To all P-class racers in KW !!!!!!!

[DAREDEVIL]

I would like to call in a little get to gether, and talk about how we can get the P classes more fair and better for the sports.

Lets hook up in KW and talk about it.


Scott

Ps .: i contacted Rich and he will listen to our BS to make things better for 2010 !!!!!!!!!:USA:

[SVL66]

How can you make it more fair? You can only do so much with bracket racing, without adding a bazillion more classes.

[Ratickle]

How can you make it more fair? You can only do so much with bracket racing, without adding a bazillion more classes.

I will disagree some.

The 6 classes in OPA are plenty. I would argue for one less at the top, but that's just based on participation, not anything else.

However, the rules for the bottom classes, and the tech inspections required, need to be standardized for all the orgs, and all the boats in those classes. Currently, the exact same boat would/could be in different classes in all 4 orgs.

For instance, and let's keep it simple, a good performing:

SVL -
Outboard Cat -
SuperCat Light -
Super Vee -
Old F2 -
Old F1 -

would fit into what P classes in the 4 orgs?

[Ryan Beckley]

You tell us what class they SHOULD be in, not what class people race them in....

SVL -90mph
Outboard Cat -100mph
SuperCat Light -120mph
Super Vee -100mph
Old F2 -85mph
Old F1 -80mph

[MikeyFIN]

Also one thing...

That you have to finish 70% of the race to get a personal result and at least 5 boats at the start.
I´m willing to have the U.I.M rulebook with me for reference or ideas.

[DAREDEVIL]

What we are going to try is to bring it down to 3 P- classes,,so we will have more boats in each class !!!

Length rules and so on.

Thats the idea.

Like 80,90,110 MPH

up to >32, >36, >40 feet

80 MPH only single engine boats ??

Something like that,, I KNOW IT WILL NEVER BE FAIR,,but maybe close.

[DAREDEVIL]

You tell us what class they SHOULD be in, not what class people race them in....

SVL -90mph
Outboard Cat -100mph
SuperCat Light -120mph
Super Vee -100mph
Old F2 -85mph
Old F1 -80mph

I think old F-2 is more 90 ?!

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Aside from matching break out speeds thru the orgs they are fine IMO.

Scott what could be more fair? Less laps? LOL

Paul , I don't follow. The point of Brackets is to disregard spec origins.

F1 is over . Next evolution is SVL or Class 4

F2 is over. Next evolution is SV or class 4 or Class 3

F1 and F2 were similar speeds before the staggers.

[Ratickle]

What we are going to try is to bring it down to 3 P- classes,,so we will have more boats in each class !!!

Length rules and so on.

Thats the idea.

Like 80,90,110 MPH

>33, >36, > 40 feet

80 MPH only single engine boats ??

Something like that,, I KNOW IT WILL NEVER BE FAIR,,but maybe close.

You really need the under 30, Vee only, 70 or 75 class. Look at the OPA. The most competition is in classes 6 and 5.

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

You really need the under 30, Vee only, 70 or 75 class. Look at the OPA. The most competition is in classes 6 and 5.

So why talk about changing it?

[DAREDEVIL]

Aside from matching break out speeds thru the orgs they are fine IMO.

Scott what could be more fair? Less laps? LOL

Paul , I don't follow. The point of Brackets is to disregard spec origins.

F1 is over . Next evolution is SVL or Class 4

F2 is over. Next evolution is SV or class 4 or Class 3

F1 and F2 were similar speeds before the staggers.

Jim,,,and all u guys.

THIS IS NOT MY IDEA,,JUST POSTING THIS FOR A COUPLE OF PEOPLE.
I SPOKE TO RICH D. AND HE AGREED TO MAKE A MEATING TO DISCUSS THIS.
Also, realy don't care about same bracket speeds in diffrent org. since nobody is showing up anyways.

We gonna try to fix 1 org. ( SBI ) we can't fix all at once !?:(

[Ratickle]

Aside from matching break out speeds thru the orgs they are fine IMO.

Scott what could be more fair? Less laps? LOL

Paul , I don't follow. The point of Brackets is to disregard spec origins.

F1 is over . Next evolution is SVL or Class 4

F2 is over. Next evolution is SV or class 4 or Class 3

F1 and F2 were similar speeds before the staggers.

I understand that. But, with those spec classes as starters, if they were all of a sudden gone, and only P classes remained, where would they fit? Gives a starting point everyone can agree on maybe. Like you say, F1 and F2 are gone, where do they fit? As the P classes become more and more popular, say what you want, can I take my old supercat light and run it in class 3 with a reprop?

Maybe a better choice of Spec classes to start with?

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Well Scott I wish you the best and will not but in anymore.

Last word just fit in don't try to change for your specific needs.

[DAREDEVIL]

You really need the under 30, Vee only, 70 or 75 class. Look at the OPA. The most competition is in classes 6 and 5.

IN SBI we really don't have that many boats so why think about what OPA does.
We changed the rules for this year from 82-85 in P-4,,,i had my boat dialed in @ 81.8 max,,,,perfect. then we changed it to get some other teams from opa involved ( request ) i and other teams agreed,,,and how many teams ahowed up ????

[DAREDEVIL]

Well Scott I wish you the best and will not but in anymore.

Last word just fit in don't try to change for your specific needs.

Its not because of me !!!!!!!!!!!!

in the last post i used me as an example ,,,but i can care less.

Also ,,please,,,u think all the P5 boats SBI has can NOT run 80????? LOL

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

I understand that. But, with those spec classes as starters, if they were all of a sudden gone, and only P classes remained, where would they fit? Gives a starting point everyone can agree on maybe. Like you say, F1 and F2 are gone, where do they fit? As the P classes become more and more popular, say what you want, can I take my old supercat light and run it in class 3 with a reprop?

Maybe a better choice of Spec classes to start with?

It seems pretty clear F2 run class 4
F1 run class 5
SVL run class 4
Cat OB run class 3
Cat light class 1

How much better can it get?

[Ratickle]

We gonna try to fix 1 org. ( SBI ) we can't fix all at once !?:(

You can try to standardize. I expect all the orgs will be represented there. It is a good start.

I still would like to see a combined of GPS maximum and average lap speed. But, too controversial.

And the spec class in UIM is different yet. They have time penalties I believe for going over, not automatic dq's.

[Ratickle]

IN SBI we really don't have that many boats so why think about what OPA does.
We changed the rules for this year from 82-85 in P-4,,,i had my boat dialed in @ 81.8 max,,,,perfect. then we changed it to get some other teams from opa involved ( request ) i and other teams agreed,,,and how many teams ahowed up ????

I think this year was a bad year overall for Offshore participation. A lot was the cost as it pertains to sponsors $ to run multiple orgs.

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

can I take my old supercat light and run it in class 3 with a reprop?




Sure, And we will get Jenni to add a Skirt to your number box. :biggrinjester:

[Ratickle]

It seems pretty clear F2 run class 4
F1 run class 5
SVL run class 4
Cat OB run class 3
Cat light class 1

How much better can it get?

Did you just change CatOB while I was quoting????

[DAREDEVIL]

You can try to standardize. I expect all the orgs will be represented there. It is a good start.

I still would like to see a combined of GPS maximum and average lap speed. But, too controversial.

And the spec class in UIM is different yet. They have time penalties I believe for going over, not automatic dq's.

I somewhat agree,,,thats i we need to get together down there,,,ALL OF US in any P-Class,,,to find a way.

The thing is the speeds right now are kind of in nomans land. 75-85-95....

There are more boats out there right now that actually are in the middle of these numbers then dead on,,,and it has nothing to do with dialing in or sofort,,just right now its kinda stuck.

Lets not discuss this here,,,lets really all come to gether and talk about it in a nice meeting and have some beers.

[MikeyFIN]

Well Scott I wish you the best and will not but in anymore.

Last word just fit in don't try to change for your specific needs.

JIM I can attest that this is NOT Scott´s idea.. he just made it public.
I was there and heard a bit of these change ideas in Clearwater but from who ?
My Lips are sealed.

PS. Scott is only to have Fun and try to make the best of what he has while racing not changing rules. Believe me.

[DAREDEVIL]

JIM I can attest that this is NOT Scott´s idea.. he just made it public.
I was there and heard a bit of these change ideas in Clearwater but from who ?
My Lips are sealed.

PS. Scott is only to have Fun and try to make the best of what he has while racing not changing rules. Believe me.

YO BABY YO BABY YO,,,,,FUN IS ALL IN LIFE !!!!!!!!!!!!!


I AM FOR NO RULES .LOL:rofl::sifone::USA::driving:

[MikeyFIN]

And the spec class in UIM is different yet. They have time penalties I believe for going over, not automatic dq's.

Do we ??? I thought we ain´t having Bracket racing at all to limit our Top speeds.

[Ratickle]

I think it's an extremely good idea. I think discussion ahead of time will go a long way toward nailing down the last few differences while there. I think that whoever thought this up should be commended.

I want to get a race boat that will run in spec and P classes both. When I ran both at St Clair, it was a blast. The differences are subtle, but the experience is great. Guys like Rick who runs his cat in both, etc, are having more fun than those who only run once. And Randy running 3 races the same day.....

As Scott says though, SBI changed and lessened his competitiveness. He has to improve that for the new 85. Let's try to get them all the same and take it from there for the future.

[Ratickle]

Do we ??? I thought we ain´t having Bracket racing at all to limit our Top speeds.

It's an 85 mph class. I'd have to read it again.... May be WPPA????

[MikeyFIN]

I AM FOR NO RULES .LOL:rofl::sifone::USA::driving:

I´m not... I want rules to keep it as Racing and not a poker run...
I mean if we ain´t gonna have no rules I might take over a U.I.M speed record holder 26 foot cat (Argo) and slap some turbines in it and run it as a P4 boat...

[Ratickle]

This Class

P1 SuperSport class boats are production boats, usually safe and affordable for consumer use.

Measuring between 33-42ft, SuperSport boats are blessed with typical pleasure navigation characteristics, such as an open-top canopy and multi-speed gearbox.

Carrying a power-to-weight ratio of 1hp per 4.5kg, the SuperSport boats are less powerful and built with smaller engines.

SuperSport boats are limited to race-speeds of 85mph for safety reasons with pilots and throttlepersons allowed to stand or sit and not allowed to be harnessed.

During a race, the SuperSport boats are allowed to exceed the speed limit but only for a maximum of ten seconds. Rules state that exceeding this 10 second limit will incur a 60 second time penalty for a first offence with a further 90 seconds for every following penalty incurred.

A maximum of five penalties are allowed before a boat is disqualified with the same punishment given for those boats that exceed the speed limit for 30 seconds or more.

[DAREDEVIL]

GUYS,,,,lets try to keep this post about a get together for KW ...not about any rules or sofort ,,u.i.m. or opa or oss or sbi ....just a meeting with the p-class teams.

Thank U :USA:

[MikeyFIN]

or take this one..

[MikeyFIN]

This Class

P1 SuperSport class boats are production boats, usually safe and affordable for consumer use.

Measuring between 33-42ft, SuperSport boats are blessed with typical pleasure navigation characteristics, such as an open-top canopy and multi-speed gearbox.

Carrying a power-to-weight ratio of 1hp per 4.5kg, the SuperSport boats are less powerful and built with smaller engines.

SuperSport boats are limited to race-speeds of 85mph for safety reasons with pilots and throttlepersons allowed to stand or sit and not allowed to be harnessed.

During a race, the SuperSport boats are allowed to exceed the speed limit but only for a maximum of ten seconds. Rules state that exceeding this 10 second limit will incur a 60 second time penalty for a first offence with a further 90 seconds for every following penalty incurred.

A maximum of five penalties are allowed before a boat is disqualified with the same punishment given for those boats that exceed the speed limit for 30 seconds or more.

Ratickle..thats the only one...and it´s not that big a class overhere.
Here the biggest class is 3C with hundreds of boats collecting dust even.

What I´d like to see is unity among the P classes across the U.S. and keep the rules as unchanged as long as possible.
That would also mean there would be increasing interest over the U.S. boundaries.
And I think this is what we are trying to discuss in KW, to get the P class as big and FUN as possible.

[shifter]

Mickey,

What is 3c? Why are the boats parked?

We can probably get a turbine in that boat but I think you might have to take out the rear seat......:sifone:

pat W

[Ratickle]

Mickey,

What is 3c? Why are the boats parked?

We can probably get a turbine in that boat but I think you might have to take out the rear seat......:sifone:

pat W

:rofl:...:rofl:...:rofl:

But, what he said. What is 3C?????

And that Supersport class seems interesting to me. The rules seem fair, the breakout penalties I like, and the speed is a reasonable one to match up with a lot of boats here.

[DAREDEVIL]

This Class

P1 SuperSport class boats are production boats, usually safe and affordable for consumer use.

Measuring between 33-42ft, SuperSport boats are blessed with typical pleasure navigation characteristics, such as an open-top canopy and multi-speed gearbox.

Carrying a power-to-weight ratio of 1hp per 4.5kg, the SuperSport boats are less powerful and built with smaller engines.

SuperSport boats are limited to race-speeds of 85mph for safety reasons with pilots and throttlepersons allowed to stand or sit and not allowed to be harnessed.

During a race, the SuperSport boats are allowed to exceed the speed limit but only for a maximum of ten seconds. Rules state that exceeding this 10 second limit will incur a 60 second time penalty for a first offence with a further 90 seconds for every following penalty incurred.

A maximum of five penalties are allowed before a boat is disqualified with the same punishment given for those boats that exceed the speed limit for 30 seconds or more.

Now just to ....mhhhhhh

my boat is 5700 US pounds = 573.8 HP + its only 31.7 feet long

then i would go 65 MPH ,,,,,COOL nice rules .LOL

[MikeyFIN]

Mickey,

What is 3c? Why are the boats parked?

We can probably get a turbine in that boat but I think you might have to take out the rear seat......:sifone:

pat W

Offcourse.

Class 3C is the former 2 liter class and it has a lot of boats that are worn out and collects dust allover.
The boats are mainly 23-24 foot cats at 1800lbs and run a tad over 100mph at best.
( My avatar is of one)

Pat That thing in the pic doesn´t have a rear seat... it´s a side by side 4/6 liter Cat weighing in at ca 3000 lbs and the Vee doesn´t have a back seat either also a 6 liter raced in Dubai.

Back on track.

[MikeyFIN]

Now just to ....mhhhhhh

my boat is 5700 US pounds = 573.8 HP + its only 31.7 feet long

then i would go 65 MPH ,,,,,COOL nice rules .LOL

Plus you´d have to go and saw off Trent´s BEAK and add it on your boat to add the extra foot...:26:

So no wonder the P1 SS class hasn´t cought any wind to speak of.
Money is a factor as those are considered big boats and to trailer one over here you need a Semi basically and a CDL then.

[Ratickle]

This is what I currently have in my spread sheet. I believe POPRA follows SBI exactly.

Class - Org - Length - Hull Style - Engine Size - Engine Qty - Speed

PX OPA 22' to 55' Any Any Any 150 mph max
P1 SBI 24' to 45' Any Any Any 117 mph max
Class 100 OPA 22' to 55' Any Any Any 115 mph max
P2 SBI 24' to 45' Any Any Any 105 mph max
Class 200 OPA 22' to 55' Any Any Any 105 mph max
Pro Am 1 OSS 21' to Any Any Any Any 95 mph avg
Class 300 OPA 22' to 55' Any Any Any 95 mph max
Class P3 SBI 24' to 45' Any Any Any 95 mph max
Pro Am 2 OSS 21' to Any Any Any Any 85 mph avg
P4 SBI 24' to 45' Any Any Any 85 mph max
Class 400 OPA 22' to 55' V Any Any 85 mph max
Pro Am 3 OSS 21' to Any Any Any Any 75 mph avg
Class 500 OPA 22' to 30' V Any Any 75 mph max
P 5 SBI 0' to 30' Any Any Single 75 mph max
Class 600 OPA 22' to 26' V Any Single 70 mph max
Pro Am 4 OSS 24' to 30' Any Any Single In/Twin Out 65 mph avg

[Ratickle]

Now just to ....mhhhhhh

my boat is 5700 US pounds = 573.8 HP + its only 31.7 feet long

then i would go 65 MPH ,,,,,COOL nice rules .LOL

I just like the break out rules. Seems really fair vs once and done.....

[DAREDEVIL]

I think up to
32 feet - 80 mph only single engines
36 feet - 90 mph
40 feet -110 mph

ONLY FOR THE P CLASS

what would be wrong with that ?????

now u would have more boats in each class,,,bump up the price money and get the competition everybody was looking for !!!!!!
The penalty thing is easy,,,,,if u brake out,wnd get a 1 min penalty,,,your last anyways ??? NO ???

[MikeyFIN]

i just like the break out rules. Seems really fair vs once and done.....

+1

but there´s a lot of debate of the HP/weight ratios and how to measure them also.. like always...

[MikeyFIN]

I think up to
32 feet - 80 mph only single engines
36 feet - 90 mph
40 feet -110 mph

ONLY FOR THE P CLASS

what would be wrong with that ?????

now u would have more boats in each class,,,bump up the price money and get the competition everybody was looking for !!!!!!

I see no problem with that.
But think about the occasional Apache 41 owner who want´s to race for FUN?....hmmm 110mph would be record breaking speeds for one.

Most boats up to 32 ft are single engine anyway unless really old and they could run a HORBA class or get an exemption ?

[Dude! Sweet!]

Out of curiousity, if you look through the OPA and other P5 and 6 fields, how many boats that have raced over the last two years won't fit in those classes? And whey I say, "won't fit" I mean either outlawed (the twin OB Superboat that runs P5 comes to mind) or clearly uncompetitive in this class structure (The 24 Sunsation that runs P6, the old Dukes Carrera, basically every pleasure layup 28 Pantera, etc.)

I don't have any experience boat racing, but I do have a fair amount of experience club racing cars and without being overly general, I would say the majority of people I know who could afford to race cars, and still quit racing over the decade quit because they got tired of constantly changing rules... New spec tire each year, new spect shock each year, new spec wheel width each year... Consistency seems to be the key to participation (as long as things aren't consistently screwed up).

[Dude! Sweet!]

I guess I should add that I'm re-rigging a boat to run P5 in POPRA next year, but frankly I don't care if you make the P5 breakout speed 900 mph, there's only maybe 3 other P5 boats out here. And if it really doesn't make sense to run the boat in POPRA, we can always go ski racing instead.

In my mind P class racing is club racing and the goal is to have a good time. Seems like in many cases, all this spectator nonsense and TV nonsense that gets bounced around discounts that fact that for most people interested in participating in this sort of thing, the participant is the target market. Club racing is about the racers.

[F1-00 Racing]

I think up to
32 feet - 80 mph only single engines
36 feet - 90 mph
40 feet -110 mph



OK I'll bite

30 feet max- 80 mph single engine
90 mph
105 mph

The current P5 class is 75 mph with max length of 30, now your asking those that have built a boat for the class, to bump up speed as well as compete with SVL's, etc With lack of participation unfortunately he is doing away with the SVL class again and where would they fit under your self serving rules, DD?

You claim that your boat ran 90 something when it was an "A' boat, so I guess its time to step up, I am sure your "technical consultant" could help you! If breaking down 96.5% of the time is fun for you, then could I advise some psychological treatment?

Don't worry DD, I dont have a dog in the fight anymore, YOU have successfully run me off !!! Congrats..... ok now go ahead and get your last word in, you always do!

[glassdave]

The 6 classes in OPA are plenty. I would argue for one less at the top, but that's just based on participation, not anything else.



So where exactly would we fit without a class 1? Our boat is boring under a hundred and this season we only had two light showings, Harrison and St Clair. The rest were better races with three to six boats. Lightning Jacks is re powering this winter to be more competitive, Extractor will be at all the east coast races and Wicked will most likely stay in class one (which is great) and you know we'll be there, cat lite has also been running with us . With no class two should we prop WAY down and run class three:D

I think the six classes are fine, the biggest hurdle i see is aligning the different orgs to have the same definitions. Bottom line is build a boat to fit the class not a class to fit your boat. If you are going to run in a spec class and cross over to a P class occasionally, choose appropriately. We ran a 30 DW in P2 at 105 because thats how fast that boat went and that was it. Granted we got smoked by the big HP guys much of the time but its a lot more fun chasing someone at your limit then sandbagging, and it really was some fun azz racing.

DD i doubt you will find a simplistic blanket solution like the ones you are proposing. Any problems we ever had in OPA were dealt with within the class by participating members of that class respectively and amicably(sp?). The worst thing you can do is start drastically mismatching boats into a smaller number of classes strictly for the sake of boat count.

[imco offshore]

scott let me tell you from experiance we ( svl) changed a lot of rules this year in an effort to get some other boats to come , ( the one,s that gave us an exceuse y they dont come) after we changed the rules for them ! #1 they didn,t show up anyway # 2 the guys that were already there had to change their boats , # 3 the class went from 8 to 10 boats down to three 3 , my point has always been,,,,, hand out the rules , period,,,, if someone wants to race READ the rules and build to fit in,,, we screwd our class up real bad this year for people who talk a lot then don,t do anything but bench race and complain,,, it,s got so bad if you try to build a new boat ,,, the rules will be different when your done . i suggest you leave well enough alone, don,t listen to someone that doesn,t have a dog in this fight, i know your trying to better your classes but ,,??????? good luck with what ever direction u choose

[skaterdave]

glassdave it would be nice to try to raise p1 to 120. my next thought would be get rid of any spec class that has less the 5-6 boats and have them move over to a p-class.

and once a certain amount of spec class guys get there own boat count up agian then they can figure out a set of rules.

till then there seems to be too many spec classes with out enough boats to warrrant the additional work to tech-ing them.

for instance, patchgue, if cat lite only has two boats they should have to move into a class to better the overall quality of racing.

if i recall, OSS, when they started that org had a rule or something that said that each spec class needed to have a certain amount of boats or they wouldn't be allowed to race?

[Ratickle]

All I'm saying is match up the rules for all the orgs. Nothing else. I mentioned 1 class possibly. I do not believe at all that three classes are enough. P6 and P5 have the greatest participation, and eliminating them seems foolish.

There are 7 classes in OPA. Keep them all and match them up. Then match up the rules for entry and breakout, and then go.

And Dave, I was only at four races this year. Harrison, ST Clair, Michigan City, and LOTO. The top 1, or PX, was not well represented at those. I cannot speak for all races, sorry. I think I made it confusing by saying 6 not 7. Oops.

You run Class 1 right? Not PX?

[Ratickle]

scott let me tell you from experiance we ( svl) changed a lot of rules this year in an effort to get some other boats to come , ( the one,s that gave us an exceuse y they dont come) after we changed the rules for them ! #1 they didn,t show up anyway # 2 the guys that were already there had to change their boats , # 3 the class went from 8 to 10 boats down to three 3 , my point has always been,,,,, hand out the rules , period,,,, if someone wants to race READ the rules and build to fit in,,, we screwd our class up real bad this year for people who talk a lot then don,t do anything but bench race and complain,,, it,s got so bad if you try to build a new boat ,,, the rules will be different when your done . i suggest you leave well enough alone, don,t listen to someone that doesn,t have a dog in this fight, i know your trying to better your classes but ,,??????? good luck with what ever direction u choose

We raced with you in St Clair as did Chris. Thanks for making that adjustment. If Dave would of had the bigger prop, and the belt wouldn't have gone bad so we had to slow every time it overheated, we'd have been in there closer. I'd love to take another stab at it someday.....:)

As far as rules, I would love to see a adaptation where they cannot be changed unless 3/4 of those who participated in at least 3/4 of the races the previous year voted to do so. :sifone:

[Wahoo 214]

Way do you think there is a problem with P Class? It is the largest Org, group of racers and I really don't hear them ***** like all the spec guys. Why would you even think you can "fix" something that isn't broken.

[skaterdave]

You run Class 1 right? Not PX?

currently i run keyboard-class. it's quite in-expensive and and i can give myself my own checkered flags ???????

honestly i think PX has hurt the sport more than anything and that the current speed of close too 200 mph are going to bite offshore in the azz sooner or later. there was a reason that they had 150 mph rule.

no-offense to the spec guys but as we've seen theres no consistancy between the orgs which makes tech even more difficult.

someone need to build a mobile dyno that can hookup at the prop shaft, then run hp to weight class and use a handicap system for those with more technologicly advance boats. for instance we all know that the new 388 skaters are faster than its older cousins like whm's 40 (hull to hull comparison) so even with equal hp the 388's are faster and the 40 should get something to help make it more competive. agian like sweetdude stated, the reality of offshore is that its club racing and need to be fun and fair. or else no one new is going to come and play. this to me is the problem with spec class racing its really for fun and those with alot of money are going to be able to keep buying new boats and spend money to be #1. this takes the fun out of it and the others leave. kinda of like the current mess

[DAREDEVIL]

OK I'll bite

30 feet max- 80 mph single engine
90 mph
105 mph

The current P5 class is 75 mph with max length of 30, now your asking those that have built a boat for the class, to bump up speed as well as compete with SVL's, etc With lack of participation unfortunately he is doing away with the SVL class again and where would they fit under your self serving rules, DD?

You claim that your boat ran 90 something when it was an "A' boat, so I guess its time to step up, I am sure your "technical consultant" could help you! If breaking down 96.5% of the time is fun for you, then could I advise some psychological treatment?

Don't worry DD, I dont have a dog in the fight anymore, YOU have successfully run me off !!! Congrats..... ok now go ahead and get your last word in, you always do!

Trent,,,,do u really think the P5 boats we have curently in SBI are NOT cabable of running 80 MPH ?????:confused:

Also what do u mean by I RAN U OFF ?????:(

3rd. do u whant to be my therapist ???LOL:rofl:

[DAREDEVIL]

AGAIN PEOPLE ,,THIS IS NOT ABOUT ME,,,,i am posting this to give teams a heads up on the coming deal and would like to get a meeting in KW to talk about it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!


I DON'T CARE , even if i have to run p1 with my boat ,,,it will not make me feel bad.
I go and have fun .:USA:

[glassdave]

Good thoughts Dave, personally I'm fine at 115 and its really the sweet spot for this heavy 'ol boat although running 117 in sbi was fine to so at that point i guess I'm just splitting hairs. Even still I'm fine at 115, we blow up enough sh!t at that speed :D

In Patchogue they did run SCL with us which was great. Teague broke out but we did get around Motley. For the most part we've been working toward less classes and its only when a boat clearly does not fit in 6-1 that we run special classes or there enough boats to have their own class.

[Ratickle]

Way do you think there is a problem with P Class? It is the largest Org, group of racers and I really don't hear them ***** like all the spec guys. Why would you even think you can "fix" something that isn't broken.

I think OPA is the fastest growing, has the most paticipation, and Classes 5 and 6 have the greatest number of participants. If there is going to be a discussion of P classes in Key West, the OPA results cannot be ignored. But, it sure seems the different orgs, if things are to be discussed, should try to standardize, not tweak seperately.

[DAREDEVIL]

Way do you think there is a problem with P Class? It is the largest Org, group of racers and I really don't hear them ***** like all the spec guys. Why would you even think you can "fix" something that isn't broken.

Dean,,,your right in OPA,,but SBI does not have the amount of boats in Fl and down here,,,we have to do something to make it competitive for all.

When we had the race in MC ,,where where all the P boats from OPA ???

The rules where the same exsept NO p6 !!!!! mmmhhhh.

[DAREDEVIL]

I think OPA is the fastest growing, has the most paticipation, and Classes 5 and 6 have the greatest number of participants. If there is going to be a discussion of P classes in Key West, the OPA results cannot be ignored. But, it sure seems the different orgs, if things are to be discussed, should try to standardize, not tweak seperately.

Paul,,,we did for 2009 and NOBODY SHOWED UP !!!!!!!!!!!!!????????

Sorry, SIMMONS did !!!!!

We had 5 boats ,,dialed in to our old rules 82 and changed it to 85 ,,for 1 boat ??????

[skaterdave]

i'm with wahoo, all of opa's p classes are by far the best thing going in offshore so why would they want to change, unless a majority of those racers in that class had a specific need? one example would be the new sv/bravo class and that was a majority vote to better the competition with those guys that raced that year.

[Ratickle]

In Patchogue they did run SCL with us which was great. Teague broke out but we did get around Motley.

I did not know that. Cool.....:26:

How many PX boats are there????? I did not recall any lately except Cat Can DO at St clair.

[DAREDEVIL]

[QUOTE=glassdave;343044]
For the most part we've been working toward less classes

THATS THE GOAL !!!!!!!!!

[Ratickle]

Paul,,,we did for 2009 and NOBODY SHOWED UP !!!!!!!!!!!!!????????

Sorry, SIMMONS did !!!!!

We had 5 boats ,,dialed in to our old rules 82 and changed it to 85 ,,for 1 boat ??????

I'm sure Simmons would have run 82. To me that's not the big deal. The big deal to me is the ambiguous enforcement of the rules about Best Case Scenario Top Speed vs run it propped to a top speed.

[Ratickle]

Hey keyboard racer,,,,stop your freakin name calling !!!!!!!

I agree Dave. At least he showed with a boat and tried. No way you'll ever get me to knock that.

Now knock Scott??????:sifone: :sifone: :sifone:

[skaterdave]

Good thoughts Dave, personally I'm fine at 115 and its really the sweet spot for this heavy 'ol boat although running 117 in sbi was fine to so at that point i guess I'm just splitting hairs. Even still I'm fine at 115, we blow up enough sh!t at that speed :D

In Patchogue they did run SCL with us which was great. Teague broke out but we did get around Motley. For the most part we've been working toward less classes and its only when a boat clearly does not fit in 6-1 that we run special classes or there enough boats to have their own class.

just wondering dave if that green monster feels better at 120 or above the 115 you currently run at. last year, when i ran, shaving off that extra 2 mph was quite a bit difference for our boat. i know its only 2 mph but it seems that extra little bit made it fell alot better going down the straights and setting up for turns. come on i sure you guys got a bigger set of props ????

[Ratickle]

[QUOTE=glassdave;343044]
For the most part we've been working toward less classes

THATS THE GOAL !!!!!!!!!

I don't think less classes are needed in the P classes. If the rules are standardized for all orgs for P, more boats will show I think.

[sbracing]

I think up to
32 feet - 80 mph only single engines
36 feet - 90 mph
40 feet -110 mph

ONLY FOR THE P CLASS

what would be wrong with that ?????

now u would have more boats in each class,,,bump up the price money and get the competition everybody was looking for !!!!!!
The penalty thing is easy,,,,,if u brake out,wnd get a 1 min penalty,,,your last anyways ??? NO ???

No

[DAREDEVIL]

No

NO what ???

[Wahoo 214]

If you guys want to change P Class rules, then just join OPA. It works and ain't broken. Move on to the spec classes.

[DAREDEVIL]

If you guys want to change P Class rules, then just join OPA. It works and ain't broken. Move on to the spec classes.

OK,,then move OPA down here to FL !!!!!!!!!!!

[imco offshore]

currently i run keyboard-class. it's quite in-expensive and and i can give myself my own checkered flags ???????

honestly i think PX has hurt the sport more than anything and that the current speed of close too 200 mph are going to bite offshore in the azz sooner or later. there was a reason that they had 150 mph rule.

no-offense to the spec guys but as we've seen theres no consistancy between the orgs which makes tech even more difficult.

someone need to build a mobile dyno that can hookup at the prop shaft, then run hp to weight class and use a handicap system for those with more technologicly advance boats. for instance we all know that the new 388 skaters are faster than its older cousins like whm's 40 (hull to hull comparison) so even with equal hp the 388's are faster and the 40 should get something to help make it more competive. agian like sweetdude stated, the reality of offshore is that its club racing and need to be fun and fair. or else no one new is going to come and play. this to me is the problem with spec class racing its really for fun and those with alot of money are going to be able to keep buying new boats and spend money to be #1. this takes the fun out of it and the others leave. kinda of like the current mess

i don.t about that svl are all old a boats 8 or 9 years old and all run withen 1 mph of each other it has come down to set up a the racees

[1waterboy1]

If you guys want to change P Class rules, then just join OPA. It works and ain't broken. Move on to the spec classes.

I agree...SBI has many spec cat and vee classes with only a few boats in each:
TURBINE
SUPERBOAT UNLIMITED
SUPERBOAT 850
SUPERBOAT 750
SUPER CAT
SUPER STOCK

SUPERBOAT VEE EXTREME
SUPERBOAT VEE UNLIMITED
SUPER VEE
SUPERBOAT VEE LIMITED

How about starting here first...at least there is some growth potential with the bracket classes.

[Ratickle]

i don.t about that svl are all old a boats 8 or 9 years old and all run withen 1 mph of each other it has come down to set up a the racees

The same is true for Outboard Cat, Cat Light, and OPA Super Vee.

Those four classes have no issues when it comes to racers racing. Only the short, smooth courses make it a sprint to the first corner with the winner usually the first one around it claiming lane one.

[Ratickle]

I agree...SBI has many spec cat and vee classes with only a few boats in each:
TURBINE
SUPERBOAT UNLIMITED
SUPERBOAT 850
SUPERBOAT 750
SUPER CAT
SUPER STOCK

SUPERBOAT VEE EXTREME
SUPERBOAT VEE UNLIMITED
SUPER VEE
SUPERBOAT VEE LIMITED

How about starting here first...at least there is some growth potential with the bracket classes.

I've read all the rules and can't figure out the difference between Vee Unlimited and Vee Extreme.

[Ratickle]

No


NO what ???

I'm taking it as no you're not last with a 1 minute penalty. Currently you break out by 1 mph for 5 seconds and you're last. Even if every other boat breaks down.

[2TR]

Nothings wrong with "P" Class racing, only problem I see is racing "P" class in S.B.I.

Not trying to be rude, just an observation.

[Ratickle]

Nothings wrong with "P" Class racing, only problem I see is racing "P" class in S.B.I.

Not trying to be rude, just an observation.

Don't have a lot of choice if you live in Florida.

[skaterdave]

# 3 the class went from 8 to 10 boats down to three 3 ,

this would be my point. you guys raced @ loto in p class the day before the "nationals". to me this is where you should be until theres enough of your class to put on a good race by yourselves. this should go for the rest of the classes as well.

[2TR]

Don't have a lot of choice if you live in Florida.

Fix S.B.I.

[Ted]

Okay, I have removed the name calling and am going to resurrect this thread. Please keep to the issue at hand and stop the personal attacks. Thanks everyone for caring enough about the sport to participate in a discussion like this, but respect everyone's opinion and their effort.

[DAREDEVIL]

okay, i have removed the name calling and am going to resurrect this thread. Please keep to the issue at hand and stop the personal attacks. Thanks everyone for caring enough about the sport to participate in a discussion like this, but respect everyone's opinion and their effort.

thanks !!!!!!! :USA:

[Pete B]

While there is nothing wrong with P-class or it's racers, there needs to be a place where one climbs to a spec class. Dont mis-interpet, but this is why APBA had p-class run on Saturday and the pro series run on Sunday.

[skaterdave]

The same is true for Outboard Cat, Cat Light, and OPA Super Vee.

Those four classes have no issues when it comes to racers racing. Only the short, smooth courses make it a sprint to the first corner with the winner usually the first one around it claiming lane one.

yea but currently theres not enough boats in any one of these classes to stand alone. so the question is, it better to have 3-4 seperate races of 2-4 boats going on at once or find a way to put them all together in one class. if your goal is to better the overall racing to put on a show it would be the later. if you wanna better your chances at winning than run the seperate races like the current situation. the problem with this is no one outside of those related to the teams has any idea of whos winning and are there to drink beer. thus making it more difficult to bring offshore racing mainstream

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

currently i run keyboard-class. it's quite in-expensive and and i can give myself my own checkered flags ???????

honestly i think PX has hurt the sport more than anything and that the current speed of close too 200 mph are going to bite offshore in the azz sooner or later. there was a reason that they had 150 mph rule.

no-offense to the spec guys but as we've seen theres no consistancy between the orgs which makes tech even more difficult.



Dave, I agree with some of what you say but, disagree with your view on spec racing. You can break it down even more. Spec like when any engine within a set of guidelines is they type that often gets expensive and is the most involved to tech. On the other hand spec sealed is one of the less expensive way to race and offers good competition in a few classes. A SVL can race all season spending about as much as some spend on race fuel and one rebuild. It is also one of the few classes that is available in all orgs presently.

I appreciate your love for bracket classes and agree it works well but, it is not the answer for everyone.

This discussion was brought up to discuss SBI P classes. Do you have ANY intention of participating with them?

[F1-00 Racing]

No offense guys but I seem to look at the name of this thread is "To all P-class racers in KW!!!!!!!" Ok I might be wrong again, but why are people like 2TR, Wahoo, and Skaterdave posting on here and they have no intentions of being in Key West? SBI is SBI and OPA is OPA. They are having a meeting to discuss how to make P-class racing in SBI better. With such idiotic comments insinuating that OPA is perfect, then if they are stupid enough to believe that, then they should race OPA and stay off this thread. Now a little disclaimer, OPA has done some wonderful things for their club, but it is far from perfect.

Opinions are like buttholes and everyone has one, but if you chose to go to Key West pay your fees then speak up, if not have a nice long cold winter!!!!! Although I will point out that this thread does not belong in General Discussion, it belongs in the SBI section.

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

We can go round and round all winter guys. The discussion here is about P class in KW.

Lets try to stay on topic..

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Although I will point out that this thread does not belong in General Discussion, it belongs in the SBI section.

Trent, There will be racers from all orgs participating in KW.

[Ted]

Daredevil asked me to move this to SBI, so I did. But I will say that input from other organizations and their followers might not be a bad thing, either way, they will find their way here.

[DAREDEVIL]

Trent, There will be racers from all orgs participating in KW.

Jim,,but he is kind of right,,since we will discuss SBI rules !!!!!

[DAREDEVIL]

Thanks Ted !!!!!!!!!!!!!!:USA:

[F1-00 Racing]

Trent, There will be racers from all orgs participating in KW.


You are 100% correct Jim, but when they participate, that means they paid all fees and they will become registered SBI racers and have a say in the matter. As DD said this is concerning SBI rules, not OPA rules, not OSS rules.

Key West is an SBI race with everyone invited to race.

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Its fine with me..Its DD thread after all.

Carry on.

[Ratickle]

I was hoping the goal was to attract more boats and racers into racing in P classes, by improving the current model, so the future would grow. I did not understand it was to just have current SBI P racers discuss SBI. Sorry.:leaving:

[DAREDEVIL]

I was hoping the goal was to attract more boats and racers into racing in P classes, by improving the current model, so the future would grow. I did not understand it was to just have current SBI P racers discuss SBI. Sorry.:leaving:

Its ok to hear all the opinions but it really only concerns SBI !

Like Trent said before ,,,alot of boats are in between the #,,,there for we need to do something.
Currently in P5 ,as an example we have......Velocity,V&M Motorsports,RumRunners,Just pray Racing and Don't blink.

4 of these boats can run 80 with just changing the prop if that.

In P4 we have 5-6 boats which only 1 is capable of running 85 in race trimm steady.

There are NO P3 boats .

In P2 +1 i could not tell u but they kind of have boats a little mixed up in that.

Thats why we need to combine some classes and roll around a couple of boats,,to make it how it should be !!!!!

[2TR]

No offense guys but I seem to look at the name of this thread is "To all P-class racers in KW!!!!!!!" Ok I might be wrong again, but why are people like 2TR, Wahoo, and Skaterdave posting on here and they have no intentions of being in Key West? SBI is SBI and OPA is OPA. They are having a meeting to discuss how to make P-class racing in SBI better. With such idiotic comments insinuating that OPA is perfect, then if they are stupid enough to believe that, then they should race OPA and stay off this thread. Now a little disclaimer, OPA has done some wonderful things for their club, but it is far from perfect.

Opinions are like buttholes and everyone has one, but if you chose to go to Key West pay your fees then speak up, if not have a nice long cold winter!!!!! Although I will point out that this thread does not belong in General Discussion, it belongs in the SBI section.



Nothings perfect, you know that.. OPA, SBI or OSS.. but if you want SBI to increase boat count (more boats = more fun) you need to have SBI re-adjust there fee's; bottom line.

I would love to do a couple SBI events, I even have one a couple hours from the house. But I'm not paying a couple grand per race for the privilege to race 1 boat and win, what? 700 bucks?

[skaterdave]

No offense guys but I seem to look at the name of this thread is "To all P-class racers in KW!!!!!!!" Ok I might be wrong again, but why are people like 2TR, Wahoo, and Skaterdave posting on here and they have no intentions of being in Key West? SBI is SBI and OPA is OPA. They are having a meeting to discuss how to make P-class racing in SBI better. With such idiotic comments insinuating that OPA is perfect, then if they are stupid enough to believe that, then they should race OPA and stay off this thread. Now a little disclaimer, OPA has done some wonderful things for their club, but it is far from perfect.

Opinions are like buttholes and everyone has one, but if you chose to go to Key West pay your fees then speak up, if not have a nice long cold winter!!!!! Although I will point out that this thread does not belong in General Discussion, it belongs in the SBI section.

first off f100/trent i live in fl, so the outcome might affect me. next, i'll be in KW:03:

next if you want to split hairs it say to ALL P CLASS RACERS in KW, not all p class racers that run only sbi. there for, you get input from other racers in different orgs. next i really don't think it matters which furom since its about improving p class racing and dd put it here on the web, where we can all comment on it.

the biggest improvement would be for sbi to use opa's fee schedule. that would put an extra $600 in the racers pocket. i myself would like to see more laps and as far as unified rules, well opa does seem to have more boats which fill it's classes therefore class reduction would not be necassary.

i think one of the easiest thing to do would be change some dates around so theres not conflicting dates like sbi @ ny and opa @ point pleasent. that situation makes no sense to me. with offshore being such a small market to racers you would think one or the other would move dates around to maximize race entries ?

as for making the same gps speed, well it should be as simple as a prop change or different setup to move that couple of miles an hour up or down.

mobilemerc, i would rather see simplified tech inspection rather than a merc only sealed rule. for instance a lot of people love the 525's and make a big deal of how long they last. well they should since they only turn 5400 rpm. and really are not anywhere near push the limits compared to a race only engine. next comparing there price i was able to build quite a better motor for what a 525 costs IMO.

so whats the middle ground for spec. pick certain guidelines that are easily inspected with out having to tear down the motor or pulling a cylinder head.
from what little experience i have being around friends that race cars, heres what i've seen and it seems to work rather easily.
by merely pulling spark plugs you can check cubic inch displacement and compression ratio. set a valve lift limit which can be checked be removing just a valve cover. and spec a throttle bore size for the carb. to go farther than that car guys use a sight hole in the oil pan to check crank and rods. but in a boats case you would have to pull the engine at that point, plus theres only so much to do in the low end that would make more HP. they mandate crank driven distributors and no computers and some spec a rpm limiter.

problem here would be the merc and blower motor combos with fuel injection and compueters. agian the easiest solution would be an air restrictor.

i know i'm off the P class subject but wanted to add that in there mobilemerc.

back to p class. i do like sbi's gps better than opa's type. garmin is a name brand gps which can be used outside the racing. second it would be nice to see sbi and opa post all the gps data for all to see. more transparency. for instance i questioned the speeds of the fountain worldwide last year and was told that the inspectors looked at it and was okay ???? why bring that up, well we you have a boat that's sponsored by one of the org's primary sponsor competing against a boat that runs mostly another org's races, one might get the impression of a little bias. to me that was BS.
when i use to race 4wheelers in GNCC at the end of the race they would post everyones times and positions. i don't understand the secretecy of that. and yes sbi does post that info several weeks later. with todays technology this should be done automatically. the 4 wheeler racing is using transponders along with almost all other forms of motorsports. offshore is kinda still back in the dark ages

[smokeybandit]

I have what is most likely a really stupid question. If you have a maximum speed that you are allowed to go, wouldn't the only important piece of equpment be the GPS? Theoretically you could have the turbine boats parading around with the P boats as long as they are all allowed a maximum top speed. Why all the need for inspection when the top speed is set?

[F1-00 Racing]

If you guys want to change P Class rules, then just join OPA. It works and ain't broken. Move on to the spec classes.


Nothings wrong with "P" Class racing, only problem I see is racing "P" class in S.B.I.

Not trying to be rude, just an observation.


Fix S.B.I.


Sorry Rick I must have misread your posts

[Ratickle]

I have what is most likely a really stupid question. If you have a maximum speed that you are allowed to go, wouldn't the only important piece of equpment be the GPS? Theoretically you could have the turbine boats parading around with the P boats as long as they are all allowed a maximum top speed. Why all the need for inspection when the top speed is set?

Sorry, can't stay out of this because I have my opinion.


I could build a P class specific boat that should, in theory, never lose.

For example, If I take a Batboat with a duo-prop, put in a Big Block all Aluminum 600 inch motor with blower running a conservative 850 HP, prop it to run a maximum of 82/83, I should out accelerate, out turn, and win dang near every race in a 75 mph class. In POPRA, I understand that to be illegal becase of their sandbagging rule. Elsewhere, ????

I think the spirit of P class was, if you have a boat that is maxed out capable of 82/83, you enter it in the 75 class. Not downprop a 100 mph boat into the 70 class...

[DAREDEVIL]

Sorry, can't stay out of this because I have my opinion.


I could build a P class specific boat that should, in theory, never lose.

For example, If I take a Batboat with a duo-prop, put in a Big Block all Aluminum 600 inch motor with blower running a conservative 850 HP, prop it to run a maximum of 82/83, I should out accelerate, out turn, and win dang near every race in a 75 mph class. In POPRA, I understand that to be illegal becase of their sandbagging rule. Elsewhere, ????

Ok,,,,in 5 foot seas u will lose !!!!
In calm water u will brake out....and so on..

Nice try !!!!!:rofl:

[skaterdave]

opa was the same type of sandbagging rule, except they tie the sandbags around your ankles:reddevil::reddevil:

[Ratickle]

Ok,,,,in 5 foot seas u will lose !!!!
In calm water u will brake out....and so on..

Nice try !!!!!:rofl:

You've never driven a Batboat, have you.....:sifone: Ask someone who owns one......

[DAREDEVIL]

you've never driven a batboat, have you.....:sifone: Ask someone who owns one......

i did !!!!!

I also think u got hooked on the wrong boat .LOL

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

SkaterDave, I can't argue your point about building your own engine. My post was in response to your tech inspection and cost post.

Robert, I understand the only inspection in P classes in boat length. The discussions of spec rules have gotten mixed in this discussion.

Ratickle, Isn't that what Tyler has done?

As far as the sandbagging. I believe these guys miss the spirit of the rules. I don't know what the answer is. It definitely lets the big check book have an advantage. That one point ruins class racing in my mind,

[2TR]

Sorry Rick I must have misread your posts

It's not picking on SBI, I'm stating a fact. If you think SBI is running fine so be it... I'm just telling you why I have not and will not race SBI

I'm sure I'm not the only one to feel this way.

[F1-00 Racing]

Nothings perfect, you know that.. OPA, SBI or OSS.. but if you want SBI to increase boat count (more boats = more fun) you need to have SBI re-adjust there fee's; bottom line.

I would love to do a couple SBI events, I even have one a couple hours from the house. But I'm not paying a couple grand per race for the privilege to race 1 boat and win, what? 700 bucks?


It is what it is, obviously OPA works for you, thats great. I have said time and time again that Smitty has done wonderful things. I have also said that "All Associations have fleas" and come to think of it I have said for years, "race where it is best for your team".

SBI works for John Carbonell, and really thats all that counts. Do I have issues with the way he runs it, yes w/o a doubt, do you have issues with it, by your posts it looks as though you do. That all doesnt matter as it is John Carbonell's business and he will do what he feels is best for his business, just as we do for ours everyday. As far as fees are concerned, I am honestly surprised that he hasnt gone up on them. ie the price of fuel went up and I had to charge my customers more on their bills every month, but when it went down I lowered my prices again. My business, my choice. In his case the price of the bleachers in KW went up to 22,000 this year from approx 16,000 last year. Who pays for this? With him being in business to make money, he has a few choices, eliminate them all together, raise fees, find a sponsor to fill the void. Now a sponsor would be the perfect way, but as the way the economy is, sponsors arent just cutting checks anymore on a whim, look at the fallout from Nascar and the 4-5 major pullouts already and their season isnt even over yet. side note:bleachers is just an example, everything has gone up

Smitty is able to run OPA and yes I am sure he has it setup as an LLC or some sort of corp, but what is his overhead and payroll for the staff? I dont profess to know, but I am pretty sure its next to nothing. He has his dry storage, and service shop which pays his personal bills, JC has SBI.

Now to the topic at hand, SBI amended their rules to match up speed wise with OPA. No they didnt add Class 6 as there was no participation or boats requesting it down here. 1 team(Simmons) came down and raced. So now SBI feels that it is time to re-evaluate and I have been told that they are trying to eliminate 2 P-classes and add the 4000 purse from those to the 3 remaining classes. Do I see it happening?, I dont know, they eliminated F1 and SVL and still announced a 75,000 purse and showed a payout to those classes that didnt exist. As I said above, his business, his choice, whether we like it or not. The meeting essentially is just a waste of time(basically takes time away from Duval) as SBI is going to do what they want to do. As proven by my direct situation in Clearwater, racer input was not taken into account and they did what they felt was best for their business. I inturn had to make a decision for the best of my team(business) and after discussions with the sponsor it was decided to go, which turned out to be the best thing I could have done with what we have working for the future overall.

Rick, I know the fees suck, I wish I could go to Applebee's and eat for free as well, but unfortunately I have to pay. Enjoy the ride and privledge that Smitty has created for you guys up there, in this economy it might not last for long and then he will have to start charging entries. When I raced full time in OPA the entry was 500 per race and only had Atlantic City and Cambridge with a purse. enjoy it while it lasts and most importantly BE SAFE!!

[2TR]

Trent,
Lets take Smitty, OPA, OSS and everyone out the the equation and look at it like this.

How would you increase boat count in SBI?
- Lower fees

Maybe SBI Can do the 1000.00 yr per "P" class boat and for spec boats keep the fees the same. You need to bring racers back and high entry fees are not working.


SBI needs to do something because having 15 boats at any event in Florida is a crazy.

[SVL66]

ok here I go.....I promised myself I'de stay out of this.

First: I dont really think the SBI P class structure is all that bad. If you race with SBI, maybe just maybe, you should have a say.
Second: 2TR lets be honest. How many OPA races have you done this year? Why complain about SBI charging to race, if you havent raced with OPA all year?
Third: SBI is a business. If you dont want to pay to race...Dont race with them. Up Until 2006, We have always paid entry and equipment fees. Now...just because OPA offers no entry fees, we expect everyone else to follow suit. Every business has their own model. If SBI relies on entry fees to operate, its their business.

And lastly....JC was gracious enough to prorate our equipment fees in Sarasota. And to refund it when they offered OSS teams to race without points and purse.

[SVL66]

Did someone say APPLEBEES?

[2TR]

ok here I go.....I promised myself I'de stay out of this.

First: I dont really think the SBI P class structure is all that bad. If you race with SBI, maybe just maybe, you should have a say.
Second: 2TR lets be honest. How many OPA races have you done this year? Why complain about SBI charging to race, if you havent raced with OPA all year?
Third: SBI is a business. If you dont want to pay to race...Dont race with them. Up Until 2006, We have always paid entry and equipment fees. Now...just because OPA offers no entry fees, we expect everyone else to follow suit. Every business has their own model. If SBI relies on entry fees to operate, its their business.

And lastly....JC was gracious enough to prorate our equipment fees in Sarasota. And to refund it when they offered OSS teams to race without points and purse.


Bruce,
I only raced 2 OPA events this summer and I'm not Complaining, question was asked and I tossed in my 2 cents.

[SVL66]

Bruce,
I only raced 2 OPA events this summer and I'm not Complaining, question was asked and I tossed in my 2 cents.

noted... thanks

[F1-00 Racing]

Rick,

I understand where you are coming from and somewhat agree with you. But with this being concerns of yours, did you as OPA racers approach Smitty after seeing the post of the Billy Mauff(OSS) deal and ask him to call JC and structure the same deal for OPA racers? For that matter did you yourself call JC and ask him if that could apply to you? As upset/****ed that I might be for my class placement, I called JC and spoke with him and asked him if that deal could be applicable in my situation and his response was that he would honor it for both OSS and OPA racers and knowing that I found a loop hole that Pro Am racing was free this year in OSS, he said I didnt need to send in my paperwork to OSS, he would give my team the deal as well. As you see, as Bruce said I was scored but I did not reap the rewards of points or purse. Sometimes it is as simple as a phone call.......

[DAREDEVIL]

Guys,,,you are all some what right and wrong,,,,,,but this is not about entry fees or getting more boats to SBI....THIS IS ABOUT THE CURRENT BOATS AND RULES IN P-CLASS IN SBI !!!!!!!!!!!!

SO PLEASE LETS STAY FOCUSED,,,,IF U WHANT TO DISCUSS THEN STAY FOCUSED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Right now its 75-85-95-105-115 MPH

There are NO 95 MPH boats ..... so lets rumble some together and make it work FOR US !!!!!

Not for OPA ,,OSS !!!!!!!

[DAREDEVIL]

Most of your posts have absolutley nothing to do with this thread !!!:confused:

Trent,,,u should actually be for this rule change......since u always complain about running 85 and they won't let u in P5 ???mmmmhhh

I don't get it .

[2TR]

Rick,

I understand where you are coming from and somewhat agree with you. But with this being concerns of yours, did you as OPA racers approach Smitty after seeing the post of the Billy Mauff(OSS) deal and ask him to call JC and structure the same deal for OPA racers? For that matter did you yourself call JC and ask him if that could apply to you? As upset/****ed that I might be for my class placement, I called JC and spoke with him and asked him if that deal could be applicable in my situation and his response was that he would honor it for both OSS and OPA racers and knowing that I found a loop hole that Pro Am racing was free this year in OSS, he said I didnt need to send in my paperwork to OSS, he would give my team the deal as well. As you see, as Bruce said I was scored but I did not reap the rewards of points or purse. Sometimes it is as simple as a phone call.......



Never even seen the post, to be honest after I tore the transom than caught my boat on fire I was pretty much over it this year.

[SVL66]

i dont think a class should be eliminated just because there havent been any boats in that class this year. Class3 seems to be a class speed that many boats can achieve. The only reason there have been no boats in that class is because there havent been that many boats running SBI. In the past, there have been many P3 boats.

I would say leave it alone. But thats just me

[2TR]

Most of your posts have absolutley nothing to do with this thread !!!:confused:
I don't get it .



White Castle's are better when your drinking..

[F1-00 Racing]

OK I'll bite

30 feet max- 80 mph single engine
90 mph
105 mph



Already posted my opinions on page 3......

[DAREDEVIL]

Already posted my opinions on page 3......

forgot,,,sorry:sifone:

That was the one where u said i ran u off,,,,,,,mmmhhhh...still here ??? LOL

[SVL66]

White Castle's are better when your drinking..

I think White castles are only good after drinking. But they are hell the following day.

Applebees has great wings:26:

[F1-00 Racing]

Also I'm done with P class as a boat owner, if I decide to race ever again it will be in spec only, unless someone needs a driver/throttleman to fill in or something and its not my equipment, then I do my job and go home, the owner can deal with the BS of P class

[F1-00 Racing]

forgot,,,sorry:sifone:

That was the one where u said i ran u off,,,,,,,mmmhhhh...still here ??? LOL
lol you ran me off from racing, but yes after some cooling down I am one of the few insignificant idiots still posting on the boards, the baby is asleep, I need something to fill the time lol

[F1-00 Racing]

I think White castles are only good after drinking. But they are hell the following day.

Applebees has great wings:26:

And one of my many lessons learned, never make a run to White Castle the night before a race:puke:

[SVL66]

And one of my many lessons learned, never make a run to White Castle the night before a race:puke:

And dont drink an entire bottle of tequilla by yourself. That and jelly doghnuts will be messy.

[2TR]

And one of my many lessons learned, never make a run to White Castle the night before a race:puke:

Thats like making deal with the Devil.

[F1-00 Racing]

tis very true...

[Sean H]

And one of my many lessons learned, never make a run to White Castle the night before a race:puke:

the real question is, do you get singles or doubles?

[F1-00 Racing]

the real question is, do you get singles or doubles?

Honestly Sean the only thing I remember is that 3 of us split a 50 pack and they were awesome, but then we all paid the toll the next day

[Sean H]

that sounds like a typical white castle trip...

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

They don't call them Belly Bombers for nothing

[SVL66]

Honestly Sean the only thing I remember is that 3 of us split a 50 pack and they were awesome, but then we all paid the toll the next day


Good thing we were not in a canopied boat:ack2:

[SVL66]

We do however have video of Trent pukin in his helmet

[F1-00 Racing]

Unfortunately two separate incidents, pukin was Brick after the "when in Rome do as the Romans" episode with the bottle of crown hence the video and mind you not a drop on the helmet, cant say as much for the side of your boat though lol

The White Castle night was Seaside Heights and thank god their isnt video of the destroyed port-a-johns and I wasnt on that ship alone that day...

[SVL66]

Ahhhh, my memory failed me. I forgot bout the seaside race.

[F1-00 Racing]

And as much as I enjoy talking about food, DD best of luck in your meeting, hopefully with the amount of pull you have with SBI they will listen to you and take it into account. I'm sure there will be someone *issed off about it and post how screwed up it is and I'll hear the results on the boards at some point. Best of luck racing against a computer and I sincerely thank you for *issing me off to the point of not wanting to race anymore. You saved my family and I a ton of money and now I can start the Trent race club, go and race myself anywhere I want and win. Beats the hell out of paying to race a computer instead of other boats. Can I go ahead and announce the 2010 national and world champion of my new group ahead of time or do you suggest I wait?

Ok back to food!!

[SVL66]

So...who likes subway?

[F1-00 Racing]

Subway is ok, but kinda preferred Quizno's but I am still trying to figure out the gay toaster promotion they have going

[Pat D]

as much as I enjoy talking







(AND I'm not sorry I did it.......:rofl:even though paybacks are hell)

[2TR]

So...who likes subway?

Penn Station Subs, If you have not tried one you should. If you have them in your area.

[DAREDEVIL]

Trent,,,please explain to me how i ran u off so u quit racing !!!!!!!!!

:confused::confused::confused:

[F1-00 Racing]

paybacks are hell

This is a very true point, but not with you. After being wore out by the one lap wonders and the flip floppers in offshore, I'm kinda out of energy. You got me this time, congrats!!!:kiss:

[DAREDEVIL]

This is a very true point, but not with you. After being wore out by the one lap wonders and the flip floppers in offshore, I'm kinda out of energy. You got me this time, congrats!!!:kiss:

So ,, let me get this straight here......u say its my fault and i ran u off,,,but u can't explain it in normal words so we all understand ???

Then i would have to ask u to not post this either,,,it makes me a little upset.
Even if u don't give a ratsa$$ ,,i do .

Scott

[FunHome]

i dont think a class should be eliminated just because there havent been any boats in that class this year. Class3 seems to be a class speed that many boats can achieve. The only reason there have been no boats in that class is because there havent been that many boats running SBI. In the past, there have been many P3 boats.

I would say leave it alone. But thats just me

I agree, just because the boat count was down this year in P-3 don't throw it away... Leave it there for next year... Boat count was down in all classes!!

[DAREDEVIL]

Ok,,,why do u think the P3 boats, that maybe will be back could not run in the 90 MPH CLASS ???

[SVL66]

APBA originally was 70, 80, 90, 100, 110mph...that worked ok too. OPA ran accordingly. If you went that route, then you would be further out of alignment with OPA, making it more difficult for us to cross race associations. I think 75 mph for class 5 is good because F-1 boats can stay in 5. They used to run class4. Not that it really matters to me. but why fix what seems to be working? Once again, it appears you want to change the rules for a few boats that are borderline. I dont really hear anyone complaining, other than you and Trent. Unfortunately, you run a boat that just falls out of 5. Build a reliable motor and you should have no problems competing in 4. Trent needs to figure out how to handle his issue. Once again, to make everyone happy, you'de need to add more classes. we all know everyone cant be happy. Deal with it.

[F1-00 Racing]

Also I'm done with P class as a boat owner, if I decide to race ever again it will be in spec only, unless someone needs a driver/throttleman to fill in or something and its not my equipment, then I do my job and go home, the owner can deal with the BS of P class

Bruce,

This is how I am handling it. Right, wrong, or indifferent. I fit in and never complained when it was 82(2008 rules) then they changed it to 85(2009 rules) now they want to re-invent the wheel again for 2010. With Ole Betsy being a tweener, it costs money to modify things for the rules and when you keep changing the rules every year, I'm over it real quick. I never professed at anytime in my career to be made of money, when they show me some consistency and weed out the one bad seed then I'll reconsider my stance and bring her back. Who knows, maybe I'm that bad seed and this will be for the best.

I take that back, I did kinda complain quietly in 08 when I looked down at my GPS and I was doing 81.3 and one of the boats passed me like I was sitting still, but then never got dqed for breaking out. Point was if it were 82 I would go into P4 happily and I am sure flip flop can attest when she gets over 83-84 she gets out of the water and gets real slippery and out of control, add waves to that now and what do you have? My complaint for 09 was simple, you have 4 registered boats with 500's in their boat, I belong in that class as well, I dont care if its called P-20. Its not like the association doesnt have my dyno sheet.... I guess whatever they decide to change the rules to now dont really apply to the Trent Race Association as I make my own rules and I will dominate my class....

[DAREDEVIL]

Bruce,

This is how I am handling it. Right, wrong, or indifferent. I fit in and never complained when it was 82(2008 rules) then they changed it to 85(2009 rules) now they want to re-invent the wheel again for 2010. With Ole Betsy being a tweener, it costs money to modify things for the rules and when you keep changing the rules every year, I'm over it real quick. I never professed at anytime in my career to be made of money, when they show me some consistency and weed out the one bad seed then I'll reconsider my stance and bring her back. Who knows, maybe I'm that bad seed and this will be for the best.

I take that back, I did kinda complain quietly in 08 when I looked down at my GPS and I was doing 81.3 and one of the boats passed me like I was sitting still, but then never got dqed for breaking out. Point was if it were 82 I would go into P4 happily and I am sure flip flop can attest when she gets over 83-84 she gets out of the water and gets real slippery and out of control, add waves to that now and what do you have? My complaint for 09 was simple, you have 4 registered boats with 500's in their boat, I belong in that class as well, I dont care if its called P-20. Its not like the association doesnt have my dyno sheet.... I guess whatever they decide to change the rules to now dont really apply to the Trent Race Association as I make my own rules and I will dominate my class....

I never knew u could talk that much chit and nonsense !!!!!!:rofl:

must be the coach disease.

[F1-00 Racing]

I never knew u could talk that much chit and nonsense !!!!!!:rofl:

I tryed learning from you, your the bestess, but I'm no match for your drivel

[DAREDEVIL]

I tryed learning from you, your the bestess, but I'm no match for your drivel

NO NO buddy ,,,u top me out by alot,,,,u win !!!!

[F1-00 Racing]

u win !!!!


Why thank you and that means a lot to me. We all know the old racing adage that "You cant win unless you finish" It warms my heart to hear that you think of me as a finisher! At least I left one decent impression of me in the sport...

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Get a room ....LOL

[DAREDEVIL]

Get a room ....LOL

He is with coach,,,no place for me !!!!!:sifone:

THANK GOD !!!!!:USA:

[Wahoo 214]

i did !!!!!

I also think u got hooked on the wrong boat .LOL

Hey DD, you should do your homework. The boat you are trying to bash, was the SBI UIM APBA Class 4 champion as Zero Cavity. To win that title you have to not only finish a race but win. It was also back when SBI had a boat count.

[Wahoo 214]

Sorry Rick I must have misread your posts

Trent,your problem is you came late to the thread. It was orginally in the general racers section and intended to create simarlities across all the Orgs. And as I stated earlier, if you have a problem with your Org join OPA. It works just fine.

[skaterdave]

well appearently thees something that i missed between D@#$@#devil's new class rules idea the current situtation in sbi's p class.

first to fix something, one must recognize the problem and them come up with possible solutions.

f100trent and dd seem to have some personal issues here playing that are hindering the outcome or solution.

next it was said this would help to have more boats in less classes and make for better racing???
if your running all the p classes together the average fan doesn't know if theres 3 classes vs 5 classes. so this does nothing to improve the actual race

next it was said to lessen the classes would improve prize money :
hea for the top one or two guys that are sand baggin, yea thats great. and don't forget that in order to have prize money there needs to be atleast, if remember right, 3 boats and the first place guys gets 3rd place prize money and you'd need to have 5 or 6 boats for the winner to actually get 1st place prize money. even better is you gotta wait till the following season to get your prize money. we had to wait till after KW to get paid for sarasota ??? agian at other motorsports events the winner gets a trophy and a check all in the same day!

plus if you guys adopt DD new rules, this would make running between the orgs even more problematic since as of right know the rules are quite similar. this new "3 classes" is going in the opposite direction of trying to unifiy rules between orgs.

what else you guys got ?

[F1-00 Racing]

Trent,your problem is you came late to the thread. It was orginally in the general racers section and intended to create simarlities across all the Orgs. And as I stated earlier, if you have a problem with your Org join OPA. It works just fine.

I apologize and bow down to you. I read this thread and thought the intent was to get together in Key West for a meeting to discuss SBI's rules....


Jim,,but he is kind of right,,since we will discuss SBI rules !!!!!


But I guess the originator of this thread agrees with you as well:dupe:

I never read anything about unifying the rules or any intent of unifying the rules,only a meeting in Key West. I have told "1Waterboy1" if you'll go to a Garmin GPS setup I'll be there in a heart beat or if you create a no seals, no tech, spec class for single engines 500/525's I'll come as well cause you know we're all about the same...

[Ratickle]

I thought the GPS's in SBI had to be a Garmin? Am I missing something?

8.5.
All Manufacturer Production classes will be required to have an on board, fixed mounted Garmin GPS that has trip and data card downloading capabilities. Contact the SBIP / APBA Offshore office for a specific approved list of Garmin GPS Units. ( Currently the 172, 182, and 192 model )

[F1-00 Racing]

Yes you are right, GPS in OPA are the trucking gps deals, I was telling Wahoo that if they were to go to the Garmins I would come back up to OPA, I assume he gave me an invitation in post 152

[DAREDEVIL]

Hey DD, you should do your homework. The boat you are trying to bash, was the SBI UIM APBA Class 4 champion as Zero Cavity. To win that title you have to not only finish a race but win. It was also back when SBI had a boat count.

LOL:rofl:

[F1-00 Racing]

I am leaving this thread as it is going no where and I wished DD the best with his meeting. I am going to start a thread in General as I want everyones input and I expect to get beat up on it, because as Dean says OPA works, but it is a proposal I have been working on since 2007 in which all P would be eliminated and bring the total V classes down to 4, instead of the what, 10 we have now.

[Ratickle]

Yes you are right, GPS in OPA are the trucking gps deals, I was telling Wahoo that if they were to go to the Garmins I would come back up to OPA, I assume he gave me an invitation in post 152

I know I'm off track here. But what do you not like about the issued GPS's used in OPA?

[Ratickle]

I am leaving this thread as it is going no where and I wished DD the best with his meeting. I am going to start a thread in General as I want everyones input and I expect to get beat up on it, because as Dean says OPA works, but it is a proposal I have been working on since 2007 in which all P would be eliminated and bring the total V classes down to 4, instead of the what, 10 we have now.

You're right, you'll get crucified.....:sifone:

[F1-00 Racing]

You're right, you'll get crucified.....:sifone:

oh well such as life:biggrinjester:

[Wahoo 214]

I know I'm off track here. But what do you not like about the issued GPS's used in OPA?

Because he came to one OPA event and had issues.

[MikeyFIN]

I tryed learning from you, your the bestess, but I'm no match for your driver

I can outsmart you both even in Smack ;)

[MikeyFIN]

He is with coach,,,no place for me !!!!!:sifone:

THANK GOD !!!!!:USA:

and he got the rooms free...or did he :biggrinjester::rofl::lurk5::ack2: ???
:seeya:

[MikeyFIN]

Hey DD, you should do your homework. The boat you are trying to bash, was the SBI UIM APBA Class 4 champion as Zero Cavity.


Put your sarcasm filter at 100%....



To win that title you have to not only finish a race but win. It was also back when SBI had a boat count.

Which isn´t a bad idea at all...and a 70% Finish rule to get points.

[MikeyFIN]

I never read anything about unifying the rules or any intent of unifying the rules,only a meeting in Key West. I have told "1Waterboy1" if you'll go to a Garmin GPS setup I'll be there in a heart beat or if you create a no seals, no tech, spec class for single engines 500/525's I'll come as well cause you know we're all about the same...


Well let´s Discuss THEN ALSO THIS IN KW.
Officially or non officially. It´s fine with me.

The meeting is supposed to be a "brainstorm" and with the "brainpool" we got coming it will be only scattered clouds...:lurk5:

[AugiePensa]

Trent, I'll give you the BRAND NEW NEVER USED GPS out of The Condo. Your move. Only 10 minute install.

[MikeyFIN]

OUCH !!!!!

Next excuse to sit out ;) ?

And I´m dumb enough to look at some seat or boat to race ovethere...

Hell I´ll install it in 10 seconds...with a Hilti...

[DAREDEVIL]

Again ,,people the goal here is about combining some existing classes in LESS so we can have more fun ,,,we just need to figure out a kind of fair way to do this !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
instead of 5 P classes we would have 3 !!!!!!!
Which would also make it easyer on the fans to keep track of whats going on.

1 single engine class only under 33 feet
2 twinn engine classes 1. 33-38 feet and 1. 38-????? feet

And this is all this thread is about,,,,ITS GOING TO HAPPEN ANYWAYS,,,my point is before they rule it ,,lets get our heads together and say ok,,,but it has to be like that.

And this is only in SBI,,,just to verify .

[Ratickle]

I believe you'll have less boats, not more. But, we'll see.

One thing though. One of you needs to change your avatar. It's way too confusing who said what.....

Like dating twins and trying to figure out who doesn't have PMS.....

[DAREDEVIL]

One thing though. One of you needs to change your avatar. It's way too confusing who said what.....

Like dating twins and trying to figure out who doesn't have PMS.....


Just like in racing,,,u wait and see .LOL:sifone:

[Ratickle]

Just like in racing,,,u wait and see .LOL:sifone:

You see the boat I found for Mika with the right paint job??????

[DAREDEVIL]

You see the boat I found for Mika with the right paint job??????

LOL,,,your kidding....... right ??!!

[MikeyFIN]

Like dating twins and trying to figure out who doesn't have PMS.....

Well obviously that´s something you haven´t experienced either :sifone:

[Ratickle]

Well obviously that´s something you haven´t experienced either :sifone:

Long, long time ago.

[XtremeRacing]

I believe you'll have less boats, not more. But, we'll see.

One thing though. One of you needs to change your avatar. It's way too confusing who said what.....

Like dating twins and trying to figure out who doesn't have PMS.....

Why do u think u will see less boat just curious??????
From what i have heard to teams that i spoke to looks pretty good to me, looks like ALL the big boats r coming.

Looks like:
7-8 SuperCat
6-7 SVU
6-8 SS
5-6 Superboat Unlimiteds
2-3 V Extremes
2 Turbines
2-3 Cat Lites
4-6 P4
4-6 P5
3-4 P1
3-5 P2
Just a quick count 50 plus already . Thats just the start off the top of my head .

[Ratickle]

Why do u think u will see less boat just curious??????
From what i have heard to teams that i spoke to looks pretty good to me, looks like ALL the big boats r coming.

Looks like:
7-8 SuperCat
6-7 SVU
6-8 SS
5-6 Superboat Unlimiteds
2-3 V Extremes
2 Turbines
2-3 Cat Lites
4-6 P4
4-6 P5
3-4 P1
3-5 P2
Just a quick count 50 plus already . Thats just the start off the top of my head .


I was talking about if you cut the total number of P classes down to 3 for the future like was suggested in the previous post by DD. Right now you're only looking at missing P3.

[XtremeRacing]

Do you really think one class less will make that much of a differance, most of the most if not all will fit into a class believe me. Alot of the boats r in classes they shouldnt be in and will fit in.I think if you match the boats up better and try and give everyone a even chance you will see more not less, just my option.

[XtremeRacing]

Right now we r taking a look at all the SBI registered boat and looking at speeds that they can truly run not what they are set up for. We will do the same after KW with any new registered boats to make sure it all works. Like anything in Offshore I'm sure everyone wont be happy but will that really be a suprise ?

[Ratickle]

I believe, and you can pick on this all you want, the reason there are not more P class boats in SBI is the current cost structure as was said. I wanted to race in Michigan City, only a two hour drive. Expense was too high, so I watched and talked with fans all along the beach and in the pits.

If you want to go from 5 P classes to 3 to make better racing between the boats currently racing SBI P classes, okay. But I see no way that will attract a large number of new boats. My opinion.

[XtremeRacing]

Nothing is in stone and what ever happens we will try and make work for the racers because that is truely what it is all about.

KW will tell the tail of what the furthure will bring.

[F1-00 Racing]

Trent, I'll give you the BRAND NEW NEVER USED GPS out of The Condo. Your move. Only 10 minute install.

Thank you Augie, I currently own the currently approved OPA wireless GPS system, brand new, never used. Who knows what will happen but I am currently looking at spec boats to go back to that, Ole Betsy is being retired. I feel that if I ran Pt Pleasant with her "Buckshot" would be in better shape than she would be after that race lol

Trent

[DAREDEVIL]

C-YA all in KW and have a safe trip down !!!!!!!

Happy Boating:USA:

[MikeyFIN]

Right now we r taking a look at all the SBI registered boat and looking at speeds that they can truly run not what they are set up for. We will do the same after KW with any new registered boats to make sure it all works. Like anything in Offshore I'm sure everyone wont be happy but will that really be a suprise ?

Exactly. Thats the way to broaden the field and keep the rules unchanged for a long time, or then one set of @ gears and max prop size& pitch is IMO all it takes.




If you want to go from 5 P classes to 3 to make better racing between the boats currently racing SBI P classes, okay. But I see no way that will attract a large number of new boats. My opinion.

I think if you go bu the limited top speed then you could put two classes in the same start and same top speed to make it more fun for the crowd and yes there will be close racing even though not in the same classes.
I know this bugs some but it still is racing despite being in different classes and also more prizes.

[AugiePensa]

Thank you Augie, I currently own the currently approved OPA wireless GPS system, brand new, never used. Who knows what will happen but I am currently looking at spec boats to go back to that, Ole Betsy is being retired. I feel that if I ran Pt Pleasant with her "Buckshot" would be in better shape than she would be after that race lol

Trent

Remember BUCKSHOT that year she Split in half!