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ILMORdude
04-30-2010, 01:03 PM
Buddy of mine has twin engine turd with alphas and they both spin the same direction. This cant be right, can it? What does one do in this situation?

MOBILEMERCMAN
04-30-2010, 01:06 PM
They are right hand rotation. There is a counter lower unit that can be used.

PARADOX
04-30-2010, 01:09 PM
Some of the older boats, Including my Formula has twin with Alpha and THEY DO turn the same direction. The HP's and the speed probobly not warrant counter rotation.
There are "Alpha" models that will rotate counterclockwise.
Your friend can get an Alpha that would rotate the "opposite" direction, if it's worth it.

MOBILEMERCMAN
04-30-2010, 01:09 PM
http://www.mercruiserparts.com/Show_pictures3.asp?dnbr=%2099964&ivar=IMAGES/CRUISER/99964/30073.png&inbr=2203&bnbr=140&bdesc=GEAR+HOUSING%28PROPELLER+SHAFT%29+-%28COUNTER+ROTATION%29

htrdlncn
04-30-2010, 02:32 PM
SEI sells new counter rotation lowers dirt cheap.
http://www.sterndrive.cc/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=90-108-02&Category_Code=MercruiserAlphaLowerSterndrive

DAREDEVIL
04-30-2010, 04:15 PM
SEI sells new counter rotation lowers dirt cheap.
http://www.sterndrive.cc/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=90-108-02&Category_Code=MercruiserAlphaLowerSterndrive

:iagree: , thats the way to go ...back in the days they did not have a counter rotating ALPHA I some actually had counter rotating engines.....:eek:

phragle
04-30-2010, 05:32 PM
My monster majorly underbuilt supernova has same rotation alpha's... not a problem (well at least I know its not a problem up to 47.8 mph (GPS varified)

MOBILEMERCMAN
04-30-2010, 07:11 PM
.back in the days they did not have a counter rotating ALPHA I some actually had counter rotating engines.....:eek:

I call BS

DAREDEVIL
04-30-2010, 07:15 PM
I call BS

WHY??? I am serious, the Alpha I gen I ,came out only as RH rotation,,,it toke over 2 years to get Merc build a LH rotation lower !!!!!!!

The Gen II had no problem .

Some old Alpha I boats have counter rotating eninges because of that.

Just like old style TRS !!!!!!!:eek:

SO, no BS !!!! mmmhhhhhh

If u think ,,,explain please !!!

MOBILEMERCMAN
04-30-2010, 07:18 PM
Some old Alpha I boats have counter rotating eninges because of that.

Just like old style TRS !!!!!!!:eek:



I don't believe for a second anybody ever counter rotated an engine for an Alpha or TRS.

DAREDEVIL
04-30-2010, 07:20 PM
I don't believe for a second anybody ever counter rotated an engine for an Alpha or TRS.

OH, YES THEY DID !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bad Idea Baja
04-30-2010, 07:42 PM
I don't believe for a second anybody ever counter rotated an engine for an Alpha or TRS.

I can't say for an Alpha or TRS, but I had a customer with a pair of Crusader 454's in a big old direct drive cruiser & one engine was a counter rotating engine.

MOBILEMERCMAN
04-30-2010, 10:41 PM
Inboards commonly have left and right rotations. Stern drives are a different story. Spiral gears are designed to spin a given direction. As the spin they either try to come together or repel. They are shimmed accordingly. Straight cut gears don't care. Alphas and TRS drives have spiral gear patterns. You cannot reverse them. Then there is the water pump issue..

US1Fountain
04-30-2010, 11:08 PM
The Alphas can't be reversed like a Bravo can. They'll be junk before your day on the lake is over.
Gotta go to CR lower unit.

Standard rotations use RH props.
CR use LH props

MOBILEMERCMAN
04-30-2010, 11:39 PM
Bravo's are a different situation. The Standard and X's have spiral upper gears. They all have straight cut lower gears. You can spin the lower both directions. You can not spin the upper in both directions.

DAREDEVIL
04-30-2010, 11:47 PM
Bravo's are a different situation. The Standard and X's have spiral upper gears. They all have straight cut lower gears. You can spin the lower both directions. You can not spin the upper in both directions.

I THINK U CAN ?? if i change rotation on a bravo, i just shift reverse !!!
SO the upper would also turn oposite ....NO ??? :confused:

MOBILEMERCMAN
05-01-2010, 12:03 AM
Please... All Mecruiser stern drives are left hand engines. All the uppers spin the same direction. The lower changes the rotation in Alphas, TRS,and Speedmasters. The bravo is different it shifts in the upper. The lower has straight gears and can spin both ways. The input in the upper still spins with the engine.

Some maybe all speedmasters have straight cut gears in the uppers. Some have been spun both directions. I suppose a XR could be spun both ways but, why bother.

DAREDEVIL
05-01-2010, 12:05 AM
Please... All Mecruiser stern drives are left hand engines. All the uppers spin the same direction. The lower changes the rotation in Alphas, TRS,and Speedmasters. The bravo is different it shifts in the upper. The lower has straight gears and can spin both ways. The input in the upper still spins with the engine.

Some maybe all speedmasters have straight cut gears in the uppers. Some have been spun both directions. I suppose a XR could be spun both ways but, why bother.

makes sense...dont yell at me and get mad..i am learning JIm..lol:sifone:

jet
05-01-2010, 12:30 AM
come on guys the mercman is spot on google it................some of the BIG money guys have done counter rotation out drive motors for boat balance but production outdrive stuff is all lefty with the rotation delt with in the drive

fixxxer22
05-01-2010, 08:17 PM
OH, YES THEY DID !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:iagree:even ford made counter-rotating engines for marine use. I had a reman 5.0 come for a mustang. i put it in and ran it and it ran like crap. after a long diag we found out that they had put a marine counter rotation cam in it at the reman shop. (it was a gopher) soo i had to put another cam in it but they did go backward as far as ford went.

DAREDEVIL
05-01-2010, 08:44 PM
:iagree:even ford made counter-rotating engines for marine use. I had a reman 5.0 come for a mustang. i put it in and ran it and it ran like crap. after a long diag we found out that they had put a marine counter rotation cam in it at the reman shop. (it was a gopher) soo i had to put another cam in it but they did go backward as far as ford went.

fixxer, they don't believe me ..but i had a scarab in germany with alphas and one engine was counter rotating , both drives where RH but 1 spun the other way..boat ran ok all the time.
28 scarab 1985ish

HiZ
05-01-2010, 10:47 PM
GOpheR do you mean Guinnea Pig?

US1Fountain
05-01-2010, 11:04 PM
: I had a reman 5.0 come for a mustang. i put it in and ran it and it ran like crap. after a long diag we found out that they had put a marine counter rotation cam in it at the reman shop.


So your motor ran with a reverse cam in it, yet the motor still spun the normal direction? Interesting

DAREDEVIL
05-01-2010, 11:14 PM
So your motor ran with a reverse cam in it, yet the motor still spun the normal direction? Interesting

well i guess that cant work..lol:eek::rolleyes::sifone:

MOBILEMERCMAN
05-02-2010, 01:56 AM
The reverse rotation engine is not the issue. Everybody makes reverse engines. Its the Alpha drive spinning backwards that wont work.

By the way Alphas came out in '86. They have ramped clutch dogs. How do you spin them backwards?

Ratickle
05-02-2010, 09:55 AM
The reverse rotation engine is not the issue. Everybody makes reverse engines. Its the Alpha drive spinning backwards that wont work.

By the way Alphas came out in '86. They have ramped clutch dogs. How do you spin them backwards?

Put the dogs in backwards too???????:sifone:

MOBILEMERCMAN
05-02-2010, 10:13 AM
28 scarab 1985ish

Can't say what year your boat was?:bump::bump:

DAREDEVIL
05-02-2010, 10:43 AM
Can't say what year your boat was?:bump::bump:

No, don't remember ..i think it was 1985 , could be 86 ????
i had to many..lol

I know my 88 sonic had 1 counter rotating alpha, the beretta had a volvo penta and the other boats had TRS or Bravo ...mmmmhhhhh

But i remember something was not right with the scarab, about the drives.....
Damn, that was in '97 when i had that thing:eek:

Ratickle
05-02-2010, 10:56 AM
I believe 1991 was the first year of the counter rotation Alpha drive.

DAREDEVIL
05-02-2010, 11:02 AM
I believe 1991 was the first year of the counter rotation Alpha drive.

Then somebody must have switched befor i bought the boat in 99 .
I remember they where gen II's Alpha I's !!!!! ( on the Sonic )

By the way,, great boat all around !!!

MOBILEMERCMAN
05-02-2010, 11:36 AM
I believe 1991 was the first year of the counter rotation Alpha drive.

I can't say I recall exactly when but, I remember it being earlier. The alpha counter was made available when the shifting counter outboards were released.

rchevelle71
05-02-2010, 11:36 AM
I agree with Jim, you can't spin an Alpha backwards, at least not for long. But yes they did make reverse rotation motors.

phragle
05-02-2010, 11:57 AM
The reverse rotation engine is not the issue. Everybody makes reverse engines. Its the Alpha drive spinning backwards that wont work.

By the way Alphas came out in '86. They have ramped clutch dogs. How do you spin them backwards?

Well, it would be a start to have a really good friend with a really nice macine shop and make all new guts. I have seen much stranger things. Remember Dimpled Widgets made an alpha with a short upper to stick behind a gazillion horespower and go faster than Reggie's Cat Chaser.

And those German guys, everyone I have met has been friggen crazy. Crazy enough to hand build a counter rotatng alpha? quite possibly. Now whether or not it worked worth a damn may have been dependent on if itwas built around october fest or not.

MOBILEMERCMAN
05-02-2010, 01:55 PM
Crazy enough to hand build a counter rotatng alpha? quite possibly.

Back to my point. I don't believe it. If you had to modify the drive to spin it backwards why go through the effort of spinning the motor backwards too. Now everything is modified. What a waste of time and energy.

I am over this discussion. I have better things to do with my time then debate with DD:seeya:

DAREDEVIL
05-02-2010, 07:22 PM
Back to my point. I don't believe it. If you had to modify the drive to spin it backwards why go through the effort of spinning the motor backwards too. Now everything is modified. What a waste of time and energy.

I am over this discussion. I have better things to do with my time then debate with DD:seeya:

Why me ????

Hell. i only said that i had a boat where this was the case...DID I MODIFY ANYTHING ON IT ....NO...it was like that when i bought it ... did last the 3 month i had it ..YES and i ran it as hard as it would run !!!!!

End of my part in this.

Ps, no doubt in my mind u know more about this stuff then i do,, but its what i had. SORRY, for beeing me. :leaving:

fixxxer22
05-02-2010, 08:41 PM
So your motor ran with a reverse cam in it, yet the motor still spun the normal direction? Interesting

You would have to be near it. it was awful! It did run and it is a staple from the ghoper engine corp to sned messed uo engines. I have yet to have one come to me that was ready to rock. all i needed was a starter that turned it the other way and she would have run great. sounded like it was dieseling (like when heavy carbon builds up on pistons and they run backward when you shut them off). Also the no oil pressure was interesting. but it ran. and it was a fox body mustang with EFI.

DAREDEVIL
05-02-2010, 08:51 PM
You would have to be near it. it was awful! It did run and it is a staple from the ghoper engine corp to sned messed uo engines. I have yet to have one come to me that was ready to rock. all i needed was a starter that turned it the other way and she would have run great. sounded like it was dieseling (like when heavy carbon builds up on pistons and they run backward when you shut them off). Also the no oil pressure was interesting. but it ran. and it was a fox body mustang with EFI.

WOW....lol:eek: