Cougar Cat 40 w Turbines for sale what's the story

[Dude! Sweet!]

This boat is for sale (in the Skater section) on OSO. Anyone know the story on it. The jet outboard is certainly intersting (and keeping with the theme :D ).

[Dude! Sweet!]

More pics.

[FastDonzi]

Before the Turbines was this a Race Boat??? If so I'd guess Steve Curtis's World Champ (with Nikki C, Boardwalk?) anybody know?????

[DiamondPerformance]

That boat used to dock on the upper Chesapeake in the mid 90's, i don't think it had Turbines then.

[PJC]

looks like one of the old Seahawk boats

[FastDonzi]

looks like one of the old Seahawk boats

It does resemble the 2nd seahawk, But IIRC it was a 36', this one say it's a 40'.

[Ryan Beckley]

Pretty sure this was the second SEAHAWK, APACHE, COUGAR, Bengal Bay Club......

[FastDonzi]

Pretty sure this was the second SEAHAWK, APACHE, COUGAR, Bengal Bay Club......


So it must not be a 40' then. the 2 SeaHawks where 38' & 36'.

[PJC]

The first Seahawk 38' (originaly The Collection) went to France and was called Divin
The Second Seahawk 36' Steve and myself raced in 1988 as Reporter, this boat was still in Europe last time heard of it
The third Seahawk was the 41' this is the boat that Steve won the 1987 worlds in, later this boat raced as Bengal Bay Club
Then there was a fourth boat which may have been larger, records show this may have ended up in Japan

[PJC]

The gold and silver stripes lead me to believe it is an old Seahawk, Its not boat 1, 2 or 3 but it could be boat 4.
Boat 1 and 3 did not have the bevelled deck edge, boat 2 did but was only a 36, will have a hunt to see if we have any pictures of boat 4

[Rik]

So it must not be a 40' then. the 2 SeaHawks where 38' & 36'.

This boat was originally a 38' and they added 2' to the boat to fit the turbines in it.

Chip converted the boat from the gas engines to the turbines.

[PJC]

Boat 4 which was made in 1988 was 38'

[Gladhe8er]

Before the Turbines was this a Race Boat??? If so I'd guess Steve Curtis's World Champ (with Nikki C, Boardwalk?) anybody know?????

Pretty sure Nicky never ran this boat.

[chewiekw]

I dont remember a 4th Seahawk boat? Does anyone have pictures?

[PJC]

This is the boat

[FastDonzi]

Yeah Pete, that sure looks like it. Good Job..

[Black Tornado]

The gold and silver stripes lead me to believe it is an old Seahawk, Its not boat 1, 2 or 3 but it could be boat 4.
Boat 1 and 3 did not have the bevelled deck edge, boat 2 did but was only a 36, will have a hunt to see if we have any pictures of boat 4

Then are you Pete Currington?
But I think could it be the boat 3 of Curtis at KW 1987 with the deck modified after.
Boat 4 was totally different. Sorry but I cannot post the pics because who has given them to me has asked me to didn't show them.

[PJC]

Then are you Pete Currington?
But I think could it be the boat 3 of Curtis at KW 1987 with the deck modified after.
Boat 4 was totally different. Sorry but I cannot post the pics because who has given them to me has asked me to didn't show them.

Yep

Boat three that Steve raced in 1987 was a 41', Boat 4 was 48' and built in 1988, it was built for the Seahawk team but I think it first raced as Bengal Bay Club

Attached pictures of boat 1, 2 and 3

[PJC]

And boat 4

[Black Tornado]

And boat 4

But that isn't a 48 foot!
Compare at pic 3 above....

[PJC]

But that isn't a 48 foot!
Compare at pic 3 above....

woops should have said 41'

[Dude! Sweet!]

I'm so used to seeing them with canopies... Looks odd to me. Reminds me of a pre-war fighter plane! Thanks PJC. It's nice to have guys who actually know what there talking about on here (unlike me!).

[chewiekw]

So why did Seahawk build two 41 foot boats a year apart? Could the 4th boat and 3rd be the same one?

[PJC]

So why did Seahawk build two 41 foot boats a year apart? Could the 4th boat and 3rd be the same one?

Problem is me not reading what I have typed, following is correct

Boat 1 Originally raced as the Collection, purchase by the Seahawk team when they moved into Class 1, this boat was 38'
Boat 2 Built for the Seahawk team this boat was 36' went to Europe in 1988
Boat 3 Built for the Seahawk team this boat was 41' this is the boat that won the 1987 worlds as Cougar
Boat 4 Built for the Seahawk team this boat was 38', never raced as Seahawk but did race as Bengal Bay Club, This is the turbine boat

[T2x]

Before the Turbines was this a Race Boat??? If so I'd guess Steve Curtis's World Champ (with Nikki C, Boardwalk?) anybody know?????

I don't know why you think Nick Cutro ran in this boat..... Stevie won the WC with Justo Jay of the Sea Hawk team in the boat with him. I think AJ Roberts was involved with that boat as well.

T2x

[FastDonzi]

I don't know why you think Nick Cutro ran in this boat..... Stevie won the WC with Justo Jay of the Sea Hawk team in the boat with him. I think AJ Roberts was involved with that boat as well.

T2x


I don't know why, but one small portion of the very back side/bottom of my Brain thought Nikki and Steve Got together once. Who else was in this Boat with Steve and Justo? Pete Currington? (I thought it was Nick, IDK why) I'm sure If AJ was in the boat he would have been the driver of record, but I think in this case Steve was.

[Black Tornado]

I don't know why, but one small portion of the very back side/bottom of my Brain thought Nikki and Steve Got together once. Who else was in this Boat with Steve and Justo? Pete Currington? (I thought it was Nick, IDK why) I'm sure If AJ was in the boat he would have been the driver of record, but I think in this case Steve was.

The third in that 41' at KW 1987 was Orlando Lorenzo.

[Black Tornado]

Problem is me not reading what I have typed, following is correct

Boat 1 Originally raced as the Collection, purchase by the Seahawk team when they moved into Class 1, this boat was 38'
Boat 2 Built for the Seahawk team this boat was 36' went to Europe in 1988
Boat 3 Built for the Seahawk team this boat was 41' this is the boat that won the 1987 worlds as Cougar
Boat 4 Built for the Seahawk team this boat was 38', never raced as Seahawk but did race as Bengal Bay Club, This is the turbine boat

That boat is not even a 38.'
But then Ok that Magluta had money to throw but that sense had build a practically twin boat to the old 38?'
If he wanted it lighter was enough modifying the deck of that already existing......as Kobayashi probably made to the new-acquired 41' of Curtis.

[PJC]

I don't know why you think Nick Cutro ran in this boat..... Stevie won the WC with Justo Jay of the Sea Hawk team in the boat with him. I think AJ Roberts was involved with that boat as well.

T2x

AJ Had nothing to do with this boat

[Rik]

If you want, I'll just call Chip and find out the details of the boats past history.

[T2x]

AJ Had nothing to do with this boat

Did he own Cougar of North America at that time?

[Black Tornado]

Now perhaps we succeeds in understanding better that it is the same 41.'

[PJC]

Did he own Cougar of North America at that time?

AJ Roberts and Dick Fullam were going to be Cougars agents in America, after Dick died in Key West 85 it all went wrong and all AJ did was screw us and splashed a mould from a clients boat that was in the yard.

[Dude! Sweet!]

If you want, I'll just call Chip and find out the details of the boats past history.

But Rik... that would be too easy! :sifone:

[PJC]

Now perhaps we succeeds in understanding better that it is the same 41.'

Na you are wrong, one picture is the 41’ and the second is the 38’, both boats raced as Bengal Bay Club at some time

If you look at the cockpit fairing on the 38' you will see it is the same as the pictures of the turbine boat and the gunwale edge is cut at an angle

If you look at the 41 you will see that the cockpit fairing is different and the gunwale is not cut at an angle

Also I looked at the build log and the line drawing for this boat which confirm it was 38’

[Dude! Sweet!]

What does the future hold for a boat like this or the alloy 46 at National Liquidators? Are there real buyers out there for these boats or are they headed for a slow death in a field or a quick death at a scrapper? Didn't it take a give away price and a year or two to sell Endagered Species?

[Rik]

Boat was Blue when he purchased it and it was raced as "KS&W" before it was confiscated by the US Gov from which Chip purchased it with US Coast Guard painted on it.

[chewiekw]

So it wasn't called SeaHawk? Do you have any pictures of it racing under KS&W and who raced it?

[FastDonzi]

Who Is Chip????

[T2x]

AJ Roberts and Dick Fullam were going to be Cougars agents in America, after Dick died in Key West 85 it all went wrong and all AJ did was screw us and splashed a mould from a clients boat that was in the yard.

Thanks for the clarification. At that time AJ was portraying himself as Cougar of North America's owner.

T2x

[FastDonzi]

Thanks for the clarification. At that time AJ was portraying himself as Cougar of North America's owner.

T2x


AJ actually built the Poorest quality boats to EVER Come off that street, His Knockoff Cougar Monos Had a 4" Deep x 4' Long Hook that they filled with Putty only, sanded it smooth and Polished it, I Imagine it came out as one Huge Chunk.

Ya Know, Someone actually Blew the front doors off the building with a shot gun to show their displeasure with him. The Sam Griffith Trophy was in the next room and took some lead as well...anyone recall this??????

[Chris]

What does the future hold for a boat like this or the alloy 46 at National Liquidators? Are there real buyers out there for these boats or are they headed for a slow death in a field or a quick death at a scrapper? Didn't it take a give away price and a year or two to sell Endagered Species?

The 46 that NL has was at Cumberland. It was Tim Ciasulli's- he traded it to them. I doubt it ever sees water again. Those boats are massively heavy and take a TON of very expensive power and drivetrain to get them up and moving. And then you have the noise issue. They make all sorts of racket- like the big metal drum that they are. There's a bare 47 Apache hull at Turbine Marine they are almost giving away and it still sits. The Cougar's odds are likely to be much lower.

A twin engined cat- why not? They're not all that fast, but they can be had cheap. Insurance would be a problem most likely. Insurance on that turbine would be a tough get.

[Black Tornado]

Na you are wrong, one picture is the 41’ and the second is the 38’, both boats raced as Bengal Bay Club at some time

If you look at the cockpit fairing on the 38' you will see it is the same as the pictures of the turbine boat and the gunwale edge is cut at an angle

If you look at the 41 you will see that the cockpit fairing is different and the gunwale is not cut at an angle

Also I looked at the build log and the line drawing for this boat which confirm it was 38’

The gunwhale edge could subsequently be modified. Already in other cases it has been done.
In a interview made to Kobayashi in 1988 about him fleet of America's Cup,Offshore and yacht boats he spoke the only Cougar was the 41' World Champ in KW 87.
However you were or you are still in Cougar therefore I cannot insist on this matter yet.
Unfortunately I cannot show you the photos of the last cat that was built for Magluta in the 1987. The only thing that I can do is to say that it had the cockpit on the tunnel in tandem.

[thedonz]

The first SEAHAWK 38 was raced by my ex girlfriends dad Mandy Fernandez ( throttle man) and by colombus ( driver ) under the name "The Collection" than they went into a 36 Jaguar under the name " Ferrari " which was part of The Collection as well

Mike

[Rik]

Who Is Chip????

The guy who owns the boat. Chip Morgan

[chewiekw]

Any pictures of the one running as KS&W?

[Dude! Sweet!]

That's the one they refer to as Goldrush? (Maybe not I just saw the similar hull shape, but no ribbing on the one above).

I'd meant to ask that in another thread. I thought that boat was found and for sale a year or two ago.

[Dude! Sweet!]

The first SEAHAWK 38 was raced by my ex girlfriends dad Mandy Fernandez ( throttle man) and by colombus ( driver ) under the name "The Collection" than they went into a 36 Jaguar under the name " Ferrari " which was part of The Collection as well

Mike

Mike, totally off topic, but Jo Nunez showed me some pictures of your old 24 when it was being re-rigged and it had the name Mandy and a phone number on it. Was that Mandy Fernandez or another guy?

[lowblue320]

The first SEAHAWK 38 was raced by my ex girlfriends dad Mandy Fernandez ( throttle man) and by colombus ( driver )

Mike


The name is not colombus it is Hugo Columbo, a very successful developer in which also owned and still owns The Collection.

BTW,I haven't forgot about you brother.

[Black Tornado]

Any pictures of the one running as KS&W?

This is the cat of which spoke for Magluta and that not runs never because in the meantime Sal had his problems with the federals.
I remembered badly but the places are side by side.

[smokeybandit]

That's the one they refer to as Goldrush? (Maybe not I just saw the similar hull shape, but no ribbing on the one above).

I'd meant to ask that in another thread. I thought that boat was found and for sale a year or two ago.

Hate to hijack the thread, but....

Was Goldrush the boat that flipped while they were testing for Powerboat? Guessing 1982 or 1983.

[FastDonzi]

Hate to hijack the thread, but....

Was Goldrush the boat that flipped while they were testing for Powerboat? Guessing 1982 or 1983.


Yes, At Cougar we had the Sequence of Photos up on the wall. Kind of Ironic it would flip like that just jumping a wake. I believe it had a Reporter aboard at the time....

[northernoffshore]

weren't the mono hulls copied from a bertram 38' and had chime walking issues? What ever happened to grant wilson?

[FastDonzi]

weren't the mono hulls copied from a bertram 38' and had chime walking issues? What ever happened to grant wilson?


Nope, Cougars Mono was built from a clean sheet, It's not a copy of anything.

[FLYING FISH]

Some time ago I asked Marco to keep the Seahawk 41ft under wraps,and thanks for that.Since then it appeared for sale on one of the websites and the history of it was then public.It was a bit of a disaster,because in the course of sorting it out,it hit a bridge and at the same time the owner was locked up.From the same office that the Picchiotti boats were born,this monster came forth complete with two transverse mounted engines via right angle boxes to the surface drives.The running bottom wasn`t quite right and was being modified when hit decided to eat the bridge.Jack Stuteville who was racing in Europe saw the single engined cat `Goldrush` finish in a rough Viareggio - Bastia race and suggested to Sal that he had a OP1 version.An amusing aside which I have related before, was that in the course of building it,cash arrived for the builder,and when it was counted at the bank,the machine stuck due to conjealed blood over the bank notes.The writing was on the wall.
I`ll throw another boat into the ring.Could this boat in the thread be Still Crazy, which I think may have become A.J.Roberts.Not the one the boy Curtis won the Worlds in.

[FastDonzi]

Some time ago I asked Marco to keep the Seahawk 41ft under wraps,and thanks for that.Since then it appeared for sale on one of the websites and the history of it was then public.It was a bit of a disaster,because in the course of sorting it out,it hit a bridge and at the same time the owner was locked up.From the same office that the Picchiotti boats were born,this monster came forth complete with two transverse mounted engines via right angle boxes to the surface drives.The running bottom wasn`t quite right and was being modified when hit decided to eat the bridge.Jack Stuteville who was racing in Europe saw the single engined cat `Goldrush` finish in a rough Viareggio - Bastia race and suggested to Sal that he had a OP1 version.An amusing aside which I have related before, was that in the course of building it,cash arrived for the builder,and when it was counted at the bank,the machine stuck due to conjealed blood over the bank notes.The writing was on the wall.
I`ll throw another boat into the ring.Could this boat in the thread be Still Crazy, which I think may have become A.J.Roberts.Not the one the boy Curtis won the Worlds in.


The Boat They (Steven & AJ) won the Worlds in was Cabrera, I Believe AJ's Tin Boat was the one Halpern got Killed in (Mich Light).OR Was Mich Light & Cabrerra The Same Boat?? IDK what happenend to Still Crazy, I never knew of it Racing again.

[Ryan Beckley]

This IS NOT Still Crazy, It was raced ONE time 2 years later (maybe 1987) in Marathon as Coors Light Silver Bullet. Last seen rotting away in Jacksonville , I believe.

[FLYING FISH]

I know this is off the thread a bit,but what was the attached boat.Did it become Burago (hired by Ballabio for key west).

[FastDonzi]

I know this is off the thread a bit,but what was the attached boat.Did it become Burago (hired by Ballabio for key west).


Yes, I think the next year after they won the Championship tony tried his hand at racing without Steve, didn't work out so well..I think He raced with Daniel Scioli once or twice in a red triple engine V Bottom, anyone recall?

[thedonz]

The name is not colombus it is Hugo Columbo, a very successful developer in which also owned and still owns The Collection.

BTW,I haven't forgot about you brother.

Hugo Columbo is realated to Christopher Columbus ( 1492 ). He's was the developer of the " Santa Maria" in Brickell


Mike

[thedonz]

Mike, totally off topic, but Jo Nunez showed me some pictures of your old 24 when it was being re-rigged and it had the name Mandy and a phone number on it. Was that Mandy Fernandez or another guy?

No different guy.....but i would like to see those pics....send them to my email top1gun38@aol.com....thanks

Mike

[Black Tornado]

Graham,excuse me if I have thrown you inside this history.
Today I have found the context of the photo of the 41'Bengal Bay ex Cougar that refers to the Worlds of Atlantic City of the 1989. Then it could not be the Bengal Bay with the cutted gunwale that it is dated instead 1988.
After all also a 41' pic from the old your Library in Boatmad, show the ex Curtis cat in Atlantic City docks in 1989 that confirm this.
I also apologize to Pete for my insistence. :iagree:

[Ratickle]

Just throwing in that I love reading this thread....:)

[lowblue320]

hugo columbo is realated to christopher columbus ( 1492 ). He's was the developer of the " santa maria" in brickell


mike

lol

[thedonz]

y0o0 regatta in 1 week.....are you in ...i'm there....let me know

Mike

[Lubejobs42]

Somebody should send the link to John Aruda. He should buy it. He could probably get some good tips on building a turbine boat! :26:

[Chris]

I saw the boat back in 2000. The photos really don't do it justice.

[KAAMA]

I remember seeing those Cougar Cats like KS&W, Sea Hawk, K-Systems, etc, running at least once or twice at the Grand Haven, Michigan boat races back in the day....1980's. I always remember seeing these boats mostly colored in black with gold accent striping on them---and some with megaphone/cone shaped attachments to the tailpipes of the exhaust.

[MANITIE]

Ryan....I think Craig Barrie was in that boat named Coors Light in 1987, Craig has old mags. and news articals of them, he showed me a numbe of mags and pics of them in that Cougar.

[fixxxer22]

Ok, i dont think anyone has asked.... why the hell is there 2 turbine engines in this thing and a jet outboard? to get it moving or for docking? i am confused!:sifone:

[Chris]

When this boat was assembled in the late 90's there had yet to be developed a way of adapting a transmission to a turbine. So these were direct-coupled to the drives. He cut a well in the back and mounted this outboard in the middle of the tunnel. When you wanted to back up, you lowered the outboard and started it.

In order to shift the transmissions on turbines, brakes were developed to momentarily stop the output shaft rotation. A turbine at minimum idle RPM still has a turning output shaft. And not all turbines are capable of having the output stage stopped- even briefly. That may have been the case with the units he used here. I can't remember what they were. The owner had an old Cig 35 for sale about 10 years ago that I looked at. I checked out the Cougar while I was there.

[Offshore Ginger]

PJC - just curious Mate are you Steve Curtis......or

[PJC]

PJC - just curious Mate are you Steve Curtis......or

Close he is in the next office, I am Pete Currington - Steve's buisness partner at Cougar Marine

[FastDonzi]

PJC is one of the most talented people in the Boat Biz, Some of the Little common sense I have I learned from him. (hey pete, are you gonna make it over for any of Steves races? I'm thinking of going to the Miami race in June)

[fixxxer22]

When this boat was assembled in the late 90's there had yet to be developed a way of adapting a transmission to a turbine. So these were direct-coupled to the drives. He cut a well in the back and mounted this outboard in the middle of the tunnel. When you wanted to back up, you lowered the outboard and started it.

In order to shift the transmissions on turbines, brakes were developed to momentarily stop the output shaft rotation. A turbine at minimum idle RPM still has a turning output shaft. And not all turbines are capable of having the output stage stopped- even briefly. That may have been the case with the units he used here. I can't remember what they were. The owner had an old Cig 35 for sale about 10 years ago that I looked at. I checked out the Cougar while I was there.

It all makes sense now:cheers2:

[Chris]

I'm far from an expert on turbines, but the way I understand it, the output stage blades are hollow and are cooled by air passing through them as they rotate. Without cooling they overheat and deform or fail. Some turbines are made to be idled or stopped- like the one's in an M-1 tank or some of the marine-specific ones. Some are tolerant of it for brief periods of time and some will just die if you applied a brake to the output.

[Rik]

When this boat was assembled in the late 90's there had yet to be developed a way of adapting a transmission to a turbine. So these were direct-coupled to the drives. He cut a well in the back and mounted this outboard in the middle of the tunnel. When you wanted to back up, you lowered the outboard and started it.

In order to shift the transmissions on turbines, brakes were developed to momentarily stop the output shaft rotation. A turbine at minimum idle RPM still has a turning output shaft. And not all turbines are capable of having the output stage stopped- even briefly. That may have been the case with the units he used here. I can't remember what they were. The owner had an old Cig 35 for sale about 10 years ago that I looked at. I checked out the Cougar while I was there.

There was a way, we've done it since the early 80's with a caliper and rotor but people at the local yacht club started getting irritated at the noise so it was dual function. Noise reduction and auxiliary power.

[Offshore Ginger]

Close he is in the next office, I am Pete Currington - Steve's buisness partner at Cougar Marine Cool , and the reason i asked is..... i remember seeing and talking with Steve and Jim Dyke when they were both with Spirt of Norway while on one of there many visits at Skater and a funny thing is... i worked on one of your old Canopy boats for Bobby Cousta which i think was a 46 or bigger and also one of the old Spirt Of Norway boats which had a very light layup .

[Ben]

Close he is in the next office

You have an office now? :D

What ever happened with the silver 46 with the BPMs you did a few years back? That was quite a boat.

[littlenige]

Few pics of the cougar that became Divin.

[northernoffshore]

Close he is in the next office, I am Pete Currington - Steve's buisness partner at Cougar Marine

could you guys pm me I have a question about some parts that need a mold. thanks jay.

[PJC]

could you guys pm me I have a question about some parts that need a mold. thanks jay.

pete@cougar-powerboats.com
44 1489 559549

[employyedBYAJroberts]

I worked for AJ and Steve Curtis during the 80's when we won the 85 Open Class race in Key West and he was a fine man. We dedicated that race to AJ's partner and dear friend Dick Fullam after Dick & Mike passed away just a day before that final race. Get your facts straight before disrespecting someone like that. I still see and work with Steve Curtis and I know the facts of what happened with our neighbors in North Miami Beach at the time you are mentioning and I can tell you that you are missing a lot of facts to the whole story.

[tango]

AND the Facts ARE ?

[FastDonzi]

AND the Facts ARE ?

Yeah, Do Tell, If you worked there I Know You, I worked there too.