HTM engine

[sterling]

I bought a set Keith black Oldsmobile DRCE aluminium engines ,they are Bandit racing engines ,632 ci ,dry sump ,jesel valvetrain ,solid rollers ,power is 1000-1100 hp ,rpm ,s were 6500-6800 according formal owner .
How about using one for in my SR 24 HTM ? would the lightweight engine be better ,or does it make not much difference in this type boat ?

[MikeyFIN]

Problem is those are Drag motors.... they won´t live in a boat at leasty with the camshafts thats in It I reckon with a big overlap.
Light is always right but in the right places.

[Ratickle]

You'll have issues.

RPM of the current setup is too high for a Bravo drive. Depending on the power curve, you should probably not run it over about 6000rpm. So, cam change needed. As Mika said, probably need that anyway to fix the overlap unless you're running dry exhaust.

You need to know the compression ratio at boost to know what fuel to run. On the water is tough to get high octane.

You will most likely need to marinize the engine changing to brass plugs etc.

Other than that, I think it would be cool. Does that boltup use the same pattern as a big block Chevy?

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

It looks like they might have been in a boat. Looks like marine water hoses and flame arresters. Not sure why the high r's are are a problem with bravos. I would be more concerned with how low they will idle. They need to idle below 1000 ideally lower to shift. I have seen sillier things done. Were they boat motors? Do they have chevy bolt pattern on back? What exhaust do you plan on running?

[DAREDEVIL]

I bought a set Keith black Oldsmobile DRCE aluminium engines ,they are Bandit racing engines ,632 ci ,dry sump ,jesel valvetrain ,solid rollers ,power is 1000-1100 hp ,rpm ,s were 6500-6800 according formal owner .
How about using one for in my SR 24 HTM ? would the lightweight engine be better ,or does it make not much difference in this type boat ?

Just let me put one of them in my raceboat and i will test it for you,,,IF IT LIVES ITS OK in your boat.

:USA:

[sterling]

These engines were in a Skater 36, with # 5 drives ,the exhaust bolt pattern on the heads are BBC style (EPD racing heads) the tranny bolt pattern on the block is GM style and Chrysler style ( 2 bolt patterns)
I was plan to use a Speedmaster #4 that I have on my shelf ,I was also unsure if a bravo would work ... the engines idle at 1100 rpm ,exhausts are Stellings big tube I was hoping for 125 MPH in this HTM cat ,do you guys think thats possible with this engine and # 4 drive ???

[MikeyFIN]

Are you sure these ain´t marinized Drag engines ??

I mean the parts you list would make me think that way...DRCE alu block, all out Oldsmobile Pro Stock heads that flow up to 8000 rpm or more if needed tunnel ram with Dominators. Sounds like Pro Mod right there...
Put the SSM on that cat and Hang on and pray is all I can say...

That´ll be a wild ride for sure....

[sterling]

Bandit racing has a website ,they use to make engines based on a DRCE block ,they are true offshore engines build from the begin .
They were in a 36 Skater that was converted to pleasure deck ,but was originally a twin canopy raceboat,I do believe its the same boat as on Bandits website .

[sterling]

http://www.kurtsmarine.com/history.htm

Here,s a link to Bandit racing engines

[Ratickle]

Cool, run them. That will be a heck of a ride.

What does your HTM have in it now? It has a #4 drive??????

[Ratickle]

By the way Jim, good eye on the fittings......

But you think a Bravo will live at 1100 horsepower and 6800 RPM?????

[Ratickle]

If you use one. How much you want for the other??????:sifone:

[MikeyFIN]

By the way Jim, good eye on the fittings......

But you think a Bravo will live at 1100 horsepower and 6800 RPM?????
+1 for JIM.
I Think Mange on the board and the other Arrow guys are pushing it close. Mange at 900 and then there´s this other dude with an Arrow830 that has a 1025hp Blower engine...
So they at least should know if there´s any left.
With a Cat that could be possible but it still would be a short fuse IMO.

[DAREDEVIL]

If you use one. How much you want for the other??????:sifone:

I AM FIRST.:sifone:

[Chris]

632" at 6500+ isn't going to last very long. Even with the best stuff inside. The CID/RPM/horsepower you're talking about says they're going to need race fuel which is expensive and inconvenient at best. Those heads were originally developed for pro stock class racing. They're not going to be all that friendly at low RPM's. Those large ports mean big power up top but low intake velocoties at idle and low RPM. That means the fuel will fall out of it's atomized state and puddle, causing plug fouling and rough low/mid rpm running.

The SSM IV was engineered for about 750 hp. It'll work, but not for long.

These are race boat engines, not pleasure boat engines. You can use them, but you can also keep a Bengal tiger as a pet. It's cool, but it's got alot of downsides.

[DAREDEVIL]

632" at 6500+ isn't going to last very long. Even with the best stuff inside. The CID/RPM/horsepower you're talking about says they're going to need race fuel which is expensive and inconvenient at best. Those heads were originally developed for pro stock class racing. They're not going to be all that friendly at low RPM's. Those large ports mean big power up top but low intake velocoties at idle and low RPM. That means the fuel will fall out of it's atomized state and puddle, causing plug fouling and rough low/mid rpm running.

The SSM IV was engineered for about 750 hp. It'll work, but not for long.

These are race boat engines, not pleasure boat engines. You can use them, but you can also keep a Bengal tiger as a pet. It's cool, but it's got alot of downsides.

100 % right.
and don't ask how i know. LOL

[sterling]

I was only thinking about using one in my HTM,I have a 518 ci with blower and intercooler too ,that might be a little easier ,anyway the HTM was set up for bravo 1 ,so my idea was to use the #4 instead ,cause I feel by looking at #4 its a much beefier drive ,gimball is much thicker and the gimball ring is massive compare to a bravo.
The #4 was indeed rated at 750 ,but back then wen there was no # 5 or #6 ,they used bigger engines on a #4 ,just like they did on a bravo 1 when there was no XR drive .
We had a 1100 hp twin turbo engine on a 28 ft boat with a #4 ,and it never broke ,at least not with us .
I have to redone the HTM next year ,because it is in bad shape ,the floor is rotten ,so I have some work to do before I can put any power /drive in.

[MikeyFIN]

Could you post some pics of that Twin turbo engine, maybe an own thread about Turbo marine motors even..

[DAREDEVIL]

I was only thinking about using one in my HTM,I have a 518 ci with blower and intercooler too ,that might be a little easier ,anyway the HTM was set up for bravo 1 ,so my idea was to use the #4 instead ,cause I feel by looking at #4 its a much beefier drive ,gimball is much thicker and the gimball ring is massive compare to a bravo.
The #4 was indeed rated at 750 ,but back then wen there was no # 5 or #6 ,they used bigger engines on a #4 ,just like they did on a bravo 1 when there was no XR drive .
We had a 1100 hp twin turbo engine on a 28 ft boat with a #4 ,and it never broke ,at least not with us .
I have to redone the HTM next year ,because it is in bad shape ,the floor is rotten ,so I have some work to do before I can put any power /drive in.

I would'nt worry about the #4 either,,,hope its a big shaft tho.
Remember u need a tranny / crashbox for it,,so engine needs to be moved forward in the boat.
I have a gimbal if u need one,,,,,,actually i have everything if u need parts for a #4 or so.

[MikeyFIN]

632" at 6500+ isn't going to last very long. Even with the best stuff inside. The CID/RPM/horsepower you're talking about says they're going to need race fuel which is expensive and inconvenient at best. Those heads were originally developed for pro stock class racing. They're not going to be all that friendly at low RPM's. Those large ports mean big power up top but low intake velocoties at idle and low RPM. That means the fuel will fall out of it's atomized state and puddle, causing plug fouling and rough low/mid rpm running.

The SSM IV was engineered for about 750 hp. It'll work, but not for long.

These are race boat engines, not pleasure boat engines. You can use them, but you can also keep a Bengal tiger as a pet. It's cool, but it's got alot of downsides.

Well Said Chris.. look at my post, #7...
The Olds/Buick/Pontiac DRCE Pro Stock heads flow around 420cfm at .500" lift and 28" vacuum.
An Ordinary Square port 188 head flows ca 365 from a LS6/420 Merc 454/ 365 Magnum/454 HO.
Still those Square ports doesn´t either work properly until ca 4000 rpm and not even then has cought a normal big oval 454 head especially if done with big valves.
Those ovals can go up to 650 hp and 6500 on a 502 also and flow only around 300cfm at best.
So those heads are even IMO for a 632 overkill unless you drag race.

the lesson here is it´s allabout velocity not a big flow number...

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

sterling, my suggestion would be to put the big power in a bigger boat than a 24. Adding all that power and the weight of a SSM in 24 is not the best choice IMO. A 30' something would appreciate big power more and accommodate the weight better.

Whether or not a race motor will keep your " fun meter pegged" in pleasure use is another discussion.

[sterling]

Its for fun only ,If I go for real big power I will bring compression back ,and add a 5 liter whipple or a big PSI blower,or even twin turbo,s and run 1300 hp or so,maybe I will do that ,I have a family boat to take the wife and kid ,so a little fun is nice ,the yellow cat is the fun boat for now ,MickeyFin ,the twin turbo on the pic is the BPM ,in its K jetronic form ,we are busy to switch to EFI technology and put is on the dyno to write the propgramm,and then install in the 23 ft V bottem ( 1000 LBS hull only)

[MOBILEMERCMAN]

Do you have more toys you can post?:drool5:

[sterling]

Do you have more toys you can post?:drool5:

Thanks ,I don,t have picture,s from all the toys,but I have a pic when we just received our 23 ft V bottem when it was just ready ( bare hull )
The BPM twin turbo is the engine for this boat, drive is a brand new # 5 with a crash box ,the other pic is my Scarab 31 Viper that I converted to outboards last winter ,the whole boat is been redone ,I am going to sell this boat because I don,t use it .

[Quinlan]

Nice project! But HTMs a pretty scary with Mild power from what I have seen.

[sterling]

Nice project! But HTMs a pretty scary with Mild power from what I have seen.

Could you explain that ? I have a 496 HO for power now ,I assume thats mild power ?
I will start a new thread in the following days as the HTM is just been painted

Thx A.J

[tbanzer]

Nice project! But HTMs a pretty scary with Mild power from what I have seen.

I say Bullsh--, alot of them out there with big hp.