Why are Apache's so great?

[DollaBill]

Just had to!

[cigdaze]

Dunno...don't think I've ever heard that rumor.

[Chris]

Why? Because Saccenti wanted it that way.

[Sea-Dated]

What is an Apache? Is that like an old boat or something?:biggrinjester:

[Airpacker]

I believe they were so great because they were a fierce tribe of norht american natives. They liked to go to war to settle their differences and until moder man arrived with new fangled things called fire arms, they did pretty good.

[Chris]

Just like a Stradivarius is just an old fiddle.
:)

[Tommy Gun]

It's because Apache is easier to spell than Active Thunder.

[OldSchool]

It's because Apache is easier to spell than Active Thunder.


LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

[WMF]

Because I no longer own one!!:D

[fund razor]

Why is the sky blue?

Why do birds sing?

Why are Apaches so great?

All related questions and the answer is: because God loves us and wants us to be happy.

[Geronimo36]

Why? Because Saccenti wanted it that way.

At least Sunkin knows the deal!:iagree:

[TOMTBONE]

It's because Apache is easier to spell than Active Thunder.

:sifone::sifone::sifone::sifone:

[viperfitness1]

i heard a rumor that Apple mirrored the new 3g iphone capabilities after the apache 41. they did extensive studies of the apache boat and discovered how great it actually is!?! but its just a rumor...

[Wrinkleface]

i heard a rumor that Apple mirrored the new 3g iphone capabilities after the apache 41. they did extensive studies of the apache boat and discovered how great it actually is!?! but its just a rumor...

RUMOR CONTROL!!! it's mirrored after a 43 NT!!!!!!:seeya:

[fund razor]

RUMOR CONTROL!!! it's mirrored after a 43 NT!!!!!!:seeya:

I heard that the 43 NT needs steps, yes steps to get enough air under it.

Apaches use rough water for that. :D

[BY U BOY]

One word Warpath:)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cSR2Hay6uc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Dk5ihhAw64

[NJgr8ful]

Cuz they were all splashed off the original ... 35' Cigarette :D :D

[getchasum111]

uh....there not....

[Chris]

Not necessarily splashed- that infers a direct copy. But the 35 was expanded to be the 39 Competition, which was later shortened to 37'7", which became the 38 which is the basis for the 41 Apache. Or something like that. :)

[NJgr8ful]

Not necessarily splashed- that infers a direct copy. But the 35 was expanded to be the 39 Competition, which was later shortened to 37'7", which became the 38 which is the basis for the 41 Apache. Or something like that. :)

yup :cool: Obviously this is an Apache thread so there must be trouble and controversy ;) ;)

[Chris]

Apache- What's in a name?

[Wrinkleface]

I heard that the 43 NT needs steps, yes steps to get enough air under it.

Apaches use rough water for that. :D

But they R just itty bitty steps 2 help it settle on the trailer!!!!!:rofl:

[Bobby Saccenti]

Not necessarily splashed- that infers a direct copy. But the 35 was expanded to be the 39 Competition, which was later shortened to 37'7", which became the 38 which is the basis for the 41 Apache. Or something like that. :)

Hi Chris maybe this will help..

It started out as the 35’ Cigarette race boats designed by Don Aronow in 1972. The first two boats out of the new mold went to Bob Nordskog founder of Powerboat Magazine and Carl Kiekhaefer. After that the 35’ went into production, today known as the Café-Racer..

Next; In the late seventies Don lengthened the 35’ to 37 ½’ . I rigged and raced the first one for Jerry Jacoby Ajachawk #17. Today it is in production as the 38 Top Gun..

Nest; Don once again lengthened the 37 ½ to 41’ This time he used the mold to create the USA Racing Team Catamarans. By dividing the 41’ hull at the keel and putting a wing in between the divided hulls this created a cameraman that Don sold to the Government as DEA / Customs offshore interceptors. After Don finished his project, Apache Powerboats purchased the 41’ mold..

[cigdaze]

Wow. Good history. Welcome aboard, Bobby Saccenti

[yesrej]

interesting.

[Mange]

Hi Chris maybe this will help..

It started out as the 35’ Cigarette race boats designed by Don Aronow in 1972. The first two boats out of the new mold went to Bob Nordskog founder of Powerboat Magazine and Carl Kiekhaefer. After that the 35’ went into production, today known as the Café-Racer..

Next; In the late seventies Don lengthened the 35’ to 37 ½’ . I rigged and raced the first one for Jerry Jacoby Ajachawk #17. Today it is in production as the 38 Top Gun..

Nest; Don once again lengthened the 37 ½ to 41’ This time he used the mold to create the USA Racing Team Catamarans. By dividing the 41’ hull at the keel and putting a wing in between the divided hulls this created a cameraman that Don sold to the Government as DEA / Customs offshore interceptors. After Don finished his project, Apache Powerboats purchased the 41’ mold..

Nice to have these facts:)

Whats the story of the rare 33 Apache? And the more common 36.

Here´s my friends 36 newly rigged with 1100's 5.0L whipples, dry SSM#6 etc.
I know he runned 100MPH before one engine went down...


Thanks
Mange

[Mange]

....

[Geronimo36]

Hi Chris maybe this will help..

It started out as the 35’ Cigarette race boats designed by Don Aronow in 1972. The first two boats out of the new mold went to Bob Nordskog founder of Powerboat Magazine and Carl Kiekhaefer. After that the 35’ went into production, today known as the Café-Racer..

Next; In the late seventies Don lengthened the 35’ to 37 ½’ . I rigged and raced the first one for Jerry Jacoby Ajachawk #17. Today it is in production as the 38 Top Gun..

Nest; Don once again lengthened the 37 ½ to 41’ This time he used the mold to create the USA Racing Team Catamarans. By dividing the 41’ hull at the keel and putting a wing in between the divided hulls this created a cameraman that Don sold to the Government as DEA / Customs offshore interceptors. After Don finished his project, Apache Powerboats purchased the 41’ mold..

Bob,

Good chatting with you the other day, I still have to email you that video I promised!

I'll talk to ya later!

Frank U.

[Geronimo36]

Nice to have these facts:)

Whats the story of the rare 33 Apache? And the more common 36.

Here´s my friends 36 newly rigged with 1100's 5.0L whipples, dry SSM#6 etc.
I know he runned 100MPH before one engine went down...


Thanks
Mange

Manage,

Hopefully Bob will coment or confirm but the 36' was a cut down 41' hull with Bobby's deck. It was supposed to be a 35' but someone didn't know how to use a tape measure....:leaving:

[Chris]

Hi Chris maybe this will help..

It started out as the 35’ Cigarette race boats designed by Don Aronow in 1972. The first two boats out of the new mold went to Bob Nordskog founder of Powerboat Magazine and Carl Kiekhaefer. After that the 35’ went into production, today known as the Café-Racer..

Next; In the late seventies Don lengthened the 35’ to 37 ½’ . I rigged and raced the first one for Jerry Jacoby Ajachawk #17. Today it is in production as the 38 Top Gun..

Nest; Don once again lengthened the 37 ½ to 41’ This time he used the mold to create the USA Racing Team Catamarans. By dividing the 41’ hull at the keel and putting a wing in between the divided hulls this created a cameraman that Don sold to the Government as DEA / Customs offshore interceptors. After Don finished his project, Apache Powerboats purchased the 41’ mold..

Thanks for the clarification, Bob.

How did the 39 Competition fit in? The stories I had always heard were that the 39 suffered from some ill handling effects and that the 37-7 was an effort to solve that.

And since we have you, how did the 39 Squadron fit in? Alot assume it's the same basic hull as the 38, but I recall the strakes being somewhat larger.

[Chris]

Poor Bob. We've been so Saccenti-starved for so long, I fear we'll keep him here for weeks answeing questions.

[Mange]

Manage,

Hopefully Bob will coment or confirm but the 36' was a cut down 41' hull with Bobby's deck. It was supposed to be a 35' but someone didn't know how to use a tape measure....:leaving:

Now thats funny
It was supposed to be a 35' but someone didn't know how to use a tape measure....:rofl::rofl:

I really like the deck on the 36! Thanks for info!!

Mange

[ChiefApache]

Hi Chris maybe this will help..

It started out as the 35’ Cigarette race boats designed by Don Aronow in 1972. The first two boats out of the new mold went to Bob Nordskog founder of Powerboat Magazine and Carl Kiekhaefer. After that the 35’ went into production, today known as the Café-Racer..

Next; In the late seventies Don lengthened the 35’ to 37 ½’ . I rigged and raced the first one for Jerry Jacoby Ajachawk #17. Today it is in production as the 38 Top Gun..

Nest; Don once again lengthened the 37 ½ to 41’ This time he used the mold to create the USA Racing Team Catamarans. By dividing the 41’ hull at the keel and putting a wing in between the divided hulls this created a cameraman that Don sold to the Government as DEA / Customs offshore interceptors. After Don finished his project, Apache Powerboats purchased the 41’ mold..

Original 35 became the Cafe. 35' that became a 37 1/2' is today a 38 TG. What was the 41' referred to at that time since Apache did not own it originally?

[clayinaustin]

Why are Apache's so great?

Because people say, "Is that one of them thar Cigar boats?" :p

[Chris]

When I was pulling my 35 out to Glassdaves, a guy in our industrial park stopped to chat. He asked what brand of boat it was. I said "Cigarette". He says, "yeah, I know, but who made it?"

[cigdaze]

When I was pulling my 35 out to Glassdaves, a guy in our industrial park stopped to chat. He asked what brand of boat it was. I said "Cigarette". He says, "yeah, I know, but who made it?"

I can't tell you how many times I've had to explain this little tidbit of info to someone inquiring about the boat...I should print up cards and save myself the trouble. :)

[cosmic12]

:WHY ARE Apaches so great?------ Because they create these threads.... They go on and on and on and on no mater how rough it gets or how many get started they don't give up:hurray::cheers2:

[Bobby Saccenti]

Original 35 became the Cafe. 35' that became a 37 1/2' is today a 38 TG. What was the 41' referred to at that time since Apache did not own it originally?

The Aronow built 41’ never was tagged with a model name.. Reason was, Aronow at the time was under a none compete with the new owners of Cigarette. After Aronow sold the company he opened up a new company across the street called USA Racing Team. While under a non compete contract, Aronow was only allowed to build catamarans. To expedite his catamaran project Don built the 41’ mold with the intentions that eventually after his non compete had expired, he would go back into building V bottom boats. But when Apache ask Don if he would sell the 41’ molds, he smiled and said Why Not.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Nice to have these facts:)

Whats the story of the rare 33 Apache? And the more common 36.

Here´s my friends 36 newly rigged with 1100's 5.0L whipples, dry SSM#6 etc.
I know he runned 100MPH before one engine went down...


Thanks
Mange


Their where two 33’ Apaches . The first one was a narrow beam I designed along with borrowed Nick Chapman and sons ( Don’s carpenters) in 1978. That original 33’ Apache mold is now owned and being used by Concept Powerboats in Miami. The second 33’ hull mold was purchased from Aronow. This 33’ was a shorten version of the original 36’ - 9 ½' beam Cigarette race boat. After the purchase, Apache Powerboats manufactured it manly as a center console..

The 36' Apache was built out of the 41' Apache mold..

[Racegirl3]

Hi Bob :D

[Top Banana]

For all you guys who think that Saccenti is the be all and end allof high performance, let me share a little story with you...

About two weeks ago I was in Florida and I stopped by the marina that has TNT and Lip Ship etc. I find Bobby on a big 40 foot plus twin engine boat with a TNT mechanic on board doing the final tune up.

Bob says to me, let's take this out for a trial and see if we still remember how to do this stuff. I said sure why not. So, out we go, idling down the canals remembering the great old days when we both had hair to blow in the breezes of South Florida.

Anyway we clear the canal and Bobby spots Phil Lip Ship just coming in with a 39 Top Gun. This could be a great race, jumping off big waves as we clear Haulover. Phil must have seen us and knew what we had in hand, so he turns away and goes up another canal.

Bobby and I are now arguing over who is going to drive and who is going to throttle and we finally work out a compromise. I have the wheel and he pushes the throttles up and we feel the boat strain a bit to finally break free. The tachs begin to climb and the water starts rushing by the side of the boat. Just when we think everything is going to break open and we will be off in a rush, one tach begins to fade and then starts to drop.

Naturally in a case like this, as a driver, I always blamed the throttleman for letting us get behind the competiton....but in this case, I realized that we had a major malfunction with one of the engines, so we headed back to the marina before we blew something up.

Bobby told me a few days later that the problem had been solved and the boat was running great....he had it out and ran it wide open for a while and reached about 29 MPH.

Oh yeah, I did mention that it was a big 40 foot plus Cruiser didn't I? .......With straight inboard shafts and bronze props.

[Geronimo36]

Now thats funny
It was supposed to be a 35' but someone didn't know how to use a tape measure....:rofl::rofl:

Name sounds like McDonalds and ends with Anus......;):rofl::leaving:

[Chris]

...and ends with Anus.




I probably have that one etched into my mind forever.

[ChiefApache]

For all you guys who think that Saccenti is the be all and end allof high performance, let me share a little story with you...

About two weeks ago I was in Florida and I stopped by the marina that has TNT and Lip Ship etc. I find Bobby on a big 40 foot plus twin engine boat with a TNT mechanic on board doing the final tune up.

Bob says to me, let's take this out for a trial and see if we still remember how to do this stuff. I said sure why not. So, out we go, idling down the canals remembering the great old days when we both had hair to blow in the breezes of South Florida.

Anyway we clear the canal and Bobby spots Phil Lip Ship just coming in with a 39 Top Gun. This could be a great race, jumping off big waves as we clear Haulover. Phil must have seen us and knew what we had in hand, so he turns away and goes up another canal.

Bobby and I are now arguing over who is going to drive and who is going to throttle and we finally work out a compromise. I have the wheel and he pushes the throttles up and we feel the boat strain a bit to finally break free. The tachs begin to climb and the water starts rushing by the side of the boat. Just when we think everything is going to break open and we will be off in a rush, one tach begins to fade and then starts to drop.

Naturally in a case like this, as a driver, I always blamed the throttleman for letting us get behind the competiton....but in this case, I realized that we had a major malfunction with one of the engines, so we headed back to the marina before we blew something up.

Bobby told me a few days later that the problem had been solved and the boat was running great....he had it out and ran it wide open for a while and reached about 29 MPH.

Oh yeah, I did mention that it was a big 40 foot plus Cruiser didn't I? .......With straight inboard shafts and bronze props.

That's a great story!!!

[Mange]

Anyway we clear the canal and Bobby spots Phil Lip Ship just coming in with a 39 Top Gun. This could be a great race, jumping off big waves as we clear Haulover. Phil must have seen us and knew what we had in hand, so he turns away and goes up another canal.

Bobby and I are now arguing over who is going to drive and who is going to throttle and we finally work out a compromise. I have the wheel and he pushes the throttles up and we feel the boat strain a bit to finally break free. The tachs begin to climb and the water starts rushing by the side of the boat. Just when we think everything is going to break open and we will be off in a rush, one tach begins to fade and then starts to drop.



Oh yeah, I did mention that it was a big 40 foot plus Cruiser didn't I? .......With straight inboard shafts and bronze props.

That was A great story Charlie!!!!! WOW!!!:rofl::rofl:

THANKS!!

Mange:)

[Sea-Dated]

When I was pulling my 35 out to Glassdaves, a guy in our industrial park stopped to chat. He asked what brand of boat it was. I said "Cigarette". He says, "yeah, I know, but who made it?"

I get that all the time.:dupe:

[NJgr8ful]

Hi Chris maybe this will help..

It started out as the 35’ Cigarette race boats designed by Don Aronow in 1972. The first two boats out of the new mold went to Bob Nordskog founder of Powerboat Magazine and Carl Kiekhaefer. After that the 35’ went into production, today known as the Café-Racer..

Next; In the late seventies Don lengthened the 35’ to 37 ½’ . I rigged and raced the first one for Jerry Jacoby Ajachawk #17. Today it is in production as the 38 Top Gun..

Nest; Don once again lengthened the 37 ½ to 41’ This time he used the mold to create the USA Racing Team Catamarans. By dividing the 41’ hull at the keel and putting a wing in between the divided hulls this created a cameraman that Don sold to the Government as DEA / Customs offshore interceptors. After Don finished his project, Apache Powerboats purchased the 41’ mold..
Thanks Bob! I knew I had/have the ORIGINAL!

Very nice to know and to hear it from the mouth of one of the originals as well! :sifone:

[Bobby Saccenti]

Thanks Bob! I knew I had/have the ORIGINAL!

Very nice to know and to hear it from the mouth of one of the originals as well! :sifone:

HA! I spoke to Ritchie Powers today and I stand corrected.. The second original 35’ Cigarette race boat was the Dry Martini..

[Bobby Saccenti]

For all you guys who think that Saccenti is the be all and end allof high performance, let me share a little story with you...

About two weeks ago I was in Florida and I stopped by the marina that has TNT and Lip Ship etc. I find Bobby on a big 40 foot plus twin engine boat with a TNT mechanic on board doing the final tune up.

Bob says to me, let's take this out for a trial and see if we still remember how to do this stuff. I said sure why not. So, out we go, idling down the canals remembering the great old days when we both had hair to blow in the breezes of South Florida.

Anyway we clear the canal and Bobby spots Phil Lip Ship just coming in with a 39 Top Gun. This could be a great race, jumping off big waves as we clear Haulover. Phil must have seen us and knew what we had in hand, so he turns away and goes up another canal.

Bobby and I are now arguing over who is going to drive and who is going to throttle and we finally work out a compromise. I have the wheel and he pushes the throttles up and we feel the boat strain a bit to finally break free. The tachs begin to climb and the water starts rushing by the side of the boat. Just when we think everything is going to break open and we will be off in a rush, one tach begins to fade and then starts to drop.

Naturally in a case like this, as a driver, I always blamed the throttleman for letting us get behind the competiton....but in this case, I realized that we had a major malfunction with one of the engines, so we headed back to the marina before we blew something up.

Bobby told me a few days later that the problem had been solved and the boat was running great....he had it out and ran it wide open for a while and reached about 29 MPH.

Oh yeah, I did mention that it was a big 40 foot plus Cruiser didn't I? .......With straight inboard shafts and bronze props.

OK Charley, we are now race ready.. I tweaked the engines up , now we are doing a smoking WOT 32 mph Make sure you have your race Jacket and Helmet for the next run on Sunday..

[Bobby Saccenti]

Hi Bob :D

Hi Dawn

Nice to see you on board..

[Bobby Saccenti]

Name sounds like McDonalds and ends with Anus......;):rofl::leaving:

No Comment

[Racegirl3]

Hi Dawn

Nice to see you on board..



Funny ... I was thinkin the same thing about you :kiss:

[Bobby Saccenti]

Thanks for the clarification, Bob.

How did the 39 Competition fit in? The stories I had always heard were that the 39 suffered from some ill handling effects and that the 37-7 was an effort to solve that.

And since we have you, how did the 39 Squadron fit in? Alot assume it's the same basic hull as the 38, but I recall the strakes being somewhat larger.

The only 39’ boats that Aronow built was the Squadron 12 in the late seventies. If memory serves me right, the 39’ was actually a 37 ½ Cig with wider strakes The first one I rigged and raced was red and named APACHE.. The second one I rigged and raced was named Fast Company.. The difference in the wider 3/8” strakes made the boat a little faster, but rode a lot harder..

[DollaBill]

Hey Bobby. Good to see you here.

[Chris]

The only 39’ boats that Aronow built was the Squadron 12 in the late seventies. If memory serves me right, the 39’ was actually a 37 ½ Cig with wider strakes The first one I rigged and raced was red and named APACHE.. The second one I rigged and raced was named Fast Company.. The difference in the wider 3/8” strakes made the boat a little faster, but rode a lot harder..

What about the 39 Competition? The one with the dog-legged rubrail in the back? Battie raced the one- Coors Light if I remember. Nordskog had one too- the CAM boat that he replaced with the Scarab.

[PARADOX]

Hello Bobby and Charley..
Good to have you guys here.

This question is not about he Apache's.. I love them.. and the cigs.. but there is an issue with the $ part. :).. So I'm being a thread thief for a minute...
I got this Avanti.,... I did some research on the hull and it seems to be a modified "coyote- Beep-Beep" hull.
Any one you have any history on the Avanti hulls? Some of the history on the Avanti hulls going back to Arronow.

I would be interested to find out the real scoop.

[Mange]

Hello Bobby and Charlie..
Good to have you guys here.

This question is not about he Apache's.. I love them.. and the cigs.. but there is an issue with the $ part. :)
I got this Avanti.,... I did some research on the hull and it seems to be a modified "coyote- Beep-Beep" hull.
Any one you have any history on the Avanti hulls? Some of the history on the Avanti hulls going back to Arronow.

I would be interested to find out the real scoop.

If I am not complete wrong the Coyote's had roots from Charlie's Top Banana
designed by Jean Claude Simon?:blush5:


:)

Mange

[J-Bonz]

Bobby,
Great to see you on here! You remember this pop rock?

[PARADOX]

If I am not complete wrong the Coyote's had roots from Charlie's Top Banana
designed by Jean Claude Simon?:blush5:

:)
Mange

What I did found.. you are correct.. I'm not sure on this,, thus my question to the "Icons".. but I think JCS designed the deck. There is some history going to the Banana's, but it's sketchy at best.. I would love to know the exact history of this thing. I love it.. it goes through anythnig.. :sifone:

[Top Banana]

Once upon a time three young men, Bobby Saccenti, Sonny Miller and Jon Varese wanted to go racing. They remembered the boat built by GARA and called Impossible Dream....they liked what they saw there. They designed a 44 foot boat that had a very narrow foot and many strakes on the bottom. The boat originally had a round V at the stern because they intended to use shafts and inboards rather than sterndrives......fast forward, cause it didn't work....they changed the bottom to a real V, installed sterndrives and brought the boat to New Jersey for a newly sponsored race called...The Benihana.

It wasn't the fastest boat in the race, but boy could it eat up rough water. End of race and a lot of people couldn't navigate and some others couldn't find the right side of the checkpoints and the new 44 foot MSV, named La Tortuga won the race.

Of course, the crew of La Tortuga couldn't believe it...... and when the helicopters came over them close and gave them the one finger for first place, our boy Bob gave them the finger back.

Well the boat just didn't have the power back then to move all 44 feet very quick, but it beat everything in rough water and left no doubt that our trio was on to something. A Frenchman by the name of Jean Claude Simon comes along now and rents the mold from them and blocks it at 38 feet...but puts on a deck design that he copied from Paolo Caluiri...and voila....the 38 foot Cobra Open class racer of Joel Halpern is born....named Beep Beep.

This boat now goes out and wins US1 for the next two years and runs, really runs, in rough water. So during this time Joel and JC Simon have a falling out and JC is out in the cold so to speak. But a new opportunity comes his way......Mr Top Banana wants to move up to Open Class after too many years in smaller boats and is looking for a fresh design, so he and JC Simon hook up to build a newer version of the old favorite.....the new 38 Banana has one less strake on the bottom, but the remaining strakes are wider and the foot of the boat remains narrow. Once again a magic wand is waved, dollars change hands and ...Top Banana is born.

We trailer out to California for the Bushmills race and lead from start to finish, with the exception of Bill Elswick in Longshot, getting ahead for 30 seconds or so, while I tried to drive and throttle as I always did in the smaller classes....couldn't do it. Second boat in that race was Ajac Hawk, throttled by our friend Mr Bob S. Third place was Betty Cook in KAAMA.

Back to JC Simon...remember the falling out he and Halpern had? Well, JC wants to build boats out of my mold and call them Coyotes....remember how the Coyote always was after the Road Runner who said (Beep Beep)? So for a while Bananas and Coyotes are made from the same mold...both 38's and we blocked the mold for 34's too. Some like Gone Bananas in the photo below ran with both names on it, Coyote and Banana.

Fast forward again....Banana is out, Coyote is out.... and the molds now are sold to Sonic, where with the addition of a swim platform, they become the Sonic 42 footer. It all started with a 44 footer at the Benihana race.

So there you have the bloodline.....Gara, MSV, Cobra, Banana, Coyote, Sonic.

[PARADOX]

Thanks Charley..
I was reading a bunch of the Avanti's history but nothing was really "concrete".

This hull is 33'-3" (pulled from the mold in 07+-) and I thought it was from the original Coyote hulls, and it does have one less strake, but the lines are very similar.
Some of the current hulls/boats are faster.. but in serious seas.. I can handle it where as some of the "faster" hulls do ease back a bit. You guys did great with the design.. and I'm happy to have this history.. and own a part of it..

Thanks for the narrative.. (now I just have to find the marine equal of AKC and get the bloodline registered.) :biggrinjester:

[NJgr8ful]

I got this Avanti.,... I did some research on the hull and it seems to be a modified "coyote- Beep-Beep" hull.
Any one you have any history on the Avanti hulls? Some of the history on the Avanti hulls going back to Arronow.

I would be interested to find out the real scoop.

What I did found.. you are correct.. I'm not sure on this,, thus my question to the "Icons".. but I think JCS designed the deck. There is some history going to the Banana's, but it's sketchy at best.. I would love to know the exact history of this thing. I love it.. it goes through anythnig.. :sifone:

Thanks Charley..
I was reading a bunch of the Avanti's history but nothing was really "concrete".

This hull is 33'-3" (pulled from the mold in 07+-) and I thought it was from the original Coyote hulls, and it does have one less strake, but the lines are very similar.
Some of the current hulls/boats are faster.. but in serious seas.. I can handle it where as some of the "faster" hulls do ease back a bit. You guys did great with the design.. and I'm happy to have this history.. and own a part of it..

Thanks for the narrative.. (now I just have to find the marine equal of AKC and get the bloodline registered.) :biggrinjester:

So is the Avanti mold actually a Banana/Coyote mold ... or??? :confused: :confused: I've seen the roots from Cig to Apache. From Gara, MSV, Cobra, Banana, Coyote, to Sonic's purchase, but do not see Avanti mentioned? I do know it was Jersey built hull :cool:

[Top Banana]

Please post a photo of an Avanti, so we can see what you have there. Maybe we can figure out where it came from.

Clarification: Spoke to Bobby a little while ago and we agree that our memories are foggy but not dead, so this is the progression of the 37.6 that became the 41.

First there was the 35, then that was stretched to a 39 with a little flare in the freeboard aft.

That mold for the 39 was then blocked down to 37.6 and the Top Gun came from that.

The 37.6 was then stretched to a 41 and became the Apache 41.

So, it goes like this....35 to 39 / 39 down to 37.6 / 37.6 to 41

[PARADOX]

What I found out so far,, but I'm not really sure.. that Sonic bought some of the molds.. Once they started their step.. they sold it to Dennis Freedmen. ( an a$$hole.. but the hulls are great) Avanti started the 33'+ and also a 40' something.
Some pics.

1404

1405

1406

[Top Banana]

If he bought the old Sonic molds, then that is my old boat.

Forget the sizes, we built a 38 and a 33 which was actually a 34 foot boat. Banana sold them as 33's and Coyote sold them as 34's and they were exactly the same.

The slab sides vs the knuckle sides that a Cigarette has, leans more toward the old Banana. The Banana strakes were 5 inches wide at the chine and 4 inches wide on the next strake in and the bottom strake was 3 inches. (It is really scary that I remember this stuff at all)

So, check out the width of the strakes and that may tell us all once and for all if they match the 5 / 4 / 3 scenario.

[PARADOX]

Don't have one of the bottem area of the hull.. but I'll take one.

1420

1421

1422

[PARADOX]

If he bought the old Sonic molds, then that is my old boat.

Forget the sizes, we built a 38 and a 33 which was actually a 34 foot boat. Banana sold them as 33's and Coyote sold them as 34's and they were exactly the same.

The slab sides vs the knuckle sides that a Cigarette has, leans more toward the old Banana. The Banana strakes were 5 inches wide at the chine and 4 inches wide on the next strake in and the bottom strake was 3 inches. (It is really scary that I remember this stuff at all)

So, check out the width of the strakes and that may tell us all once and for all if they match the 5 / 4 / 3 scenario.
1426

I appologize for hijacking this thread a bit.. I'm going measuring in a few minutes. :)
I see the "Mr Coyote" boat. (no. M-37 ) the transom curve, looks very similar to the Avanti curve.. as well as the deck.

[PARADOX]

Charley..


Please check out new thread about the Avanti..
I stole this thread long enough.. sorry.. (and thanks) :leaving:

http://www.seriousoffshore.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7241&posted=1#post7241


BTW, it is a 5, 4, 3.. strakes...

[Geronimo36]

No Comment

Bobby, were there any 36's that were built with a notched transom?

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby, were there any 36's that were built with a notched transom?

Yes Frank

I remember a few with the short staggered speedmaster III application.. It allowed us to raise the drives higher.. We also tried one with extension boxes.. That was not a good idea … The boat ran a little too transom heavy and needed some tab to keep the bow in check..

[Geronimo36]

Cool! Thanks for the info on the extension boxes, in another thread it was suggested to add boxes so it does not look like that would be a good idea.

Thanks again for all your help the past couple years and even before I bought the boat!

[Ratickle]

Damn, I love reading this stuff.:drool5:

[Bobby Saccenti]

Once upon a time three young men, Bobby Saccenti, Sonny Miller and Jon Varese wanted to go racing. They remembered the boat built by GARA and called Impossible Dream....they liked what they saw there. They designed a 44 foot boat that had a very narrow foot and many strakes on the bottom. The boat originally had a round V at the stern because they intended to use shafts and inboards rather than sterndrives......fast forward, cause it didn't work....they changed the bottom to a real V, installed sterndrives and brought the boat to New Jersey for a newly sponsored race called...The Benihana.

It wasn't the fastest boat in the race, but boy could it eat up rough water. End of race and a lot of people couldn't navigate and some others couldn't find the right side of the checkpoints and the new 44 foot MSV, named La Tortuga won the race.

Of course, the crew of La Tortuga couldn't believe it...... and when the helicopters came over them close and gave them the one finger for first place, our boy Bob gave them the finger back.

Well the boat just didn't have the power back then to move all 44 feet very quick, but it beat everything in rough water and left no doubt that our trio was on to something. A Frenchman by the name of Jean Claude Simon comes along now and rents the mold from them and blocks it at 38 feet...but puts on a deck design that he copied from Paolo Caluiri...and voila....the 38 foot Cobra Open class racer of Joel Halpern is born....named Beep Beep.

This boat now goes out and wins US1 for the next two years and runs, really runs, in rough water. So during this time Joel and JC Simon have a falling out and JC is out in the cold so to speak. But a new opportunity comes his way......Mr Top Banana wants to move up to Open Class after too many years in smaller boats and is looking for a fresh design, so he and JC Simon hook up to build a newer version of the old favorite.....the new 38 Banana has one less strake on the bottom, but the remaining strakes are wider and the foot of the boat remains narrow. Once again a magic wand is waved, dollars change hands and ...Top Banana is born.

We trailer out to California for the Bushmills race and lead from start to finish, with the exception of Bill Elswick in Longshot, getting ahead for 30 seconds or so, while I tried to drive and throttle as I always did in the smaller classes....couldn't do it. Second boat in that race was Ajac Hawk, throttled by our friend Mr Bob S. Third place was Betty Cook in KAAMA.

Back to JC Simon...remember the falling out he and Halpern had? Well, JC wants to build boats out of my mold and call them Coyotes....remember how the Coyote always was after the Road Runner who said (Beep Beep)? So for a while Bananas and Coyotes are made from the same mold...both 38's and we blocked the mold for 34's too. Some like Gone Bananas in the photo below ran with both names on it, Coyote and Banana.

Fast forward again....Banana is out, Coyote is out.... and the molds now are sold to Sonic, where with the addition of a swim platform, they become the Sonic 42 footer. It all started with a 44 footer at the Benihana race.

So there you have the bloodline.....Gara, MSV, Cobra, Banana, Coyote, Sonic.

44' MSV
Grand Daddy of them all...

The 44’ MSV was ahead of its time for a super class boat.. At that time, the American Powerboat Racing Association ( The one and only racing organization at that time) only allowed us to use under UIM rules 500 cubic inch carbureted or fuel injected engines .. Just for the record the Gara was a totally different hull than the MSV and built several years later.

[jayboat]

Great thread. Gone Bananas is such a bad azz boat- looks like it's all business, serious business.

[Top Banana]

Great thread. Gone Bananas is such a bad azz boat- looks like it's all business, serious business.

Those guys were very bad azz. The two partners in the boat were just back from 'Nam and they were both Green Berets that served on the assasination teams behind the lines.

Thought a lot of their stories were BS, until one day in Newport RI after a wet lunch, one of my customers ran into them leaving a local bar heading for their car in the lot....on the way they all passed a building with a chained-in lot that had a Doberman Pinscher in it.

The dog started barking at them and one of the Gone Banana's guys says to the dog..."Shut up". The dog doesn't shut up and the next thing the guy has climbed the fence and jumped into the yard.

My customer told me that the dog took one look at this guy's eyes and ran off into the building to hide. After the war, they said that offshore racing was the closest thing they got to that same adreneline rush.

[JnT]

Thanks Bob S. for all the info you sent via email a few years back. The 21 is running good and we have had a blast with it.
It gets more attention than a lot of bigger boats.
Jim

[Top Banana]

44' MSV
Grand Daddy of them all...

Just for the record the Gara was a totally different hull than the MSV and built several years later.

Bobby and I spoke today and yes...he is right, the GARA was something that Paul Hagerty and Sandy Satullo did in 75 or so. Had the same look, but it wasn't part of that bloodline that is described here.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Thanks Bob S. for all the info you sent via email a few years back. The 21 is running good and we have had a blast with it.
It gets more attention than a lot of bigger boats.
Jim

Jim

Happy to hear that, as I mentioned to you before, the 21' Scouts was always my favorite..

[JnT]

"Why are Apaches so great?"
I guess it all comes down to build quality and customer service. I bought a 21 year old boat and the man that built it is still accesible and willing to help! The mechanic that rigged my outboard stated "I haven't heard a crack,pop or felt a soft spot after crawling all over this boat and I'm a big boy". He is a BIG fellow. The original rigging is phenominal. We had to change a few things from OMC to Yamaha but tried to mimic the original pattern.

Thats my little brother playing guitar in the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XUQm66-l6c

Thanks again,
Jim

[NJgr8ful]

"Why are Apaches so great?"
I guess it all comes down to build quality and customer service. I bought a 21 year old boat and the man that built it is still accesible and willing to help! The mechanic that rigged my outboard stated "I haven't heard a crack,pop or felt a soft spot after crawling all over this boat and I'm a big boy". He is a BIG fellow. The original rigging is phenominal. We had to change a few things from OMC to Yamaha but tried to mimic the original pattern.

Thats my little brother playing guitar in the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XUQm66-l6c

Thanks again,
Jim

Jim,
Love the Scouts. I want to get a 21-24' Apache, Cig, Pantera or something in that range as a second boat.

Dude your brother is Mark Lee of Third Day????:coolgleamA:

[Top Banana]

[QUOTE=NJgr8ful;12279]Jim,
Love the Scouts. I want to get a 21-24' Apache, Cig, Pantera or something in that range as a second boat. QUOTE]


Ahem.....speaking of bloodlines....in a 24 foot no less....why don't you take this home with you from Key West? Demos are made to be sold at some point.

We will be down there on Thursday through Sunday with a slip at the Banana Bay Marina.

[JnT]

Jim,
Love the Scouts. I want to get a 21-24' Apache, Cig, Pantera or something in that range as a second boat.

Dude your brother is Mark Lee of Third Day????:coolgleamA:

Yep thats him. I'm proud of him. They have done well. :)

[NJgr8ful]

Yep thats him. I'm proud of him. They have done well. :)

NICE and YES they have!! Just saw them 2-3 weeks ago at PNC Arts Center in NJ :cool: paid for front (1st) row center seats ... won't tell you how much I spent! Love them .... Awesome Jim. Great band spreading a great message :)

[NJgr8ful]

Ahem.....speaking of bloodlines....in a 24 foot no less....why don't you take this home with you from Key West? Demos are made to be sold at some point.

We will be down there on Thursday through Sunday with a slip at the Banana Bay Marina.
Would love that Charlie ... but wife would have other words to describe that purchase. My intentions are to pick up something in the 21-24' range and make a project of it. Good luck showing that beautiful piece down in the Keys. I am sure it's new owner will be absolutely thrilled with their purchase for many years to come.

Chris

[phragle]

Apaches are so great because fundy bought one, and he is going to take me for boat rides!!

[J-Bonz]

[QUOTE=NJgr8ful;12279]Jim,
Love the Scouts. I want to get a 21-24' Apache, Cig, Pantera or something in that range as a second boat. QUOTE]


Ahem.....speaking of bloodlines....in a 24 foot no less....why don't you take this home with you from Key West? Demos are made to be sold at some point.

We will be down there on Thursday through Sunday with a slip at the Banana Bay Marina.

Is that the an extra long swim/extension box? Or is that the only size stainless sells for the single application?
JR.

[fund razor]

Apaches are so great because fundy bought one, and he is going to take me for boat rides!!

Part a is backwards. I bought one because they are so great. :D

Part b is pretty darn likely.

[Top Banana]

[QUOTE=Top Banana;12292]

Is that the an extra long swim/extension box? Or is that the only size stainless sells for the single application?
JR.

JBonz
That is something that Brownie designed for this boat and Stainless made it up for us. It is made to follow the lines of the V, so that when it runs in the rough stuff it thinks it is a 28 footer not a 24, works pretty neat. I turned to my old friends to make this latest version of an old favorite the best it could be. Bobby Saccenti did the layup schedule for me, with no wood used, all composite and we saved 1/3 of the weight of the former boats.

NJg8fl
Fully understand about wives....however, one of our former customers just traded up to a new boat....... and we have his very clean 24 available, with or without the engine, or with a brand new engine of your choice.

I'm not going to make this easy for you. The boat is presently in Massachusetts, not far from Jersey.

[NJgr8ful]

NJg8fl
Fully understand about wives....however, one of our former customers just traded up to a new boat....... and we have his very clean 24 available, with or without the engine, or with a brand new engine of your choice.

I'm not going to make this easy for you. The boat is presently in Massachusetts, not far from Jersey. $10K for boat alone.

Charlie PM me a number to reach you and we'll talk ... again :)

[smokeybandit]

Nothing in the world like an Apache. Bob, I don't know if you remember me, but my Dad and I met you and Ben and Jack at Fort Apache in 85. My Dad bought the red, white and blue banner boat, along with a few others. I got to go for a ride with you and Ben in Warpath, and although I had been racing for 2 years at that point, it was the thrill of my life. Although my Dad died years ago, reading all of the stories on this board bringsback my fondest memories of him.

[catmando]

Mr. McCarthy or Mr. Saccenti,

Sleekcraft says its 34 Heritage is an Aronow hull. True or false?

[baywatch]

This is the best thread I have read in some time. I could read this stuff all day long.

We love our 36' and couldn't be happier to have it. Every time we go somewhere in it there will be someone at the docks that comes over to check it out and ask questions.

[Von Bongo]

I still want a 41...

[WMF]

Because Andy( TEX ) has a Apache that is why they are great!!!! Funds Pic!!!!

[ChiefApache]

This is the best thread I have read in some time. I could read this stuff all day long.

We love our 36' and couldn't be happier to have it. Every time we go somewhere in it there will be someone at the docks that comes over to check it out and ask questions.

We get the same thing. It's amazing how the boat draws people towards it.

We love it.

[Magnum Mark]

I still want a 41...

Me too.Gives me something to look foward to.Might have to get a second job.

[ChiefApache]

Me too.Gives me something to look foward to.Might have to get a second job.

It'll be worth it! Promise.:drool5:

[Geronimo36]

When someone asks me if it's a Cigarette boat I say; "Close! It's better than a Cig, it's an Apache."

[smokeybandit]

Any idea how many orginal 41' boats were made? I'm talking about when the Kramers were around.

[NJgr8ful]

When someone asks me if it's a Cigarette boat I say; "Close! It's better than a Cig, it's an Apache."

yeah yeah Frank keep tellin yourself that! You might actually start believing yourself after a while :D :26:

[fund razor]

Cool beans.I will hold you to that promise.Going to stop by Riggs Marine today after work and check out that Lucy boat and I hear there are a couple of 28 footers as well.

Word is that there is a 28 that has never been touched by human hands.:drool5:

[fund razor]

When someone asks me if it's a Cigarette boat I say; "Close! It's better than a Cig, it's an Apache."

That really is the easiest way to explain it. :03:

[Geronimo36]

yeah yeah Frank keep tellin yourself that! You might actually start believing yourself after a while :D :26:

Nah, no need to believe cause we experience it every time we're on it! :sifone::26:

Spoke to a buddy yesterday who told me a funny story... Over the summer we took a trip to Long Island with a bunch of boats, (2) 51' OL's, 42' OL and a 40' Hustler. On the way back, near Sandy Hook, I knudged the throttles forward and we were running 80 mph and passed all the boats and were running just ahead of a 51' OL and then I pulled back. At the time my buddy told me that I should have seen the look on the guys face in the 51' OL when we pulled away but I didnt' believe him cause we weren't even running WOT.:lurk5:

Fast forward a couple months later and one of the guys who was on the 51 OL says they thought we were running 90 mph and that the little Apache was beating up on all the big boys..... This story made it all the way down to one of our friends in Georgia and back to NJ, go figure.....:26::03::sifone:

[NJgr8ful]

Nah, no need to believe cause we experience it every time we're on it! :sifone::26:

Spoke to a buddy yesterday who told me a funny story... Over the summer we took a trip to Long Island with a bunch of boats, (2) 51' OL's, 42' OL and a 40' Hustler. On the way back, near Sandy Hook, I knudged the throttles forward and we were running 80 mph and passed all the boats and were running just ahead of a 51' OL and then I pulled back. At the time my buddy told me that I should have seen the look on the guys face in the 51' OL when we pulled away but I didnt' believe him cause we weren't even running WOT.

Fast forward a couple months later and one of the guys who was on the 51 OL says they thought we were running 90 mph and that the little Apache was beating up on all the big boys..... This story made it all the way down to one of our friends in Georgia and back to NJ, go figure.....:26::03::sifone:
LOL ... That's a real cool story bud, but I noticed one important fact!! There were no Ciggies running with you on that, one, fateful, day in history :26::03::26::biggrinjester::sifone:

((In the words of our fearless, faithful leader and CoolAid mixer ....... BAAAAAAAAAAMMMMM ))

[NJgr8ful]

That really is the easiest way to explain it. :03:

You're just a bandwagon jumper on'r!!!! :D :D:biggrinjester::biggrinjester:

[ChiefApache]

I stopped by Riggs Marine this morning. They were very helpful and knowlegable to say the least.They had 4 Apaches. 2 28s 1- 41 and 1- 36.Great looking machines. Have a good weekend.

I look forward to rides in the 28 and 36. I would love to get in a 47 in some big water to see how different it performs than the 41. I couldn't imagine the ride in a 47 in big water. Someday.

You have a good weekend too!

[Geronimo36]

LOL ... That's a real cool story bud, but I noticed one important fact!! There were no Ciggies running with you on that, one, fateful, day in history :26::03::26::biggrinjester::sifone:

((In the words of our fearless, faithful leader and CoolAid mixer ....... BAAAAAAAAAAMMMMM ))

Ok, that's fair.... So I'll just tell another story! :sifone:

Two years ago I was running home from NYC with a Top Gun and a 41 Velocity. Near Governors Island I stopped because my buddie Jamie has to take a piss.... As we stop the Cig and the Velo keep going. Once we get on plane the two boats are half way between Governors Island and the VZ Bridge.

I get on plane and catch up to both of them a mile or two past the VZ Bridge and it's pretty rough out there. We get half way across the bay and I decided to play a little in the rough stuff... I pull away from the Velo and all we see is the bottom of his boat as he's coming out of the water. I walk up to the Cig and he starts to pace me in the rough stuff so I knudge a bit further on the throttles and walk away from him. We're about a mile ahead of both boats so I slow down and wait for them to catch back up then we all ran home together....

We got back to the dock and the guy in the Cig said he was WOT and couldn't keep up.. The guy in the Velo makes excuses saying he couldn't run fast with his father on the boat...... Blah blah blah blahh...

At least the Cig owner admitted he got beat and said that the Velocity looked like the "Little Engine that Could." :seeya:

[Geronimo36]

One last story.... Last summer the guy with the Top Gun offered me and my father a ride down to Pt. pleasant with us so we said sure!!! There was a decent swell that day we were in and out of the water most of the ride there and back. We were getting beat up pretty bad, enough to where my knees were hurting when we got back.

We get back to the dock and my father and I walk back to my boat and we're hanging out talking about the ride. My father turns to me and says that he didn't want to say anything to the Cig owner but he thought the ride was really bad. I turned to him and said there was a good size swell so I'm sure it's just the fact that the seas were big. My father turns to me and says he thinks my boat rides better and that he's never had a day on the Apache where his knees were sore.

So I don't believe him and tell him there's only one way to find out..... So we get in the boat and head for the ocean to ride in the same water we were just out in to compare. After about 45 minutes my father turns to me and says "told ya so".... I had to agree...and we turned around and went back home....

To this day I still don't believe it turned out like that...... :)

[ApacheRob]

I stopped by Riggs Marine this morning. They were very helpful and knowlegable to say the least.They had 4 Apaches. 2- 28s 1- 41 and 1- 36.Great looking machines. Have a good weekend.

Any pics? Must have picks dude!

[NJgr8ful]

One last story.... Last summer the guy with the Top Gun offered me and my father a ride down to Pt. pleasant with us so we said sure!!! There was a decent swell that day we were in and out of the water most of the ride there and back. We were getting beat up pretty bad, enough to where my knees were hurting when we got back.

We get back to the dock and my father and I walk back to my boat and we're hanging out talking about the ride. My father turns to me and says that he didn't want to say anything to the Cig owner but he thought the ride was really bad. I turned to him and said there was a good size swell so I'm sure it's just the fact that the seas were big. My father turns to me and says he thinks my boat rides better and that he's never had a day on the Apache where his knees were sore.

So I don't believe him and tell him there's only one way to find out..... So we get in the boat and head for the ocean to ride in the same water we were just out in to compare. After about 45 minutes my father turns to me and says "told ya so".... I had to agree...and we turned around and went back home....

To this day I still don't believe it turned out like that...... :)
It's all good brudda ... this summer I really hope to finally run with you somewhere, anywhere. LOL so we will see ;)

[Strip Poker 388]

Why are Apache's so great?



same as Why does Stecz think he's King?:rolleyes::D

[Bgchuby01]

41 at riggs belongs to magnum mark of chicago. Just installed zero time engines and drives.

[Magnum Mark]

yeah yeah Frank keep tellin yourself that! You might actually start believing yourself after a while :D :26:

The #1 sin to avoid. "BELIEVING YOUR OWN B/S".

[dykstra]

Damn, I love reading this stuff.:drool5:

Agreed, info and history are priceless, thanks again Bobby!

[Geronimo36]

How bout some video!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5JoPpO12Iw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiD5XhPW5XE
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9046838926164987063&hl=en
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8398993694077531311&hl=en

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby,
Great to see you on here! You remember this pop rock?

Yup! Sure do..

That deck was designed back in the nineties and still looks very today.. Post more pictures when you can..

[Bobby Saccenti]

Nothing in the world like an Apache. Bob, I don't know if you remember me, but my Dad and I met you and Ben and Jack at Fort Apache in 85. My Dad bought the red, white and blue banner boat, along with a few others. I got to go for a ride with you and Ben in Warpath, and although I had been racing for 2 years at that point, it was the thrill of my life. Although my Dad died years ago, reading all of the stories on this board bringsback my fondest memories of him.

The 41’ V bottom banner boat is now in New Jersey.. Is that the one that your dad purchased.?? If I recall correctly their was also a red white and blue banner Apache catamaran that was purchased around that time

[smokeybandit]

The 41’ V bottom banner boat is now in New Jersey.. Is that the one that your dad purchased.?? If I recall correctly their was also a red white and blue banner Apache catamaran that was purchased around that time
It was the V. He changed the name to Apache Bandit, and raced a few races in "D" class in the Northeast. That boat hauled.

[Bobby Saccenti]

It was the V. He changed the name to Apache Bandit, and raced a few races in "D" class in the Northeast. That boat hauled.


Yes, now I remember..

The Apache Bandit made the tribe very proud. Nice to hear from you..

[Bobby Saccenti]

Mr. McCarthy or Mr. Saccenti,

Sleekcraft says its 34 Heritage is an Aronow hull. True or false?

News to me.. I never heard that before, maybe Charlie would know....

[PARADOX]

News to me.. I never heard that before, maybe Charlie would know....

Hello Bobby... I "stole" your slip spot at YCOA. FPC party.. :) Thanks.. Tried to hook up with Charlie all weekend..
Now.. I'm borrowing this thread again. I saw a 47 Apachee in Tavernier, at a dealer, (facing North on the West side) with trip No. 6's. Awsome looking boat. Anyone knows about it ??

[Mange]

Always work to do on a farm. Cows never get a day off and those tits are'nt going to pull themselves.
Have fun down in Miami but be careful. Lot's of trouble for a farm boy not used to the big city to get into down there.....:eek:

:rofl::rofl::rofl: Now, that was funny:sifone:

[JCG]

Hey, Bobby,

I'm looking at a 1991 Apache Brave 28'. I'd really appreciate any background information you could give me on the Apache 28 feet hull and deck an their origins!
It's great being able to get this great information straight from the men who started it all!!

Thanks in advance,
Julian Gutierrez

[thedonz]

Hello Bobby... I "stole" your slip spot at YCOA. FPC party.. :) Thanks.. Tried to hook up with Charlie all weekend..
Now.. I'm borrowing this thread again. I saw a 47 Apachee in Tavernier, at a dealer, (facing North on the West side) with trip No. 6's. Awsome looking boat. Anyone knows about it ??

That was probably Elias De la Torres's boat at Plantation Boat Mart...I think it's for sale....supposedly he spent a cool million restoring it recently.......

[Bobby Saccenti]

Hey, Bobby,

I'm looking at a 1991 Apache Brave 28'. I'd really appreciate any background information you could give me on the Apache 28 feet hull and deck an their origins!
It's great being able to get this great information straight from the men who started it all!!

Thanks in advance,
Julian Gutierrez

The 28’ Apache hull was a project Don Aronow help me with in the very late seventies . After we completed the hull , I finished up with the deck design.. It was a great project working with the professor..

Post some pictures of the 28’ Apache you are looking at.. May be I can be of some help?

[Bobby Saccenti]

Hello Bobby... I "stole" your slip spot at YCOA. FPC party.. :) Thanks.. Tried to hook up with Charlie all weekend..
Now.. I'm borrowing this thread again. I saw a 47 Apachee in Tavernier, at a dealer, (facing North on the West side) with trip No. 6's. Awsome looking boat. Anyone knows about it ??

The slip spot at the YCOA FPC party was not mine.. I drove down to KW by car.. Maybe Charlie knows more about it??

[baywatch]

Bobby,

I was curious how many 36's you built and what year you produced the first one.


Thanks,

Josh

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby,

I was curious how many 36's you built and what year you produced the first one.


Thanks,

Josh

The 36’ Apache was first introduced in the late eighties.. We built approximate sixty. The last one build was 2004.. Its at TNT in Miami.. I think it is for sale..

[cosmic12]

The 36 is one of the best all round boats built. Not to big or to small with perfect lines. Thanks Bob for a classic in its own time.

[Bill N]

The 36 is one of the best all round boats built. Not to big or to small with perfect lines. Thanks Bob for a classic in its own time.

I couldn't believe how great Geronimo's 36 rides. I spent years riding on Apache Warrior an 87 41 & didn't think the ride would be that good on the 36 but I was so wrong, its a wave crusher

[Geronimo36]

I couldn't believe how great Geronimo's 36 rides. I spent years riding on Apache Warrior an 87 41 & didn't think the ride would be that good on the 36 but I was so wrong, its a wave crusher

Thanks for the compliment Billy! :cheers2:

[Geronimo36]

The 36’ Apache was first introduced in the late eighties.. We built approximate sixty. The last one build was 2004.. Its at TNT in Miami.. I think it is for sale..

Bobby, is this the same boat? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUNk3YGa-s8

[Roger 1]

Is this the one?

[Geronimo36]

Is this the one?

Is that the 575SC boat? If so I believe it was a 2003. Bobby gave me an awesome price on it back in 2004/2005... I couldn't swing it but it was a great deal! Someone got a really nice boat!

[Geronimo36]

Bobby, what's the story on "Drillin-It"? I like the half stagger, it's one of my favorites!!

And how about the B-36 Geronimo? Geronimo looks like it's on a full stagger with the engines moved forward a little???

I heard both boats were owned by the same guy?

[Top Banana]

The slip spot at the YCOA FPC party was not mine.. I drove down to KW by car.. Maybe Charlie knows more about it??

The only thing I know is, that every marina I stopped by in the keys had a "Reserved" sign out on one great slip.

I went over closer to one and read the small print and it said....."Reserved for Mr Bobby Saccenti ...He is an ICON on Seriousoffshore.com you know!!

So, I can understand you thinking it was Bobby's slip....they all are!!!

You guys won't have much more time to pick on us, so enjoy it while we are with you. Here is a photo of (Left to right) Me, Rocky and Bobby at Pt Pleasant last year....and now Rocky is gone.

[Switzer It]

This is the best thread I've ever had the pure pleasure to read. The building could have been on fire, and I stay just to finish reading it

Thank you everyone!

- Pat

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby, is this the same boat? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUNk3YGa-s8

Hi Frank

Yes that’s the same boat.. The owners name is Jay, he is a lieutenant with the Miami / Dade Fire Department.. I told him when I seen the You-Tube video of him smoking his cigar driving , he reminded me of Tony Mantana frown Scar face…. Actually Jay and his brother use to race the 32’ Seahawk race boat back in the late eighties..

[smokeybandit]

That wouldn't be Justo Jay.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby, what's the story on "Drillin-It"? I like the half stagger, it's one of my favorites!!

And how about the B-36 Geronimo? Geronimo looks like it's on a full stagger with the engines moved forward a little???

I heard both boats were owned by the same guy?

The 36’ Apache called Drillin-it is owned by Captain Kurt (we gave him the name) from Lake Linear Georgia.. We powered his Apache with a pair of 1000 h/p Lake X detuned race engines, shot staggered. The boat topped out just over 110 mph. Yes also he owned two other 36 Apaches.. The Geronimo race boat and another side by side that I sold for him to a customer in Santa Domingo about four years ago..

When we built the Geronimo for the original owner he wanted (against my better judgment), a full staggered with extension boxes and speedmaster IV drives.. I was not too trilled about the center of gravity after running the boat.. To me it was too transom heavy. When Capt Kurt bought the Geronimo he removed the extension boxes and installed a pair of IIIA , after that the boat ran perfect..

[Bobby Saccenti]

That wouldn't be Justo Jay.

No not Justo Jay BUT the same boat... Fireman Jay and his brother are the second owners and raced the Seahawk for a few years.. Jay's brother still has the Seahawk and it is also up for sale..

[Bobby Saccenti]

The only thing I know is, that every marina I stopped by in the keys had a "Reserved" sign out on one great slip.

I went over closer to one and read the small print and it said....."Reserved for Mr Bobby Saccenti ...He is an ICON on Seriousoffshore.com you know!!

So, I can understand you thinking it was Bobby's slip....they all are!!!

You guys won't have much more time to pick on us, so enjoy it while we are with you. Here is a photo of (Left to right) Me, Rocky and Bobby at Pt Pleasant last year....and now Rocky is gone.

:biggrinjester:

[Roger 1]

Is that the 575SC boat? If so I believe it was a 2003. Bobby gave me an awesome price on it back in 2004/2005... I couldn't swing it but it was a great deal! Someone got a really nice boat!

I think so. The picture was taken at the Miami Boat Show. Bobby?

[Bobby Saccenti]

Is this the one?

Hi Roger

The Apache in the picture is not the one you see on You-Tube This Apache was built for a customer in N.J. It was the second Apache I built for him.. The first one was a side by side , after I sold his first Apache to a customer who lives in Michigan, he ordered this one with a short staggered 575SC package.

Quick story about Mike the owner.. He ordered his first Apache on the morning of 911.. I was in my office in Miami watching TV and can not believe what I am seeing like everybody ells. When my phone rang. The caller said Hi Bob, Its Mike do you remember me.. I said, I sure do.. (we were negotiating a boat a few months before).. He went on to say, I am sitting in my office in Newark New Jersey across the river watching the towers burn.. He then said, what do I have to do to order that Apache we were talking about.. After we made a deal, he said to me. I want you to paint two Indian heads on each side, with red, white, and blue feathers and lets name the boat FREEDOM..

[Nykamp]

Freedom is now called BLUE MOON and is faster then ever. Bobby builds a great boat, I loved my 36's. Hope all is well, Bobby. Steve and Krista.

[J-Bonz]

Bobby,
You remember this guys boat.....................?

[C M R]

Reading these stories and info never get's old. What a great thread!

[fund razor]

Ok... I didn't want to crash the line... But now I will ask.

Mr. Saccenti:
Do you happen to recall anything about this 1988 28?
It was in Miami until this year.

Thanks either way. And thanks for the generosity of your time, between you and Charlie... I could read and read. You make the generation behind you feel like they were there on all those rides.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby,
You remember this guys boat.....................?

Yes sure do.. The gentleman on the left is my buddy Little Tommy.. He is the owner of Thunder Chief. If you see Tom, ask him about the time we took his Apache out for a test run off of Fort Lauderdale in 6’ seas.

Toms Apache was previous owned by the Storino Family who owns Jenkins Pavilion on the beach in Point Pleasant N.J. Jenkins Pavilion has been host to offshore Powerboat events for over forty years.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Ok... I didn't want to crash the line... But now I will ask.

Mr. Saccenti:
Do you happen to recall anything about this 1988 28?
It was in Miami until this year.

Thanks either way. And thanks for the generosity of your time, between you and Charlie... I could read and read. You make the generation behind you feel like they were there on all those rides.

Fund Razor

I’m not too sure about that 28 Apache.. I do remember in 1988 Gail Paik painted several 28’ Braves in a row with that type of graphics. She called it her BLOB creations.. Maybe an interior picture will help, or if posable where was the original owner located..

Hey thanks,,, as far as Charlie and I being on board.. Its our pleasure..

[fund razor]

Fund Razor

I’m not too sure about that 28 Apache.. I do remember in 1988 Gail Paik painted several 28’ Braves in a row with that type of graphics. She called it her BLOB creations.. Maybe an interior picture will help, or if posable where was the original owner located..

Hey thanks,,, as far as Charlie and I being on board.. Its our pleasure..

Thanks for the response.
I am told that the original owner was a scuba diver. Could have been named Mr. Pullen. He lived in the Miami area, and the boat was then used by his son, who sold it finally early this year. I am told that the boat stayed in Miami from 88 to 08.
It had a couple of custom touches in the cabin, most notably built-in storage for air tanks, two each side in the side lockers, with recessed holders and straps.

Thanks again.

[Geronimo36]

Bobby,
You remember this guys boat.....................?

Little Tommy?

[GENERAL LEE]

Spoke to a buddy yesterday who told me a funny story... Over the summer we took a trip to Long Island with a bunch of boats, (2) 51' OL's, 42' OL and a 40' Hustler. On the way back, near Sandy Hook, I knudged the throttles forward and we were running 80 mph and passed all the boats and were running just ahead of a 51' OL and then I pulled back. At the time my buddy told me that I should have seen the look on the guys face in the 51' OL when we pulled away but I didnt' believe him cause we weren't even running WOT.:lurk5:

Fast forward a couple months later and one of the guys who was on the 51 OL says they thought we were running 90 mph and that the little Apache was beating up on all the big boys..... This story made it all the way down to one of our friends in Georgia and back to NJ, go figure.....:26::03::sifone:

LMAO, someone hand me my boots!

Serious Offshore: Home of the Whopper!

[Sea-Dated]

Great thread!!!!

[Geronimo36]

LMAO, someone hand me my boots!

Serious Offshore: Home of the Whopper!

Would you like fries with that? Gotta love it, right? We were running 80 mph, maybe even upper 70's.. MAX!!:seeya::lurk5:

[GENERAL LEE]

Would you like fries with that? Gotta love it, right? We were running 80 mph, maybe even upper 70's.. MAX!!:seeya::lurk5:

WHY would the guy in the OL say they were running 90, when you were running 75-80?? The two 51's had to be dragging a drive or were being driven by two rookies to have been slapped around by a 36 foot boat in ANY water. :huh:

Good looking Apache btw. :boobflash:

[Sea-Dated]

I was going to say driver has soooo much to do with it but B beat me to it.. Could be the boats are equal and you are just a better driver. I am talking about the Cigs, not the 51OL.

[Geronimo36]

WHY would the guy in the OL say they were running 90, when you were running 75-80?? The two 51's had to be dragging a drive or were being driven by two rookies to have been slapped around by a 36 foot boat in ANY water. :huh:

Good looking Apache btw. :boobflash:

I have no idea... I hit the recal on the GPS when we got back to the dock and look at what it read...:ack2: Maybe the Apache gods pushed the boat forward at warp speed. Plus, I tell all the guys we run with that the boat runs mid 80's (exactly how fast it is) and they don't believe me, they all think it runs 90. lol

Thanks for the compliment on the boat!

[GENERAL LEE]

I have no idea... I hit the recal on the GPS when we got back to the dock and look at what it read...:ack2: Maybe the Apache gods pushed the boat forward at warp speed.


:rofl:

At that speed you could go back in time and save Don Aronow!

[Geronimo36]

I was going to say driver has soooo much to do with it but B beat me to it.. Could be the boats are equal and you are just a better driver. I am talking about the Cigs, not the 51OL.

The Cig has smaller power and the Velocity doesn't ride as good in rough water. If the Cig had bigger power it would have been a fun run. The Cig run's 70 flat out and the Velocity supposedly runs 86 but he's never been able to pull me in any kind of water even when I had the 700's in the boat. :lurk5:

I wouldn't even consider going head to head with the 51's until I knew I had at least 5 mph on them so I could throttle them in rough water water or similar speeds in calm water. One of the 51's supposedly runs 96 and the other supposedly runs 90. We all cruise at about the same speed and RPM's so it's fun to travel together.

It's all in good fun fella's. I'm good friends with these guys and we're always busting each others chops. Them's the facts jack! :seeya:

[Top Banana]

These stories about speed remind me of the 60's ........Long beach to San Francisco race and everyone shows up and starts talking trash talk about their speeds. My boat does 75 ....no, my boat does 80...etc etc. Aronow is asked by the Sports Illustrated writer who is there covering the race....Don, how fast is that little boat of yours. Oh, on a good day we can do 62 MPH with it. Yup, you know the ending, Don won with an average just over 60MPH

[Geronimo36]

These stories about speed remind me of the 60's ........Long beach to San Francisco race and everyone shows up and starts talking trash talk about their speeds. My boat does 75 ....no, my boat does 80...etc etc. Aronow is asked by the Sports Illustrated writer who is there covering the race....Don, how fast is that little boat of yours. Oh, on a good day we can do 62 MPH with it. Yup, you know the ending, Don won with an average just over 60MPH

It seems the more things change the more they stay the same!!! :rofl:

[J-Bonz]

Yes sure do.. The gentleman on the left is my buddy Little Tommy.. He is the owner of Thunder Chief. If you see Tom, ask him about the time we took his Apache out for a test run off of Fort Lauderdale in 6’ seas.

Toms Apache was previous owned by the Storino Family who owns Jenkins Pavilion on the beach in Point Pleasant N.J. Jenkins Pavilion has been host to offshore Powerboat events for over forty years.

Great story Bobby. I will definatelly ask him. I know he will have 10 more stories to go along with it. Little Tommy is a great guy. He loves that boat.
Jr.

[Geronimo36]

Great stupid comment.

Come on Ed, have a sense of humor!:seeya:

[Bobby Saccenti]

[QUOTE=fund razor;24988]Thanks for the response.
I am told that the original owner was a scuba diver. Could have been named Mr. Pullen. He lived in the Miami area, and the boat was then used by his son, who sold it finally early this year. I am told that the boat stayed in Miami from 88 to 08.
It had a couple of custom touches in the cabin, most notably built-in storage for air tanks, two each side in the side lockers, with recessed holders and straps.

I am happy to hear that the Pullen family owned their Apache for twenty years, and now a new owner is enjoying it.. The name don’t ring a bell.. Perhaps Mr. Pullen bought his Apache from one of the few dealers we had at that time. Although I do recall something about fabricating custom dive tank holders in a 28' Apache back then. Just can’t put my finger on this one..

[Geronimo36]

Frank
I have a sense of humor, and if you posted something funny I would laugh.
But, you seem to have a chip on your shoulder about Mark McManus. And it is readily apparent.
Myself, ApacheCarl, Nykamp, Duna, the Delatore brothers and scores of other Offshore Powerboat guys feel Mark's Powerboats are something special. I'm sure they don't appreciate a pointed childlike comment towards McManus either. And maybe McManus reads it and decides not to join SOS and post. There goes that wealth of knowledge. It is just unnecessary.
Ed

Some people like the Giants, some like the Jets. Just because someone pokes fun doesn't mean a thing... You should feel confident enough in yourself not to worry what anyone else thinks. If Mark doesn't join this forum because of something one person says then shame on him.



PS, see ya on the water sometime. :seeya:

[Geronimo36]

You're too fragile.. lol :)

I'll see ya out on the water sometime..... ;)

[MarylandMark]

TIME OUT!

30+ post from Mr. Bobby Saccenti on this thread- take the pissing contest else where?

I'm hoping my intervention allows both to "save face of having the last word" so we can continue learning from the legend who was involved with this storied brand.

Please?

[Geronimo36]

TIME OUT!

30+ post from Mr. Bobby Saccenti on this thread- take the pissing contest else where?

I'm hoping my intervention allows both to "save face of having the last word" so we can continue learning from the legend who was involved with this storied brand.

Please?

Agreed Mark, let's talk about boats! :26:

[MarylandMark]

Thank you both :kiss:

MM- the new voice of reason on SOS.. :rofl:

[MarylandMark]

ooppss- I guess in light of this thread I should specify the MM I was referring to is mo-ah; MarylandMark

[catmando]

TsunamiI like how the exhaust is routed to balance both sides.

[Geronimo36]

nice Commanche

[Top Banana]

Bobby ......we all know how great the boat is with sterndrives, but did you ever build any Apaches with outboards?

[MarylandMark]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZ-sgjuMJcg

22 Scout outboard

Read the comments as well- interesting. The Red Thunder is for sale $25K (http://www.boattrader.com/listing/1987-Apache-Scout-93599170). Not an outboard but goes with the story..

[Geronimo36]

I remember a 33 at our marinaa a long time ago, probably a mid 80,s vintage. It was a center console wide beam withTRS and a tuna tower, pretty interesting boat.

Any details on that model Bobby?

[Bobby Saccenti]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZ-sgjuMJcg

22 Scout outboard

Read the comments as well- interesting. The Red Thunder is for sale $25K (http://www.boattrader.com/listing/1987-Apache-Scout-93599170). Not an outboard but goes with the story..

Mark

The Apache 21’ South race boat Rapid Transit did very well in their class.. That team had a lot of heart.

The I/O Scout Red Cloud was fast . It was owned and rigged by one of my former employees..

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby ......we all know how great the boat is with sterndrives, but did you ever build any Apaches with outboards?

Charlie

Yes I built two 36’ Apaches with outboards.. Both boats were exported to Margarita Venezuela..

Surprisingly enough the 36’ Apache ran great as an outboard application.. Nice attitude.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby ......we all know how great the boat is with sterndrives, but did you ever build any Apaches with outboards?

Also I built several 28’ Braves with outboards .. The 28’ Apache Brave also performed nicely with outboards..

Story about pictured boat.

The client that ordered the boat was from Colombia.. When the boat was ready for export, the owners partner show up with the buyer. They started arguing .. It seems that the partner wanted a fishing type boat.. So to make everybody happy I installed two Lee rod holders on the rear deck and saved the day.. They both left very happy and smiling..

Who said the boat business is easy…

[NJgr8ful]

WarHawk

Ed, what are details on WarHawk :cool: Where is it located? Power? Is that a 41'??

Nice boat, had not seen that one before. :26:

[Geronimo36]

Bobby, this is the center console I was talking about.

also, what was the deal on this other 47'? I heard it's no longer around??? :(

[GENERAL LEE]

TIME OUT!

30+ post from Mr. Bobby Saccenti on this thread- take the pissing contest else where?

I'm hoping my intervention allows both to "save face of having the last word" so we can continue learning from the legend who was involved with this storied brand.

Please?

Good post MM. It's true that he and other notable people will leave if people harrass them. They have nothing to prove and are happy to talk with people that enjoy hearing about the golden days of racing, but certainly don't have to put up with negative comments toward them.

There has to be some level of rules (or censorship if that's what you want to call it), or the legends will find another place again.

[Top Banana]

Last year Bobby and I along with a bunch of other people were honored as "Legends of Offshore" at the Pt. Pleasant race.

A couple of us were asked to be on the pace boats for the start of the race.

I was fortunate enough to be throttling this beautiful 47 foot Apache for the start.

Thank you Jeff at Freeze Frame for the beautiful shots.

[Top Banana]

Bobby has some great stories to go along with this boat, but I will let him decide if he wants to tell them. The present owner has done a fantastic job of keeping this real piece of history alive and well.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby, this is the center console I was talking about.

also, what was the deal on this other 47'? I heard it's no longer around??? :(

Frank!!

Where the heck did you get that picture of the yellow 47’ Apache????

When the government auctioned off Kramers Apache assets in Hollywood Florida.. Two gentleman from Ohio purchased the 47’ V mold and the Apache 41’ Catamaran molds. After the purchase they called me and ask if they can deliver the molds to my 188th Street facility and would like to talk about building a few boats .. HA! I was the only named apache standing at that time..

Upon the molds arrival I seen that both molds had been left outside, and not in the best of shape. One of the owners ask if I can build him a yellow 47’ Apache pleasure model.. I said yes BUT do not expect the sides to be perfect.. Also I said, there was never a 47’ deck mold. (To make a 47 deck, first a complete 41’ deck and a half of a forward bow part had to be cut fitted and glass together) Due to the fact that the 41’ Apache molds where auctioned off to another individual, that left us short of a deck mold to complete the program.

The only choice I had was to figure a way to cut up a 36’ Apache Warrior deck and fit it together in the same fashion. So I called a meeting of all my geniuses and we figured it out..

It was the only 47’ Apache ever built with a stretched 36’ Apache Warrior deck on it.. Not to mention ( in my opinion ) the 47’ Apache looked a lot better than it ever did before.. (Big Smile)

After the boat was completed, the owner took the 47’ to his own facility in Ohio to be rigged.. About a few months later, while they were rigging the 47’ it court fire and burned to the ground..

Frank, See if you can find more pictures ?? I had a bunch, but over the years they all got lost in the shuffle..

[ApacheRob]

I love this stuff!! This is what its all about.

[Geronimo36]

Frank!!

Where the heck did you get that picture of the yellow 47’ Apache????

When the government auctioned off Kramers Apache assets in Hollywood Florida.. Two gentleman from Ohio purchased the 47’ V mold and the Apache 41’ Catamaran molds. After the purchase they called me and ask if they can deliver the molds to my 188th Street facility and would like to talk about building a few boats .. HA! I was the only named apache standing at that time..

Upon the molds arrival I seen that both molds had been left outside, and not in the best of shape. One of the owners ask if I can build him a yellow 47’ Apache pleasure model.. I said yes BUT do not expect the sides to be perfect.. Also I said, there was never a 47’ deck mold. (To make a 47 deck, first a complete 41’ deck and a half of a forward bow part had to be cut fitted and glass together) Due to the fact that the 41’ Apache molds where auctioned off to another individual, that left us short of a deck mold to complete the program.

The only choice I had was to figure a way to cut up a 36’ Apache Warrior deck and fit it together in the same fashion. So I called a meeting of all my geniuses and we figured it out..

It was the only 47’ Apache ever built with a stretched 36’ Apache Warrior deck on it.. Not to mention ( in my opinion ) the 47’ Apache looked a lot better than it ever did before.. (Big Smile)

After the boat was completed, the owner took the 47’ to his own facility in Ohio to be rigged.. About a few months later, while they were rigging the 47’ it court fire and burned to the ground..

Frank, See if you can find more pictures ?? I had a bunch, but over the years they all got lost in the shuffle..

Cool story, thanks Bobby! The internet is a wonderful thing, I'll see what else I can dig up!!

[SHARKEY-IMAGES]

http://sharkeyimages.zenfolio.com/img/v0/p67951436-3.jpg

[Dunaruna]

Why Apaches are so cool. This is what its all about,
Old fashioned endurance racing.Cowes Torquay Cowes 2008 . Duna

[Nykamp]

WAR HAWK and ALLEZ VITE are sisterships built at the same time, and when mines on the water they still get together and run around west michigan.

[Top Banana]

Tim, thank you for putting up that shot.

Left to right..Bobby Saccenti, WARPATH / John Bochis, CRAZY GREEK, / Jerry Gilbreath, ALCONE MOTORSPORTS / Rocky Aoki, BENIHANA /(kneeling) John Hagin, MISS GEICO / Billy Martin, BOUNTY HUNTER / Rich Luhrs / SHADOW CAT / Charlie McCarthy / TOP BANANA

[Top Banana]

Hey, if your going to start putting up videos to watch now......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79II-JbqI1k

[SHARKEY-IMAGES]

Tim, thank you for putting up that shot.

Left to right..Bobby Saccenti, WARPATH / John Bochis, CRAZY GREEK, / Jerry Gilbreath, ALCONE MOTORSPORTS / Rocky Aoki, BENIHANA /(kneeling) John Hagin, MISS GEICO / Billy Martin, BOUNTY HUNTER / Rich Luhrs / SHADOW CAT / Charlie McCarthy / TOP BANANA

Anytime ! :)

Here is a link to all of the rest of the photos from that presentation:

http://sharkeyimages.zenfolio.com/p602801402


Enjoy !

[MarylandMark]

There was one for sale for $1M-$1.5M a year or so ago.

What happened to that one? I saw him on the KW PR for the Worlds around 03 I think- thought he had just completed it. Each seat was a dif color- lot of lot of colors in it.

[viperfitness1]

There was one for sale for $1M-$1.5M a year or so ago.

What happened to that one? I saw him on the KW PR for the Worlds around 03 I think- thought he had just completed it. Each seat was a dif color- lot of lot of colors in it.

this one??

i seen it coming back from kw this year...

[MarylandMark]

That's it!! Was in the Robb Report for a while

side not about outboard boats- there was one posted on post 59 (http://www.seriousoffshore.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6707&postcount=59)

[Geronimo36]

Hey, if your going to start putting up videos to watch now......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79II-JbqI1k

Cool video!!

Here's some video of my boat playing around with Starchaser earlier this summer, actually he was the one playing!:ack2: Boat runs near 100 with NA'ed engines. There's an interesting story that goes along with my boat and Starchaser but to make a long story short, the engines in my boat were in Starchaser before the previous owner took ownership of my boat..

It was really great to run with Starchaser this summer and look forward to running alongside that badboy next summer!:sifone:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiD5XhPW5XE ( 3 min in)
http://media.putfile.com/NYC-2008-1
http://media.putfile.com/NYC-2008-3

[GENERAL LEE]

Hi Andy
Great pics of Spirit of Apache! Huge power in that 47! McManus did a incredible job! "Mark McManus....Master boat builder"
Ed

His work is very impressive, and the "look" he goes for is very distinctive. I don't have any reason to care about whatever fallout there was with the business back in the day. The style, and simple but so perfect lines of their boats is what I appreciate about them.

The work McManus did on Warhawk and Spirit of Apache when they were updated is nothing short of breathtaking. It takes awhile, and it's expensive, but the result is as good as it gets for redoing some of these classics.

It would be cool to someday see Ultimate Warrior get an update. Geronimo, Ghost Runner, Tonto, and many other favorites of mine have all been reborn. It's great to see people out there that still love those boats and have spent the time and money to keep them in top shape. :coolgleamA:

[viperfitness1]

Hi Andy
Great pics of Spirit of Apache! Huge power in that 47! McManus did a incredible job! "Mark McManus....Master boat builder"
Ed

thx ed,

it was really cool... we were headed to the airport in miami and it was sitting at the owners dealership on display just off us1. we were running late to the airport but i still had to stop for some pics. they even let me crawl all over it to get a good look... those motors were amazing and the attention to detail was killer!!!

andy

[catmando]

Broken Arrow..... 47 ApacheLook at all those gauges!!! Awesome helm!! What speeds is he seeing with the twin turbo Chiefs?

[MarylandMark]

Andy I went to drool over your boat some more (awesome!!) and saw this- good stuff

http://www.predator41.com/Images/articles/extremeboatssoa.pdf

[rockfish71]

03:

[MarylandMark]

So how many wide beams were there?

Quick run down (or long but know it is a lot to ask) on who built what when?

Name of company, main players, in business from when to when and what rides where made during those times to include the most famous?

[Bobby Saccenti]

How’s this for a yacht tender..

No paint, 100 % black gelcoat with tan leather interior. Now this was a fun project, designing lifting brackets to lift this 36' Apache to sit on the back deck..

[baywatch]

What was the story with the "Little Injun" mid-console boat that was for sale a while back at national liquidators? I believe it was a 32 or 33' boat.

[Dunaruna]

A real nice 36 and demands attention when ever present on the Cote' D'azur
France. Been out when the boat has been running on a couple of occasions.
Duna.

[ChiefApache]

A real nice 36 and demands attention when ever present on the Cote' D'azur
France. Been out when the boat has been running on a couple of occasions.
Duna.

Wow is that a beautiful boat! I can't imagine how difficult it would be to keep that boat clean, but she's awesome!

[Dunaruna]

Poor Quality Photos in a dark yard but you get the picture.
Alot of attention to detail,:sifone: and on the water this boat is Bad!!!!!!!!!!Duna.

[Bobby Saccenti]

What was the story with the "Little Injun" mid-console boat that was for sale a while back at national liquidators? I believe it was a 32 or 33' boat.

Last I seen of the 32’ Apache / Aronow Little Injun, was sold a few years back to a fellow by the name Ted that post under the name DREAMER on the other web-site.. Nice boat.. After that I lost track of it..

[Bobby Saccenti]

Poor Quality Photos in a dark yard but you get the picture.
Alot of attention to detail,:sifone: and on the water this boat is Bad!!!!!!!!!!Duna.

Thank You

Do you happen to know if Mr. Flynn stills own the Bull Roar. Last I seen the Apache , it was on its way to Europe on the back of his yacht The Battered Bull. When the Apache arrived in Europe I made arrangements for Patrick in the Netherlands to look after the Apache for Mr. Flynn. That’s the last information I have.. .

[Dunaruna]

Hi Bobby, as far as i know Patrick is still looking after the vassel and it travels between the USA and Europe, i believe the same guy owns it but there was talk of another vessel being aquired, again this was at least two years ago. We know when it arrives hEre as it tends to make alot of Noise.:sifone:

[Roger 1]

Thank You

Do you happen to know if Mr. Flynn stills own the Bull Roar. Last I seen the Apache , it was on its way to Europe on the back of his yacht The Battered Bull. When the Apache arrived in Europe I made arrangements for Patrick in the Netherlands to look after the Apache for Mr. Flynn. That’s the last information I have.. .

Bobby;

I believe that Bull Roar was seen in Chicago this summer running on the lake.

Roger

[Dunaruna]

Apache Warrior 36 "FoxTrot Oscar", Running St Tropez a typical day in our area going for Lunch!!!!!!!!!! Duna

[Roger 1]

Here are a couple of pictures of Batterd Bull

[Geronimo36]

How’s this for a yacht tender..

No paint, 100 % black gelcoat with tan leather interior. Now this was a fun project, designing lifting brackets to lift this 36' Apache to sit on the back deck..

Always loved that boat! :coolgleamA:

[Geronimo36]

Pretty sure Geronimo is in the background on this pic.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Here are a couple of pictures of Batterd Bull

Hi Roger

The yacht in the picture is The Ivory Lady built by Choy Lee.. We supplied twine 21’ Scouts as tenders.. I believe this yacht was owned by the person that started Boat Trader publications

[Roger 1]

A few more that I found.

[Bobby Saccenti]

Apache Warrior 36 "FoxTrot Oscar", Running St Tropez a typical day in our area going for Lunch!!!!!!!!!! Duna

Duna

The very first 36’ Apache I built was sent to St Tropez, and many more followed.. One of my favorites was a boat called “Calumet” I believe it mean Chief in French?? Sorry to say all the pictures I had of this boat are lost someplace.. I also think this boat was seenh being used for a tender on a yacht in the port?

[Geronimo36]

Bobby, how many step bottom 36's were built? The F2-36 boat, where is it now? I remember watching that boat run at the SBI NYC race some years ago. And of course Meanstreak some years before that!

[Bobby Saccenti]

So how many wide beams were there?

Quick run down (or long but know it is a lot to ask) on who built what when?

Name of company, main players, in business from when to when and what rides where made during those times to include the most famous?

HA! I don't think you really want to get into this one at this time.. Maybe a at a latter date.. But here is a picture of a early Apache I built 35' / 12' beam powered by 3208 Caterpillers..

[Bobby Saccenti]

Bobby, how many step bottom 36's were built? The F2-36 boat, where is it now? I remember watching that boat run at the SBI NYC race some years ago. And of course Meanstreak some years before that!

Frank

I recall maybe three with the original design.. The 36 - F2 boat is still owned by its original owner Carl in New Hampshire.. Every once in a whiel he takes it out for a blast. We still stay in touch. I will have to look for some picture of the other ones..

Meansteak 41

Yes I also throttled that boat in few races..

[Geronimo36]

Bobby, here's a pic of the boat running up around NYC thru the lower Manhattan ferry wakes! :coolgleamA:

And a picture Lucy/Mark took when we were running somewhere off Long Island.

[phragle]

HA! I don't think you really want to get into this one at this time.. Maybe a at a latter date.. But here is a picture of a early Apache I built 35' / 12' beam powered by 3208 Caterpillers..

That brochure lists a 60', can you imagine that with tripple turbines?? pimpin at speed!! :26:

[GENERAL LEE]

Thank You

Do you happen to know if Mr. Flynn stills own the Bull Roar. Last I seen the Apache , it was on its way to Europe on the back of his yacht The Battered Bull. When the Apache arrived in Europe I made arrangements for Patrick in the Netherlands to look after the Apache for Mr. Flynn. That’s the last information I have.. .

That's my all time favorite 36, and you were building it the first time I met you! I have wondered for years what ever happened to it.

You also had my two buddies from Oklahoma, Jay & Wayne Kempton's 36 (Warparty) under construction at the same time. I came in a few times to check on it and see the rest of the boats being worked on. I wish you were still building them! I miss those "check in" trips. :coolgleamA:

[MarylandMark]

HA! I don't think you really want to get into this one at this time.. Maybe a at a latter date..

Understandable (not saying that as I know the story but have heard there was some bad blood out there).

Thanks for sharing all you have so far- can't imagine how exciting those times had to be!

[GENERAL LEE]

Name of company, main players, in business from when to when and what rides where made during those times to include the most famous?


Holy chit that would take Bobby the rest of the year to explain. :ack2:

There are TONS of threads on OSO regarding the history of the boats, and the rough story of how the business ran throughout it's years. Great stuff if you have LOTS of time.

[ar15meister]

does anyone know what speeds Tonto is capable of running? What are the engine details?

[Geronimo36]

Magnum Mark's - "Lucy's Mercruiser Special"!

Lucididee took these pics from my boat as we were running together leaving Jones Beach Inlet! :coolgleamA:

[Geronimo36]

A few more of the Lucy Special, we had a good swell running out of the inlet this day!:seeya:

Had the day off from work so we took a run out to Bracco's and ran into these cat's! It was a great run!!

More pics of the two runs and the Lucy Special here;
http://www.lucidideefastboats.com/2007runtobraccosjuly.html
http://www.lucidideefastboats.com/2007freeportrun.html

[Geronimo36]

Got any running shots of your boat Ed?

[Geronimo36]

Twistana 36'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emqMESwDHPk

[thedonz]

I seem to remember the engines being 950 Chiefs. Incredible Apache!

just about 100 mph.... in 5-6 footers...TRUST me i know :26::26:

[Top Banana]

FAIR WARNING.........All you Apache owners....this time HORBA is giving you 1 year to get ready.

When we ran the first real open ocean water offshore race last year, from Miami to Bimini and back, not even one Apache showed up for the event.

Bad timing, fear of water, going through a divorce, high gas prices, etc etc etc, I heard all the excuses....no more excuses, get those boats ready!!!!!

You have one year to get ready for a 100 mile run from Key West next November 2009.

The you have two months to get ready for the Miami to Key West race 190 miles on the Saturday after the Miami Boat Show in February 2010.

We will even have a special APACHE class if enough show up.

[Geronimo36]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGVi2urDP0w
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGVi2urDP0w

[Geronimo36]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_6vdTEChas

[Geronimo36]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Dk5ihhAw64

[Geronimo36]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAeUqU5L6bo

[J-Bonz]

Frank

I recall maybe three with the original design.. The 36 - F2 boat is still owned by its original owner Carl in New Hampshire.. Every once in a whiel he takes it out for a blast. We still stay in touch. I will have to look for some picture of the other ones..

Meansteak 41

Yes I also throttled that boat in few races..

Here's a KW pic of it in 1999

[Geronimo36]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDR5SkgKHTw

[J-Bonz]

Hey Bobby,
Your remember this one......? I beleive the original owner was from ohio.
Jr.

[DKwestern]

whats the story on War Dance?

[J-Bonz]

whats the story on War Dance?

Isnt that the old Jenny's Express................?
Jr.

[DKwestern]

who re-did it? what power?

[stecz20]

this is a great thread, and you guys are being nice to each other.... there is hope for the world.....lol

[MarylandMark]

When we ran the first real open ocean water offshore race last year, from Miami to Bimini and back....

Bad timing, fear of water, going through a divorce, high gas prices, etc etc etc, I heard all the excuses....no more excuses, get those boats ready!!!!!

You have one year to get ready for a 100 mile run from Key West next November 2009.


Am I reading that as in KW-Bimini-KW? I don't see it listed on your site (http://www.historicraceboats.com/races.htm) under races?

I'd love a ride if anyone has a spot for some green stuff (not like this :26: but the real green stuff)


Holy chit that would take Bobby the rest of the year to explain. :ack2:

There are TONS of threads on OSO regarding the history of the boats, and the rough story of how the business ran throughout it's years. Great stuff if you have LOTS of time.

Even I don't have that much time! LOL- was looking for a Cliff Notes version


War Dance

Now that thing is bad azz! What's the plan for it- power, etc?

[MarylandMark]

36 F2 boat; Carl in NH- is the "Apache Carl"?


Pretty cool being the original owner!

[Sea-Dated]

36' War Party:sifone:

[Roger 1]

A couple of more recent pictures.:(

[Geronimo36]

Hoggie.......Apache Warrior..........Chill Out Warrior

Steve's boat, Apache Warrior, is/was a legend in our area. The engines were tunnel ram 750's and the boat ran upper 70's. It wasn't the fastest boat but when it was big no one could keep up with him.

When I got a call a few months ago from my buddy Billy saying that he heard from Steve that my Apache was beating up on the big boys back home I was real happy!! Even though we weren't beating up on the big boys it was good to hear the rumor mill made its way down to Steve.

The boat is currently being restored and the paint job is completely gone...which for me is a shame because some people I know painted it in a barn in Freehold... Looks like it was painted outdoors so hopefully it looks good :(