
03-14-2009, 09:30 AM
Sean - his name was Dave Street- he owned an electric company in New Hampshire -
Richie - Thanks for the words- you always are good with words - too bad i never listened to you when editing - i would just turn off the sound and go for what I saw ! think I head enough when in the Chopper ! haha ! anyway - fun doing it all - and you were quite a Challenge - do you remember what color a bouy was in California - I can remember you and my brother Peter arguing about what color it was - i said to myself - WHO CARES ! hah !
As for the story in Rochester about buying Cigarettes for Dave Herbert - well- all i can remember is: I am not Thirsty ! - you can tell the story- others might enjoy it -
Phil
You're right Phil I was thinking of Smitty when I was typing and typed his real name instead....Its that whole thing of typing slower than you think or something like that....
Sean Stinson
03-14-2009, 09:40 AM
Here's a link to Liebels Apache Cat
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yc4kKHnYplI&feature=related
Sean Stinson
03-14-2009, 09:42 AM
Sorry Rich I just had to do it to you I couldn't resist after finding this......I will take all the onslaught from you my friend....I just cant resist!!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kf_-Hw1MVww&feature=related
Dude! Sweet!
03-14-2009, 12:50 PM
I was there and if memory serves me correct they had made a last minute decision to run the cat instead of the V bottom boat all in all Bobby Saccenti suffered a basil skull fracture and is the only one to survive that kind of injury Rich has more input on that I believe!!!
Ask my buddy Shawn ("Insurance God" on OSO) (who's parents inexplicably saw fit to spell his name phonetically rather than correctly) about living through a basal skull fracture... But I agree, incredibly low odds of survival.
I thought the guys who have that yellow "Apache" cat (with the cockpit back towards the stern) have had it running pretty decent over the last decade?
Thanks for those video links... NJPPC has some great stuff up on youtube! I know what I'll be doing on my next two hour conference call...
Sean Stinson
03-14-2009, 01:28 PM
I wasnt aware that he survived one as well......god bless him!!!!! Now we need to teach his parents how to spell correctly:D:D:D:D
Dude! Sweet!
03-14-2009, 02:04 PM
I wasnt aware that he survived one as well......god bless him!!!!! Now we need to teach his parents how to spell correctly:D:D:D:D
Yup, he's 10 feet tall and bullet proof. :)
mark30h
03-14-2009, 10:25 PM
I was at the Rochester NY race. I believe it was called the Coca Cola 313 or something like that. It was run out of Sodus Point, east of Rochester.
I remember that it was absolutely freezing cold that day. I think it was only about 15 minutes into it when the race was called after the Kramer/Saccenti crash.
An aqauintance had their 21 Liberator out on the lake to watch the races up close. Came in with the swim platform dragging off the transom after the beating it took on the lake that day.
Dude! Sweet!
03-15-2009, 01:03 AM
I was struggling to remember if it was Charlotte or Sodus. I was 15 then (just before my 16th b-day)... Now I'm an old fart who can't remember anything! At least I'm told I still don't look a day over 50! :D
catmando
04-01-2009, 10:25 PM
Mr Arneson likes that color combination, He had a boat called Sea Sweep at the old Bushmills race.I like it too.
chewiekw
07-09-2009, 06:48 PM
Didn't Gentry start using his own version of the Arneson drive? I think it was Gentry surface drive?
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